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`(cid:44)(cid:49)(cid:55)(cid:40)(cid:53)(cid:49)(cid:36)(cid:55)(cid:44)(cid:50)(cid:49)(cid:36)(cid:47)(cid:3)(cid:55)(cid:53)(cid:36)(cid:39)(cid:40)(cid:3)(cid:38)(cid:50)(cid:48)(cid:48)(cid:44)(cid:54)(cid:54)(cid:44)(cid:50)(cid:49)(cid:3)
`
`(cid:44)(cid:81)(cid:3)(cid:87)(cid:75)(cid:72)(cid:3)(cid:48)(cid:68)(cid:87)(cid:87)(cid:72)(cid:85)(cid:3)(cid:82)(cid:73)(cid:29)
`(cid:38)(cid:40)(cid:53)(cid:55)(cid:36)(cid:44)(cid:49)(cid:3)(cid:48)(cid:50)(cid:37)(cid:44)(cid:47)(cid:40)(cid:3)(cid:40)(cid:47)(cid:40)(cid:38)(cid:55)(cid:53)(cid:50)(cid:49)(cid:44)(cid:38)(cid:3)(cid:39)(cid:40)(cid:57)(cid:44)(cid:38)(cid:40)(cid:54)
`(cid:36)(cid:49)(cid:39)(cid:3)(cid:53)(cid:36)(cid:39)(cid:44)(cid:50)(cid:3)(cid:41)(cid:53)(cid:40)(cid:52)(cid:56)(cid:40)(cid:49)(cid:38)(cid:60)(cid:3)(cid:36)(cid:49)(cid:39)(cid:3)(cid:51)(cid:53)(cid:50)(cid:38)(cid:40)(cid:54)(cid:54)(cid:44)(cid:49)(cid:42)
`(cid:38)(cid:50)(cid:48)(cid:51)(cid:50)(cid:49)(cid:40)(cid:49)(cid:55)(cid:54)(cid:3)(cid:55)(cid:43)(cid:40)(cid:53)(cid:40)(cid:50)(cid:41)(cid:3)(cid:11)(cid:44)(cid:44)(cid:12)
`
`(cid:12)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:44)(cid:81)(cid:89)(cid:72)(cid:86)(cid:87)(cid:76)(cid:74)(cid:68)(cid:87)(cid:76)(cid:82)(cid:81)(cid:3)(cid:49)(cid:82)(cid:17)(cid:29)(cid:3)
`(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:12)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:22)(cid:22)(cid:26)(cid:16)(cid:55)(cid:36)(cid:16)(cid:20)(cid:19)(cid:28)(cid:22)(cid:3)
`(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:12)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)
`(cid:12)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)
`
`(cid:50)(cid:51)(cid:40)(cid:49)(cid:3)(cid:54)(cid:40)(cid:54)(cid:54)(cid:44)(cid:50)(cid:49)(cid:54)(cid:3)
`
`(cid:51)(cid:68)(cid:74)(cid:72)(cid:86)(cid:29)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:20)(cid:28)(cid:24)(cid:22)(cid:3)(cid:177)(cid:3)(cid:21)(cid:21)(cid:26)(cid:19)(cid:3)(cid:11)(cid:90)(cid:76)(cid:87)(cid:75)(cid:3)(cid:72)(cid:91)(cid:70)(cid:72)(cid:85)(cid:83)(cid:87)(cid:86)(cid:12)
`(cid:51)(cid:79)(cid:68)(cid:70)(cid:72)(cid:29)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:58)(cid:68)(cid:86)(cid:75)(cid:76)(cid:81)(cid:74)(cid:87)(cid:82)(cid:81)(cid:15)(cid:3)(cid:39)(cid:17)(cid:38)(cid:17)(cid:3)
`(cid:39)(cid:68)(cid:87)(cid:72)(cid:29)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:55)(cid:88)(cid:72)(cid:86)(cid:71)(cid:68)(cid:92)(cid:15)(cid:3)(cid:54)(cid:72)(cid:83)(cid:87)(cid:72)(cid:80)(cid:69)(cid:72)(cid:85)(cid:3)(cid:21)(cid:24)(cid:15)(cid:3)(cid:21)(cid:19)(cid:20)(cid:27)(cid:3)
