Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 1 of 12 PageID# 27313
`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 1 of 12 PagelD# 27313
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`EXHIBIT 10
`EXHIBIT 10
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 1 of 12 PagelD# 27313
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 2 of 12 PageID# 27314
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`CONFIDENTIAL
`Transcript of Jeffrey Suhling, Ph.D.
`
`Date: May 28, 2021
`Case: RAI Strategic Holdings, Inc. -v- Altria Client Services, LLC, et al.
`
`Planet Depos
`Phone: 888.433.3767
`Email:: transcripts@planetdepos.com
`www.planetdepos.com
`
`WORLDWIDE COURT REPORTING & LITIGATION TECHNOLOGY
`
`
`
`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 3 of 12 PageID# 27315
`
` IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
` FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF VIRGINIA
` Alexandria Division
` x
`RAI STRATEGIC HOLDINGS, INC. : Case No.
`and R.J. REYNOLDS VAPOR : 1:20 cv 00393 LO TCB
`COMPANY, :
` Plaintiffs and :
`Counterclaim Defendants, :
` v. :
`ALTRIA CLIENT SERVICES LLC; :
`PHILIP MORRIS USA INC.; and :
`PHILIP MORRIS PRODUCTS S.A., :
` Defendants and :
`Counterclaim Plaintiffs. :
` x
`
` CONFIDENTIAL
`
` Videotaped Deposition of
` JEFFREY C. SUHLING, Ph.D.
` Conducted Virtually
` Friday, May 28, 2021
` 9:08 a.m. CST
`
`Job No.: 372934
`Pages: 1 299
`Reported by: Stephanie A. Battaglia, CSR
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 4 of 12 PageID# 27316
`CONFIDENTIAL
`Transcript of Jeffrey Suhling, Ph.D.
`Conducted on May 28, 2021
`
`283
`
`17:46:19
`17:46:20
`17:46:24
`17:46:26
`17:46:32
`17:46:35
`17:46:41
`17:46:45
`17:46:50
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`17:47:03
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`fair characterization?
`A.
`They are paper designs.
`Q.
`Well, what do you mean by that?
`A.
`They are on paper and have had some
`calculations behind them, but they have
`because of
`the purpose of them, which was to show a potential
`non sinuous design that could meet the needs of the
`product, that was their purpose,
`
`Can you please turn to Paragraph 9
`Q.
`before we leave that just one last question,
`Dr. Suhling, you haven't offered an opinion in your
`expert report about how much money it would cost to
`change the design from an S shaped sinuous line to the
`alternative designs you have proposed, right?
`A.
`No, I haven't given an opinion.
`I want to say some of the other experts
`have discussed that. I believe it was Mr. Hunt that I
`reviewed his deposition where he talked about these
`designs and discussed what is required to create a new
`product and get it approved.
`Q.
`Yes.
`
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 5 of 12 PageID# 27317
`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 5 of 12 PagelD# 27317
`CONFIDENTIAL
`Transcript of Jeffrey Suhling, Ph.D.
`Conducted on May28, 2021
`
`284
`
`But you yourself have not offered
`
`you
`
`are not offering an opinion about how much money it
`
`would cost to implement your alternative designs,
`
`fair?
`
`That is fair.
`
`to make sure we perfectly understood what was in the
`
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`17:49:04
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`17:49:10
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`Q.
`
`Let's go to Paragraph 94 of your rebuttal
`
`report,
`
`I guess 93.
`
`Now,
`
`this photograph was provided to you
`
`by a Smoore engineer,
`
`is that correct?
`
`A.
`
`Sorry,
`
`I went to Page 93. Yes.
`
`Mr. Liu
`
`Q.
`
`All right. And you talked to Mr. Liu,
`
`I
`
`believe, on March 24, correct?
`
`A.
`
`Yes.
`
`Q.
`
`A.
`
`It's the same day your report was due?
`
`Yes, it was very, very early that day to
`
`meet their Chinese at the time.
`
`Q.
`
`And did you ask to speak to Mr. Liu or
`
`how did this conversation come about?
`
`A.
`
`I did ask to speak with Mr. Liu and
`
`representative Smoore to ask questions about
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`just
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 6 of 12 PageID# 27318
`CONFIDENTIAL
`Transcript of Jeffrey Suhling, Ph.D.
`Conducted on May 28, 2021
`
`285
`
`17:49:13
`17:49:19
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`17:49:30
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`video that still capture images are present in some of
`the previous pages from 41 through 44, and during that
`discussion came up the existence of this photo also.
` Q. Do you know who arranged to have you
`speak with Mr. Liu at Smoore?
` MS. SMITH: Object to the form.
` THE WITNESS: Well, I asked Ms. Nicole
`Smith, who is on the line here, and she arranged for
`that meeting.
`BY MR. YEH:
` Q. Okay.
` So your understanding is Ms. Smith
`what, I think that is all I need.
` When you talked to Mr. Liu about this
`photograph do you have any understanding about whether
`
` no
`
`?
` A. Yes, I believe that's shown here on the
`screen that Mr. Liu explained that
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`
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 7 of 12 PageID# 27319
`CONFIDENTIAL
`Transcript of Jeffrey Suhling, Ph.D.
