9/1/2015
`1 (Pages 1 to 4)
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` WILMER CUTLER PICKERING HALE AND DORR, LLP
` (by Jason H. Liss, Esq.)
` 60 State Street
` Boston, Massachusetts 02106
` (617) 526-6699
` jason.liss@wilmerhale.com
` for Cisco Systems, Inc. and AVAYA Inc.
`
`STUART STUBBLEBINE, PH.D.
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`08:21:02
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`1
` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`Case IPR2014-01366
`Patent 6,108,704 C1
`- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
`SAMSUNG ELECTRONICS CO., LTD., SAMSUNG
`ELECTRONICS AMERICA, INC., SAMSUNG
`TELECOMMUNICATIONS AMERICA, LLC CISCO
`SYSTEMS, INC., and AVAYA, INC.,
` Petitioner,
` v.
`STRAIGHT PATH IP GROUP, INC.,
` Patent Owner.
`- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
` DEPOSITION OF STUART STUBBLEBINE, Ph.D., a
`witness called by and on behalf of the
`Petitioners, taken pursuant to 37 C.F.R. 42.53,
`before Daria L. Romano, RPR, CRR and Notary
`Public in and for the Commonwealth of
`Massachusetts, at Mintz Levin Cohn Ferris
`Glovsky and Popeo P.C., One Financial Center,
`Boston, Massachusetts, on Tuesday, September 1,
`2015, commencing at 9:04 a.m. to p.m.
`
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`
` I N D E X
`Deposition of: Page
`STUART STUBBLEBINE, Ph.D.
`By Mr. Erickson 5
`By Mr. Newman 86
`
` E X H I B I T S
`No. Page
`Exhibit 1001 Patent 6,108,704 7
`Exhibit 2023 Declaration of Dr. Stuart
` Stubblebine 6
`
`*Original exhibits returned to Mr. Erickson
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`A P P E A R A N C E S:
`
` DLA PIPER LLP (US)
` (by Brian K. Erickson, Esq.)
` 401 Congress Avenue
` Suite 2500
` Austin, Texas 78701-3799
` (512) 457-7000
` brian.erickson@dlapiper.com
` for Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.,
` Samsung Electronics America, Inc., and
` Samsung Telecommunications America, LLC.
`
` MINTZ LEVIN COHN FERRIS GLOVSKY
` AND POPEO P.C.
` (by Michael C. Newman, Esq.)
` One Financial Center
` Boston, Massachusetts 02111
` (617) 542-6000
` mcnewman@mintz.com
` for Straight Path IP Group, Inc.
`
`US LEGAL SUPPORT
`713.653.7100
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`Samsung Ex. 1036
`Samsung v. Straight Path, IPR2014-01367, page 1
`
`

`
`STUART STUBBLEBINE, PH.D.
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` P R O C E E D I N G S
` MR. ERICKSON: For the record, per
`our prior agreement, we've agreed that this will
`be one consolidated deposition for all three
`IPRs. So the testimony given today can be used
`in IPRs 2014-01366, 01367, and 01368.
` And if we refer to the asserted
`patents in plural, we're referring to the '704
`patent, '121 patent, and the '469 patent.
` Counsel, do you have anything to add
`to that?
` MR. NEWMAN: No, I affirm that
`that's our agreement.
`
` STUART STUBBLEBINE, Ph.D.
`
`a witness having been satisfactorily identified
`by the production of a driver's license, was
`first duly sworn, was examined and testified as
`follows:
`
` DIRECT EXAMINATION
`BY MR. ERICKSON:
` Q. Good morning, Dr. Stubblebine.
` A. Good morning.
`
`6
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` Q. Since 2000, what percentage of -- let
`me withdraw that.
` Is there any reason why you can't give
`your full and complete best testimony today?
` A. No.
` Q. Okay. Since 2000, approximately how
`much of your income is derived from expert
`consulting?
` A. 2000. That's tough to gauge. Do you
`have a copy of my declaration which has my CV?
` MR. ERICKSON: Let's go ahead and
`mark this.
` (Exhibit 2023 marked
` for identification)
`BY MR. ERICKSON:
` Q. For the record, what you've been
`handed has been marked as deposition
`Exhibit 2023. It's also the Exhibit 2023
`submitted in the 1366 IPR which is your
`declaration related to the '704 patent.
` A. Are you referring to time or income?
` Q. Income.