`
`(cid:36)(cid:70)(cid:72)(cid:16)(cid:41)(cid:72)(cid:71)(cid:72)(cid:85)(cid:68)(cid:79)(cid:3)(cid:53)(cid:72)(cid:83)(cid:82)(cid:85)(cid:87)(cid:72)(cid:85)(cid:86)(cid:15)(cid:3)(cid:44)(cid:81)(cid:70)(cid:17)(cid:3)
`Stenotype Reporters
`(cid:20)(cid:25)(cid:21)(cid:24)(cid:3)(cid:44)(cid:3)(cid:54)(cid:87)(cid:85)(cid:72)(cid:72)(cid:87)(cid:15)(cid:3)(cid:49)(cid:58)(cid:3)
`(cid:54)(cid:88)(cid:76)(cid:87)(cid:72)(cid:3)(cid:26)(cid:28)(cid:19)(cid:3)
`(cid:58)(cid:68)(cid:86)(cid:75)(cid:76)(cid:81)(cid:74)(cid:87)(cid:82)(cid:81)(cid:15)(cid:3)(cid:39)(cid:17)(cid:38)(cid:17)(cid:3)(cid:3)(cid:21)(cid:19)(cid:19)(cid:19)(cid:25)(cid:3)
`(cid:21)(cid:19)(cid:21)(cid:16)(cid:22)(cid:23)(cid:26)(cid:16)(cid:22)(cid:26)(cid:19)(cid:19)
`(cid:49)(cid:68)(cid:87)(cid:76)(cid:82)(cid:81)(cid:90)(cid:76)(cid:71)(cid:72)(cid:3)(cid:38)(cid:82)(cid:89)(cid:72)(cid:85)(cid:68)(cid:74)(cid:72)(cid:3)
`(cid:90)(cid:90)(cid:90)(cid:17)(cid:68)(cid:70)(cid:72)(cid:73)(cid:72)(cid:71)(cid:72)(cid:85)(cid:68)(cid:79)(cid:17)(cid:70)(cid:82)(cid:80)
`
`i
`
`INTEL 1337
`
`

`

`1953
`
`HEARING
`
`UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
`1
`BEFORE THE
`2
`INTERNATIONAL TRADE COMMISSION
`3
`4 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -x
`5 IN THE MATTER OF:
`:
`6 CERTAIN MOBILE ELECTRONIC DEVICES : Investigation No.
`7 AND RADIO FREQUENCY AND PROCESSING : 337-TA-1093
`8 COMPONENTS THEREOF (II)
`:
`9 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -x
`10
`11
`12
`13
`Tuesday, September 25, 2018
`14
`Courtroom C
`15
`U.S. International Trade
`16
`Commission
`17
`500 E Street SW
`18
`Washington, DC
`19
`The Hearing commenced, pursuant to notice of the Judge,
`20
`21 at 9:31 a.m., before the Honorable MaryJoan McNamara,
`22 Administrative Law Judge for the United States
`23 International Trade Commission.
`24
`25
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`2170
`
`1 signals down the line, as is shown here. And they are
`2 depicted as being separate signals in this figure.
`
`33
`
`Q Now, if we could go to CDX-3C.109. So even if Q Now, if we could go to CDX-3C.109. So even if
`
`4 Lee had a single RF input signal, and you have just
`4 Lee had a single RF input signal, and you have just
`5 explained to us why you don't think that's the case, would
`5 explained to us why you don't think that's the case, would
`6 the Lee reference satisfy the limitation that we're looking
`6 the Lee reference satisfy the limitation that we're looking
`7 at here, "the input RF signal employing carrier
`7 at here, "the input RF signal employing carrier
`8 aggregation"?
`8 aggregation"?