` (Pause)
` A. It's tough to guess. I've never made
`such a calculation. It would be a guess if I
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`US LEGAL SUPPORT
`713.653.7100
`
`9/1/2015
`2 (Pages 5 to 8)
`7
`
`came up with a number.
` Q. All right. And to your knowledge, is
`this a complete list of all the cases in which
`you've served as an expert witness since 2000?
` A. This is a little bit out of date.
` The RSA matter is completed, so is the
`T-Mobile matter. And then there's an additional
`matter with Nomatics where I've had multiple
`declarations, or at least one.
` I'm trying to think if there's
`anything else. That's all I can think of. So
`it's just more of the most current is what would
`be out of date.
` Q. Okay. I'm going to hand you a copy of
`the '704 patent.
` MR. ERICKSON: Can you mark that as
`Exhibit 1001.
` (Exhibit 1001 marked
` for identification)
`BY MR. ERICKSON:
` Q. So most of our time today will be
`spent on these two exhibits, so keep those two
`handy.
` And first I want to direct you to
`paragraph 33 of your declaration on the '704
`
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`patent.
` A. I've got a clean copy of the '704
`where the pages are just a little bit larger.
` Q. Okay.
` A. I've just compared the two, and
`they're the same.
` Q. Okay. If that's easier for you to
`read, that's fine.
` A. The print is a little bit larger.
` Q. Okay.
` A. And the same thing with the '121.
` Q. Okay.
` A. I haven't compared it since you
`haven't handed that to me.
` Q. Okay.
` A. Paragraph 33?
` Q. Correct.
` The first sentence is, "I agree with
`Straight Path's interpretation of 'connected to
`the computer network' and 'online' as meaning
`available for communication."
` Do you see that sentence?
` A. Yes.
` Q. So in your opinion, the meaning of
`those two quoted phrases is available for
`
`Samsung Ex. 1036
`Samsung v. Straight Path, IPR2014-01367, page 2
`
`

`
`STUART STUBBLEBINE, PH.D.
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`communication?
` A. In the context of the asserted patents
`using those phrases, yes.
` Q. Okay. Turn to the '704 patent, column
`five. If you go to line 20 of column five, you
`see it states, "When either of processing units
`12, 22 logs onto the Internet via a dialup
`connection, a respective unit is provided a
`dynamically allocated IP address by a connection
`service provider."
` Do you see that?
` A. Yes.
` Q. Okay. So when the processing unit
`first logs onto the Internet and prior to
`receiving its IP address, is that processing
`unit available for communication?
` A. Which particular claim are you
`referring to?
` Q. This is claim one.
` (Pause)
` A. The claim one with respect to
`connected to the computer network or online
`relates, for example, to the first limitation
`where it's computer usable medium having program
`code embodied in the medium, the program code
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`comprising, and then now the part that I want to
`discuss, program code for transmitting to the
`server, a network protocol address received by
`the first process following connection to the
`computer network.
` So what's required here with respect
`to connected to the computer network and my
`agreement with the interpretation meaning
`available for communication here is you have --
`you would require the first process to have
`received the protocol address and following
`connection to the computer network, and then
`that code is transmitted to the server.
` So we see that -- like in lines 27, we
`see the first processing unit which has a
`process, and we see the transmission of E mail
`address and associated allocated IP address to
`the connection server on 26 going down through
`line I guess around 28 of column five.
` And so this is the point where that
`maps to the first claim limitation of -- that
`first aspect, the claim limitation which we were
`just talking about with respect to -- basically
`the way I interpret this is exactly what it
`says. And so it's at that point -- that's the
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`US LEGAL SUPPORT
`713.653.7100
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`9/1/2015
`3 (Pages 9 to 12)
`11
`point, for example, where the connection server
`stores the address in the database and so on.
`That's the point when the -- that's the point
`when the connection server recognizes that the
`first process is online.
` Provided, though, provided that when
`we talk about online in the context of '704, it
`goes hand in hand always with the ability to
`manage -- the ability to track and manage
`offline signals or messages that's described in
`column six where when user logs off or goes
`offline from the Internet 24, the connection
`server 26 updates the status of the user in the
`database.
` So the point is, yes, there's an
`online point there, but it goes hand in hand
`with managing the notion of offline.
` Q. Okay. I want to try to parse that out
`a little bit.
` When processing unit 12 logs on the
`Internet but before it receives its dynamically
`allocated IP address, is the processing unit
`connected to the network?