`9
`A
`No, it would not, because as I said a moment
`9
`A No, it would not, because as I said a moment
`10 ago, Lee is separate radios in a multiradio device, for
`10 ago, Lee is separate radios in a multiradio device, for
`11 Bluetooth and Wi-Fi. These signals are received, but they
`11 Bluetooth and Wi-Fi. These signals are received, but they
`12 are unrelated, and there's nothing taught in Lee about
`12 are unrelated, and there's nothing taught in Lee about
`13 creating a wider pipeline, send a signal data stream and
`13 creating a wider pipeline, send a signal data stream and
`14 aggregate it to increase the data rate.
`14 aggregate it to increase the data rate.
`15
`Q
`Okay. So then why is receiving a Bluetooth
`15
`Q Okay. So then why is receiving a Bluetooth
`16 signal and a Wi-Fi signal at the same time not carrier
`16 signal and a Wi-Fi signal at the same time not carrier
`17 aggregation?
`17 aggregation?
`18
`A Because nothing is combined together to increase
`18
`A
`Because nothing is combined together to increase
`19 the data rate.
`19 the data rate.
`20
`Q So does Lee refer to Bluetooth and Wi-Fi
`21 anywhere as carrier aggregation?
`22
`A No, he does not.
`23
`Q And does it use the phrase "carrier aggregation"
`24 at all?
`25
`A That phrase does not appear in Lee.
`
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`2174
`
`1 combining signals together to increase the aggregated data
`2 rate. That is not in Hirose.
`3
`Q Okay. Now, what did the PTO include about -- or
`4 conclude about the amendment to add carrier aggregation
`5 over the Hirose reference rejection?
`6
`A In -- in the file history, when that language
`7 was added, Hirose was overcome. That was the conclusion of
`8 the patent examiner.
`9
`Q
`Okay. So now, we just talked about the
`9
`Q Okay. So now, we just talked about the
`10 limitation that read in claim 1, "the input RF signal
`10 limitation that read in claim 1, "the input RF signal
`11 employing carrier aggregation."
`11 employing carrier aggregation."
`12
`Okay?
`12
`Okay?
`13
`Okay.
`A
`13
`A Okay.
`14
`Q
`So is that same limitation in claim 17?
`14
`Q So is that same limitation in claim 17?
`15
`A
`Yes, it is. It's claim 17 is the method claim
`15
`A Yes, it is. It's claim 17 is the method claim
`16 of claim 1.
`16 of claim 1.
`17
`Q
`Okay.
`17
`Q Okay.
`18
`A The apparatus of claim 1.
`18
`A
`The apparatus of claim 1.
`19
`Q
`Okay. I understand. So then the analysis that
`19
`Q Okay. I understand. So then the analysis that
`20 you just walked through regarding the limitation the input
`20 you just walked through regarding the limitation the input
`21 RF signal employing carrier aggregation, would that apply
`21 RF signal employing carrier aggregation, would that apply
`22 to claim 17 as well?
`22 to claim 17 as well?
`23
`A
`Yes, it would be the same analysis with the same
`23
`A Yes, it would be the same analysis with the same
`24 conclusion.
`24 conclusion.
`25
`Q Okay. Now I'd like to move to the second basis
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` 2189
`
`
`
` 1 JUDGE MC NAMARA: Please be seated.
`
` 2 Any time you are ready, Ms. Tallon.
`
` 3 MS. TALLON: Thank you, your Honor.
`
` 4 And we should be able to be on the public record
`
` 5 for the duration, which is about 2-1/2 hours -- no, I'm
`
` 6 kidding.
`
` 7 Don't worry, Dr. Foty. Hope you're feeling
`
` 8 better, sir.
`
` 9 THE WITNESS: I said that's the wrong question.
`
` 10 I am feeling better, but it will be a long time before I
`
` 11 get better.
`
` 12 CROSS-EXAMINATION
`
` 13 BY MS. TALLON:
`
` 14 Q I hope you get there soon.
`
` 15 Dr. Foty, I'm going to start with your opinion
`
` 16 on the '356 patent and Dr. Fay's opinion that the claims
`
` 17 are anticipated. Do you have that in mind?
`
` 18 A That's a good starting point.
`
` 19 Q Now, you testified on your direct with
`
` 20 Mr. Nelson that the Lee reference was before the Patent
`
` 21 Office during prosecution of the '356 patent; right?
`
` 22 A Lee appears on the face of the '356 patent, yes.
`
` 23 Q Correct. And I think I got this quote from you
`
` 24 right. I heard you say apparently the Patent Office
`
` 25 reached the conclusion that Lee and Winiecki taught away
`
`
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`

` 2190
`
`
`
` 1 from the '356 claims. Do I have that right?
`
` 2 A I had the quote right. I may have misspoken
`
` 3 something there. All I meant to say was they did have the
`
` 4 patent in front of them.
`
` 5 Q Lee and Winiecki were cited to the Patent Office
`
` 6 but never discussed by the examiner; right?
`
` 7 A As far as I know, that is correct.
`
` 8 Q Now, your dispute with Dr. Fay on the issue of
`8
`Q
`Now, your dispute with Dr. Fay on the issue of
`
` 9 the '356 patent anticipation concerns a single limitation
`9 the '356 patent anticipation concerns a single limitation
`
` 10 of claims 1 and 17; correct?
`10 of claims 1 and 17; correct?
`
` 11 A I believe that to be the case, yes.
`11
`A
`I believe that to be the case, yes.
`
` 12 Q And you do not otherwise dispute Dr. Fay's
`12
`Q
`And you do not otherwise dispute Dr. Fay's
`
` 13 conclusion that Lee satisfies the elements of claims 1 and
`13 conclusion that Lee satisfies the elements of claims 1 and
`
` 14 17; right?
`14 17; right?
`
` 15 A Other than what I've cited, I do not contest
`15
`A
`Other than what I've cited, I do not contest
`
` 16 that.
`16 that.
`
` 17 Q And specifically, you dispute that Lee discloses
`17
`Q
`And specifically, you dispute that Lee discloses
`
` 18 the input signal employing carrier aggregation; right?
`18 the input signal employing carrier aggregation; right?
`
` 19 A I believe the full phrase is "the input RF
`19
`A
`I believe the full phrase is "the input RF
`
` 20 signal." Whatever the phrase I quoted in my testimony a
`20 signal." Whatever the phrase I quoted in my testimony a
`
` 21 few moments ago was the one I am referring to, yes.
`21 few moments ago was the one I am referring to, yes.
`
` 22 Q Right. I may have misspoke, so let me make sure
`22
`Q
`Right. I may have misspoke, so let me make sure
`
` 23 I get the record right. You dispute that Lee discloses the
`23 I get the record right. You dispute that Lee discloses the
`
` 24 input RF signal employing carrier aggregation; right?
`24 input RF signal employing carrier aggregation; right?
`
` 25 A I dispute that, yes.
`25
`A
`I dispute that, yes.
`
`
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`
` 2191
`
`
`
` 1 Q Now, in coming to that conclusion, you relied on
`
` 2 the agreed-upon construction of carrier aggregation;
`
` 3 correct?
`
` 4 A Are you referring to the time in my reports?
`
` 5 Q I am.
`
` 6 A At the time in my reports, the only construction
`
` 7 we had available was the proposed constructions. The
`
` 8 Markman order had not been issued yet.
`
` 9 Q And the agreed-upon construction that you relied
`
` 10 on in forming your opinions included the requirement
`
` 11 "increases bandwidth for a wireless device." Correct?
`
` 12 A That's my recollection of what the agreed
`
` 13 construction was prior to the issuance of the Markman
`
` 14 order, yes.
`
` 15 Q So when you formed the conclusion in your mind
`
` 16 that Lee does not disclose carrier aggregation, the
`
` 17 construction that you applied was "simultaneous operation
`
` 18 on multiple carriers that increases bandwidth for a
`
` 19 wireless device." Right?
`
` 20 A At the time, as I said at some point earlier,
`
` 21 the definition of bandwidth being higher data rate, with
`
` 22 that reservation I stated earlier, yes, that was the
`
` 23 construction. Only one any of us had at the time.
`
` 24 Q Right. Now, you testified last week that the
`
` 25 claims governed your analysis in this case; right?
`
`
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` 2192
`
`
`
` 1 A That's my understanding, yes.
`
` 2 Q And you would agree that her Honor's claim
`
` 3 constructions also govern the analysis here; correct?