` A. We have to look at connected to the
`network in the context of the claims. And so I
`
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`interpreted or basically agreed with Straight
`Path's interpretation of connect to the network,
`and online means available for communication.
` And I took that in the context of the
`claim where the activity which I just described
`took place, and that's basically where that
`activity takes place.
` Q. In claim one, is the first process
`connected to the network prior to receiving the
`protocol address?
` (Pause)
` A. Claim one requires that the program
`code transmits to the server or network protocol
`address received by the first process following
`connection to the network.
` Can you repeat your question, please?
` Q. Yes. In claim one, is the first
`process connected to the computer network before
`it receives a network protocol address?
` A. I'm not aware of an embodiment where
`that's the situation.
` Q. Is it required by the claim?
` A. The first process has to have received
`the network protocol address following
`connection to the computer network.
`
`Samsung Ex. 1036
`Samsung v. Straight Path, IPR2014-01367, page 3
`
`

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`STUART STUBBLEBINE, PH.D.
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` Q. And you're not aware of any embodiment
`that satisfies that limitation?
` A. I think you misinterpreted what I
`said. I mean, there are embodiments in the
`specification that satisfy these limitations.
` Q. Is there an embodiment disclosed in
`the '704 patent where the first process is
`connected to the computer network before it
`receives its network protocol address?
` (Pause)
` A. I'm not aware of an embodiment.
` Q. Going back to claim one.
` Claim one requires that the first
`process be connected to the computer network
`before it receives its network protocol address,
`correct?
` A. I'm sorry, it what?
` Q. Claim one requires that the first
`process be connected to the computer network
`before it receives its network protocol address,
`correct?
` (Pause)
` A. It says basically that there's code
`that -- there's program code for transmitting to
`the server a network protocol address received
`
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`by the first process following connection to the
`computer network.
` Q. Does that limitation require in your
`opinion that the first process be connected to
`the computer network before it receives its
`network protocol address?
` (Pause)
` A. It requires that following connection
`to the computer network, the program code
`transmits to the server network protocol address
`received by the first process.
` So at some point following connection
`to the computer network, there's a transmission
`of the protocol address received by the first
`process.
` Q. All right. So I understand it's your
`opinion that the transmission occurs after
`connection to the computer network, but my
`question is slightly different. My question is
`does claim one require that the first process be
`connected to the computer network before it
`receives its network protocol address?
` A. I just simply see the requirement that
`following -- following connection to the
`computer network -- yeah, basically the
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`US LEGAL SUPPORT
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`9/1/2015
`4 (Pages 13 to 16)
`15
`requirement I see is the limitation explicitly
`of what's there, that there's a transmission of
`the network protocol address received by the
`first process following connection to the
`computer network.
` Q. This clause we've been repeating has
`three verbs, transmitting, received and
`following -- sorry, transmitting, received,
`following connection, at least.
` And I understand your testimony,
`please correct me if I'm wrong, I understand
`your testimony that in your opinion, the
`transmitting has to occur after the first
`process is connected to the computer network; is
`that correct?
` A. I'm sorry, can you repeat that? Just
`repeat what you said.
` Q. In your opinion, the transmitting has
`to occur following -- I'm sorry. Let me
`rephrase that.
` The transmitting occurs after the
`first process is connected to the computer
`network, correct?
` A. I discuss this whole issue in
`paragraph 35 of my report where I say, "The
`
`16
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`claims require a network protocol address
`received 'following connection to the computer
`network.' If a computer is not considered
`'connected to the network' until it is
`'registered with a server,' then the computer
`would need to receive its network protocol
`address after it registered with the server.
`But in order to register with a server, the
`computer must already have its network protocol
`address. Thus," I go on to say, "if the term
`'connected to the computer network' / 'online'
`is construed to mean 'registered with a server'
`then either," I go on to talk, "neither WINS nor
`NetBIOS disclose the claim element 'a network
`protocol address received by the first process
`following connection to the computer network'
`because neither reference teaches 'a network
`protocol address received by the first process
`following registration with the server.'"
` Q. Are you finished? I don't want to cut
`you off.
` A. Just give me one second.
` Q. Okay.
` (Pause)
` A. Okay.
`
`Samsung Ex. 1036
`Samsung v. Straight Path, IPR2014-01367, page 4
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`

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` Q. So the second sentence in paragraph 35
`which states in your declaration "The claims
`require a network protocol address received
`'following connection to the computer network.'"