`
` 4 A The Markman order governs that, yes.
`
` 5 Q Now, you didn't mention the claim construction
`
` 6 order in this case on your direct testimony with
`
` 7 Mr. Nelson; right?
`
` 8 A I don't recall reviewing it specifically, no.
`
` 9 But I did consider it in my opinions.
`
` 10 Q If we could turn, please, to -- this is going to
`
` 11 be at volume 2, tab 5 of your binder. And it's RDX-19.33C,
`
` 12 please. We'll pull it up on the screen as well.
`
` 13 And you may recall, this is a demonstrative from
`
` 14 Dr. Fay's testimony yesterday; right?
`
` 15 A I beg your pardon, which page are you referring
`
` 16 to in that tab?
`
` 17 Q Tab 5, and it's slide 33, 19.33.
`
` 18 A I have that. I'm at that page, thank you.
`
` 19 Q Okay. And this slide shows her Honor's
`
` 20 construction of the claim term "carrier aggregation";
`
` 21 correct?
`
` 22 A This is part of the Markman order, yes.
`
` 23 Q Right. And it shows the construction of the
`
` 24 claim term "carrier aggregation"; right?
`
` 25 A It shows the construction of the phrase, but not
`
`
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`
` 2193
`
`
`
` 1 the supporting discussion of it in the Markman order.
`
` 2 Q And the construction of the phrase "carrier
`
` 3 aggregation" is "simultaneous operation on multiple
`
` 4 carriers"; correct?
`
` 5 A That is the phrase we see, yes.
`
` 6 Q Now, the construction says nothing about
`
` 7 increasing bandwidth; right? We don't see that in the
`
` 8 language?
`
` 9 A The rest of the Markman order discusses that.
`
` 10 Q I'm asking you about the claim construction.
`
` 11 Can we focus on that, please. The claim construction --
`
` 12 and my microphone is cutting off, Carmen.
`
` 13 A That's me, I'm sorry.
`
` 14 JUDGE MC NAMARA: It's Mr. Nelson's as well --
`
` 15 THE WITNESS: Mr. Nelson is right, I should lean
`
` 16 back from the microphone and your microphone will work.
`
` 17 Don't ask me, I don't know.
`
` 18 MS. TALLON: If I can't be heard, please let me
`
` 19 know, I'm happy to repeat.
`
` 20 BY MS. TALLON:
`
` 21 Q Now, I want to make sure we're focusing on the
`
` 22 claim construction, because that's what you had to apply in
`
` 23 your analysis; right?
`
` 24 A I had to apply the entire Markman order, yes.
`
` 25 Q And you had to apply the construction of carrier
`
`
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`
` 2194
`
`
`
` 1 aggregation that we see here on slide 33C?
`
` 2 A That was part of it.
`
` 3 Q Well, when you applied the claims, claim 1 and
`
` 4 claim 17 of the '356 patent, you had to substitute
`
` 5 simultaneous operation on multiple carriers for the phrase
`
` 6 "carrier aggregation"; true?
`
` 7 A Again, the entire Markman order must be
`
` 8 considered.
`
` 9 Q So are you saying that you did not apply
`
` 10 simultaneous operation on multiple carriers in and of
`
` 11 itself as the claim construction for carrier aggregation?
`
` 12 A I applied it as construed in the Markman order,
`
` 13 yes.
`
` 14 Q And that construction is simultaneous operation
`
` 15 on multiple carriers; correct?
`
` 16 A Simultaneous operation on multiple carriers.
`
` 17 Q Okay. And the construction, just focusing on
`
` 18 the claim construction that her Honor provided for carrier
`
` 19 aggregation, that does not have a reference to increased
`
` 20 bandwidth or data rate; correct?
`
` 21 A The rest of the Markman order does.
`
` 22 Q Sir, I really would like you to focus on my
`
` 23 question, okay? Simultaneous operation on multiple
`
` 24 carriers, that's the claim construction for carrier
`
` 25 aggregation; right?
`
`
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`
` 2195
`
`
`
` 1 A That's what's written in front, yes.
`
` 2 Q That is the claim construction; correct?
`
` 3 A That's from the Markman order.
`
` 4 Q And it's the claim construction? Yes?
`
` 5 A This is the phrase used, yes, we see here.
`
` 6 Q And it does not include any reference to
`
` 7 increased bandwidth or data rate. We can agree on that.
`
` 8 It's not there; right?
`
` 9 A It's not here. It's in the rest of the Markman
`
` 10 order.
`
` 11 Q Okay. Now, in your view, bandwidth tends to be
`
` 12 equivalent to data rate; right?
`
` 13 A One of the definitions of bandwidth, which is
`
` 14 probably the most common one used today, is increased
`
` 15 bandwidth refers to higher data rate, yes.
`
` 16 Q Now, you had offered the opinion that Lee does
`
` 17 not disclose carrier aggregation because the signals in Lee
`
` 18 each originate from a different source; right?
`
` 19 A That was part of my opinion, yes.
`
` 20 Q And the construction of carrier aggregation that
`
` 21 her Honor has provided does not include the words
`
` 22 "originating from a single source," does it?
`
` 23 A Not on its face.
`
` 24 Q Okay. Now I'd like to turn to your opinions on
`
` 25 carrier aggregation and dig into those a little bit more,
`
`
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` 2196
`
`
`
` 1 if we could.
`
` 2 Now, you testified last week about multicarrier
`
` 3 operations.
`
` 4 Do you recall that?
`
` 5 A Yes, I do.
`
` 6 Q Now, you'd agree that Bluetooth is one wireless
`
` 7 technology that transmits information; right?
`
` 8 A Bluetooth is such a technology on its own, yes.
`
` 9 Q And Wi-Fi is another wireless technology that
`
` 10 transmits information; correct?
`
` 11 A It's another technology, yes.
`
` 12 Q Okay. Do you need a moment to get a mint or --
`
` 13 A If I don't do that, I'll cough and we're done.
`
` 14 So please, let me load mints as best I can.
`
` 15 Q Oh, please, if you need a break.
`
` 16 A I don't need a break, I just need to load a
`
` 17 mint. Thank you.
`
` 18 Q Bluetooth is one radio frequency technology;
`18
`Q
`Bluetooth is one radio frequency technology;
`
` 19 correct?
`19 correct?
`
` 20 A Bluetooth is a radio technology, yes.
`20
`A
`Bluetooth is a radio technology, yes.
`
` 21 Q And Wi-Fi is another radio technology; right?
`21
`Q
`And Wi-Fi is another radio technology; right?
`
` 22 A That's a fair assessment, yes.
`22
`A
`That's a fair assessment, yes.
`
` 23 Q So we can agree that Bluetooth signals are sent
`23
`Q
`So we can agree that Bluetooth signals are sent
`
` 24 on carriers; correct?
`24 on carriers; correct?
`
` 25 A Bluetooth communicates on channels, which I
`25
`A
`Bluetooth communicates on channels, which I
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` 1 guess you could call carriers.
`1 guess you could call carriers.
`
` 2 Q The same for Wi-Fi. Wi-Fi communicates on
`2
`Q
`The same for Wi-Fi. Wi-Fi communicates on
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` 3 carriers; correct?
`3 carriers; correct?
`
` 4 A It communicates on carriers, yes.
`4
`A
`It communicates on carriers, yes.
`
` 5 Q Now, you have distinguished carrier aggregation
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` 6 from multicarrier operations; right?
`
` 7 A I believe I have, yes.
`
` 8 Q And I want to explore that a little bit, if I
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` 9 could. And specifically, you testified that multicarrier
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` 10 operation does not increase the aggregate data rate of a
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` 11 device.
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` 12 Do you recall that?
`
` 13 A I'll take your word for it at this point.
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` 14 Q This was in your testimony last week. Does that
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` 15 sound right to you?
`
` 16 A It sounds right to me, yes.
`
` 17 Q And I'd like to pull up, if we could, one of
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` 18 your demonstratives, and this is CDX-3C.6, and this would
`
` 19 be in volume 2, tab 7 of your binders. We also have it on
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` 20 the screen.