` Is it your opinion that claim one
`requires that the first process be connected to
`the computer network before it receives the
`network protocol address?
` (Pause)
` A. The aspect of whether -- the aspect of
`connected to the computer network relates to
`this connection server managing -- basically
`being able to -- basically being able to provide
`a network protocol address of the second process
`from the server when the second process is
`connected to the computer network. And so from
`the context of the first process or any
`process -- basically, at least with respect to
`the first process.
` The second process would had to have
`provided -- basically the network protocol
`address of the second process would had to have
`been provided when the second process is
`connected to the computer network.
` Q. My question right now is just focused
`
`18
`
`on the first process and the order, if any,
`that's required by claim one between the first
`process becoming connected to the computer
`network and the first process receiving its
`network protocol address.
` And so I just want to know your
`opinion on whether the claims require that the
`first process be connected to the computer
`network before receiving the network protocol
`address?
` A. I guess my point is that this notion
`of connected to the computer network and online
`with respect to being available for
`communication, you can look at this from the
`perspective of the entity.
` If the server hasn't received the
`network protocol address, for example, of a
`process such as the second process, then you
`have a scenario that at least from the
`perspective of the server, you can have an
`aspect where it appears that the first process
`is not online from the perspective of the
`server.
` So I think with respect to your
`question, kind of looking at the perspectives of
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`US LEGAL SUPPORT
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`
`9/1/2015
`5 (Pages 17 to 20)
`19
`the entities in the system is relevant when you
`look at the different uses of online and
`connected to the network in this claim.
` Q. Do you have an opinion as to whether
`claim one requires that the first process be
`connected to the computer network before it
`receives its network protocol address?
` A. The claim -- I don't believe I
`expressed an opinion like that in my
`declaration. I didn't express -- basically what
`I expressed was I think what I read you and
`wrote in paragraphs 33, 34, that section and
`then the following section and possibly
`elsewhere, and I'm looking at just simply what's
`required of the claim limitations.
` And I'm also adding that you really
`need to look at -- when you look at these terms,
`you need to look at the perspective of the
`entities -- the limitations and the entities
`involved.
` Q. The limitation that states a network
`protocol address received by the first process
`following connection to the computer network,
`which perspective is applicable to that
`limitation?
`
`20
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` MR. NEWMAN: Objection.
` (Pause)
` A. There's a couple of aspects going on
`here in that you have an embodiment; for
`example, in column five where a dynamically
`allocated IP address is provided by a connection
`service provider. And the first processing unit
`in column five, line 27 automatically transmits
`its associated E mail address and it's
`dynamically allocated IP address to the
`connection server at 26.
` The connection server then stores the
`address and database and time stamps the stored
`address using a timer thus establishing -- the
`first user operating the first processing unit
`is thus 12, so I'm just reading from the patent,
`is thus established in the database 34 as an
`active online party available for communication
`using disclosed point-to-point communications.
` And so from the perspective of -- from
`the perspective of the server, at this point
`when you've been established as an active online
`party available for communication using the
`disclosed point-to-point Internet protocol, at
`that point also in conjunction with managing
`
`Samsung Ex. 1036
`Samsung v. Straight Path, IPR2014-01367, page 5
`
`

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`STUART STUBBLEBINE, PH.D.
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`when the first process goes offline, as I
`discussed previously, that's the point where
`you're online and available -- you're available
`for communications with respect to the network
`for point-to-point communications. Prior to
`that, at least from the server perspective, you
`aren't.
` Q. When you say "prior to that," which
`event specifically are you referring to?
` A. What I just described.
` Q. You described an awful lot. I'm
`trying to determine from the server's
`perspective at what point is the first process
`connected to the network?
` A. As I discussed, I just discussed, I
`can repeat part of it, but part of it is the
`first user operating the first processing unit
`12 is thus established in the database 34 as an
`active online party available for communication
`using the disclosed point-to-point Internet
`protocol, which goes hand in hand with the
`server -- the claims also managing when the user
`is offline as well as I discussed previously.
` Q. Okay. From the perspective of the
`first process, at what point is the first
`
`22
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`process connected to the computer network?
` (Pause)
` A. With respect to claim one, the basic
`structure is -- basically includes this query as
`to whether a process is connected to the
`computer network according to the server.