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` 21 Do you recognize this slide from your
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` 22 presentation?
`
` 23 A Are you referring to figure 6 here?
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` 24 Q Yes, this is page 6 of CX-3C, and this is from
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` 25 your presentation.
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` 1 Do you recall this?
`
` 2 A Yes, I do.
`
` 3 Q Okay. And you used this demonstrative to
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` 4 compare the aggregate data rates of single carrier
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` 5 operation and carrier aggregation; is that right?
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` 6 A That is correct.
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` 7 Q And if we look at CDX-3C.6, the green bars that
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` 8 we see on the right, those represent the total data that is
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` 9 transmitted; is that right?
`
` 10 A I believe the animation filled those up, so
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` 11 it's --
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` 12 Q Excuse me, go ahead.
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` 13 A I believe the way the animation ran is it filled
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` 14 those up and showed the carrier aggregation situation in
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` 15 the lower part filling up faster than the single carrier in
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` 16 the top.
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` 17 Q And when they're filled, that represents the
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` 18 total data that has been transmitted; right?
`
` 19 A It represents the -- in this animation,
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` 20 represents the complete arrival of the data that's been
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` 21 sent from the base station to the wireless device, yes.
`
` 22 Q Okay, fair enough. If we go to the next slide,
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` 23 3C.7, this was a demonstrate that you used to compare the
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` 24 aggregate data rates of multicarrier operation with carrier
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` 25 aggregation; right?
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` 1 A Again, that's my recollection and again, this
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` 2 was an animation.
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` 3 Q If we stay on this slide, again the bars we see
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` 4 on the right, the vertical stacks of bars, those represent
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` 5 the data that's transmitted once you fill it up in your
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` 6 animation; correct?
`
` 7 A In the animation, as in the previous one, those
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` 8 are filled up vertically to indicate the arrival of the
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` 9 data and the complete arrival of a file or so forth that's
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` 10 being sent.
`
` 11 Q Okay. And you used your animations on this
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` 12 slide 3C.7 and the prior slide 3C.6 to show data being
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` 13 transmitted over some given period of time; is that right?
`
` 14 A I believe that's correct, yes.
`
` 15 Q And on both of them, more data, both of them,
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` 16 meaning both slides, to be clear, more data was transmitted
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` 17 in the given amount of time using carrier aggregation as
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` 18 opposed to the other method that you were showing; is that
`
` 19 right?
`
` 20 A Actually, what it showed is the -- in this
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` 21 particular slide, it showed that the file being sent was
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` 22 coming twice as fast because it was being split up. That's
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` 23 what the animation showed.
`
` 24 Q Okay. Now, if we look at both of them together,
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` 25 I'm not sure if we're able to put them up together, this is
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`1 CDX-3C.6 and 7 together. There we go. Are we able to run
`2 them together too well? I'm asking too much. I might have
`3 gone a bridge too far.
`4
`Well, your demonstrative showed that more data
`5 was transmitted in a period of time using multicarrier
`6 operation than using single carrier operation. Would you
`7 agree with that?
`8
`A What's shown here is that one file is coming
`9 over in a time T, and in the carrier aggregation situation
`10 and in the multicarrier situation two files are being
`11 transmitted and the two files are arriving in twice the
`12 time as the video in the carrier aggregation situation.
`13
`Q And if you consider the multicarrier example
`14 that you have here and the single carrier example that you
`15 had on slide 6, the multicarrier example is transmitting
`16 more data more quickly. Would you agree?
`17
`A I would not agree with that, no.
`18
`Q Would you agree it's transmitting more data in
`19 the same period of time?
`20
`A I would agree that it's transmitting two
`21 different files in two different pipes. So two different
`22 files are being transmitted at the same rate as the single
`23 carrier case. There happens to be two of them.
`24
`Q And in the single carrier case, you would only
`25 have one piece of data or one file; correct?
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` 1 A That's what the single carrier case does, yes.
`
` 2 Q I want to look at the patent now, if we could,
`
` 3 the '356 patent. This is JX-1, and you will find it at tab
`
` 4 8 in your binder, volume 2. And in particular, I'd like to
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` 5 turn to column 2, lin