` And so if we just look at what's
`required in claim one, the perspective that
`counts here with respect to the query and
`receiving network protocol address limitation,
`and further on, the program code responsive to
`the network protocol address of the second
`process for establishing a point-to-point, the
`perspective comes down to obtaining an online --
`basically an online or -- online notion from the
`server of the claims.
` And that's what the first process
`relies on from the server with respect to a
`process at which it wishes to communicate with.
` Q. Well, there's certainly many aspects
`of this claim that deal with when the second
`process is connected to the network and all that
`flows from that.
` But my question is, again, not
`directed to whether the second process is
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`US LEGAL SUPPORT
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`9/1/2015
`6 (Pages 21 to 24)
`23
`connected and what indications may be taken for
`that or queries should be made of that. My
`question is more limited. My question is
`different.
` My question is just directed from the
`perspective of the first process, when is the
`first process connected to the computer network?
` MR. NEWMAN: I'm sorry, could I
`have that question back?
` (Record read)
` (Pause)
` A. Give me a second. I want to look at
`the patent and see if it refers to some examples
`on this.
` (Pause)
` A. So I'm partway through looking at
`this, but some other aspects that relate to this
`question is that the first -- there is
`embodiments where -- for example, in column six,
`when user logs off or goes offline from the
`Internet 24 the connection server updates the
`status of the user in the database. And
`accordingly, offline users are effectively
`disabled from making and/or receiving
`point-to-point Internet communications. So you
`
`24
`also have this aspect even of the user logging
`off or going offline from the Internet and the
`connection server updating the status in the
`database.
` So I would say if that scenario takes
`place, then the first process would -- that
`would be an embodiment where the first process
`would not be connected. It basically would
`effectively be disabled from making and/or
`receiving point-to-point Internet communications
`and, hence, would be -- would not be online.
` Q. Going back to the embodiment disclosed
`in column five at line 20.
` A. Okay.
` Q. In the context of claim one, when the
`processing unit 12 logs onto the Internet via a
`dialup connection, is it at that point before it
`receives its IP address connected to the
`network?
` A. Again, if you look at it from the
`perspective of -- if you look at the embodiment,
`for example, you show at least from the server
`perspective of being established as active and
`online, available for communication using
`disclosed point-to-point communication protocol
`
`Samsung Ex. 1036
`Samsung v. Straight Path, IPR2014-01367, page 6
`
`

`
`STUART STUBBLEBINE, PH.D.
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`which basically is -- occurs after storing the
`address in the database with respect to this
`embodiment.
` Q. Claim one refers to the computer
`network several times. Each of the program code
`limitations ends with a reference to the
`computer network, and the preamble introduces
`the term a computer network.
` Are all of the references to computer
`network referring to the same computer network?
` (Pause)
` A. The preamble mentions a computer
`network, and the limitations refer to the
`computer network.
` One would understand that a computer
`network is typically composed of multiple
`networks connected together, multiple networks
`connected together. That's just a little bit of
`a background to understand what computer network
`is.
` Q. Okay. And do the first references of
`the computer network in claim one refer to the
`same network?
` (Pause)
` A. So it shows that there is at least a
`
`26
`computer network which has each one of these
`characteristics associated with each one of the
`limitations.
` Q. And in your opinion, is connected to
`the computer network the same concept as claimed
`in the first program code limitation and the --
`well, let me withdraw that.
` You see in the first program code
`limitation it refers to the first process being
`connected to the computer network. I'm
`paraphrasing, but do you see that concept?
` A. Yes, the first aspect of the
`limitation.
` Q. And then in the second program code
`limitation it discusses the second process being
`connected to the computer network. Do you see
`that?
` A. There's the program code for
`receiving, the one before that is for
`transmitting, and the one before that is also
`transmitting to the server.
` So one's transmitting to the server
`network protocol address; one's transmitting to
`server query; and one is for receiving network
`protocol address.
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`US LEGAL SUPPORT
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`27
`
` Q. Okay. Where claim one refers to
`connected to the computer network, is it
`referring to the same concept each time?
` MR. NEWMAN: Objection. Form.
`BY MR. ERICKSON:
` Q. I'll withdraw that.
` In claim one, where it's referring to
`connected to the computer network, should that
`phrase be construed consistently in each
`instance?
` (Pause)
` A. I notice that the claim construction
`that I opined on was connected to the network.
`And I notice you're referring to connection to
`the network as opposed to connected to the
`computer network.
` Q. Okay.
`