`Conducted on May 28, 2021
`
`286
`
`17:50:54
`17:51:01
`17:51:06
`17:51:08
`17:51:14
`17:51:17
`17:51:21
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`17:51:26
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`17:52:10
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`But of course in the real product
`Q.
`well, one difference between this photo and the real
`product is
`
`, correct?
`That is correct, in this particular
`A.
`photo, and in the infrared photos shown earlier the
`e liquid is inside of the ceramic.
`Q.
`And in actual use in the VUSE Alto device
`there would be e liquid in the ceramic wick, right?
`A.
`That is correct.
`Q.
`Do you know whether this photograph shows
`well, let me ask you this.
`
`, does
`
`that ring a bell?
`MS. SMITH: Object to the form,
`mischaracterizes the report.
`MR. YEH: Let's look at Page 46, footnote
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`PLANET DEPOS
`888.433.3767 | WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 8 of 12 PageID# 27320
`CONFIDENTIAL
`Transcript of Jeffrey Suhling, Ph.D.
`Conducted on May 28, 2021
`
`287
`
`17:52:14
`17:52:37
`17:52:39
`17:52:43
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`1.
`
`THE WITNESS: Yes, the footnote is
`referring that in some parts of video, which are not
`shown or discussed in my report they show a
`manufacturing process, and that is actually not
`that process which I never use in my report
`
`BY MR. YEH:
`Q.
`A.
`clearly says.
`Q.
`
`Well
`I think that's what the footnote pretty
`
`I am not referring to the process.
`
`, right?
`MS. SMITH: Object to the form.
`THE WITNESS: If we look at the second
`sentence in the footnote it says for the Alto product
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 9 of 12 PageID# 27321
`CONFIDENTIAL
`Transcript of Jeffrey Suhling, Ph.D.
`Conducted on May 28, 2021
`
`288
`
`17:53:51
`17:53:55
`17:53:57
`17:53:58
`17:54:02
`17:54:08
`17:54:08
`17:54:13
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`Dr. Xiao and Dr. Liu confirmed that the
`testing in the video is of the resistor in the Alto
`product.
`
`So it would be of a
`
`, I
`
`think that's perfectly clear.
`BY MR. YEH:
`Got it, I misunderstood your footnote,
`Q.
`thank you for the clarification.
`Just because
`
`A.
`Paragraph 93?
`Q.
`A.
`
`Referring to the picture below
`
`Yes.
`It just shows that there is
`
`that the
`
`Q.
`
`But you are not opining that the
`, right?
`MS. SMITH: Object to the form.
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 10 of 12 PageID# 27322
`CONFIDENTIAL
`Transcript of Jeffrey Suhling, Ph.D.
`Conducted on May 28, 2021
`
`289
`
`17:55:33
`17:55:38
`17:55:47
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`THE WITNESS: I just said that
`
`MR. YEH: I think I am almost done, if
`you give me a few minutes off the record I can figure
`out what I need to wrap up, but I think I am pretty
`much done.
`
`Let's go off the record.
`THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Off the record, 17:56.
`(Recess taken.)
`THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We are back on the
`record, 18:05.
`BY MR. YEH:
`Let's pull up the '265 patent and let's
`Q.
`go to the second page.
`Dr. Suhling, I just want to confirm, on
`the references cited you see a reference to Johnson
`and it's number 2012 0193343?
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 11 of 12 PageID# 27323
`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 11 of 12 PagelD# 27323
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`Transcript of Jeffrey Suhling, Ph.D.
`Conducted on May28, 2021
`
`298
`
`IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`
`FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF VIRGINIA
`
`Alexandria Division
`
`22 CONFIDENTIAL
`
`RAI STRATEGIC HOLDINGS,
`and R.J. REYNOLDS VAPOR
`
`INC.
`
`Case No.
`1:20 cv 00393 LO TCB
`
`COMPANY,
`Plaintiffs and
`
`Counterclaim Defendants,
`v.
`
`ALTRIA CLIENT SERVICES LLC;
`
`PHILIP MORRIS USA INC.; and
`
`PHILIP MORRIS PRODUCTS S.A.,
`Defendants and
`
`Counterclaim Plaintiffs.
`
`JEFFREY C. SUHLING, Ph.D., being first
`I,
`duly sworn, on oath say that I am the deponent in the
`aforesaid deposition taken on May 28, 2021;
`that I
`have read the foregoing transcript of my deposition,
`consisting of pages No.
`1 through No. 298,
`inclusive,
`and affix my signature to same.
`
`JEFFREY C. SUHLING, Ph.D.
`
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`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 12 of 12 PageID# 27324
`Case 1:20-cv-00393-LO-TCB Document 967-10 Filed 02/11/22 Page 12 of 12 PagelD# 27324
`CONFIDENTIAL
`Transcript of Jeffrey Suhling, Ph.D.
`Conducted on May28, 2021
`
` 299
`
`Notary Public
`
`CSR No. 084 003337
`
`Expiration Date: May 31, 2023
`
`PLANET DEPOS
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`888.433.3767 | WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
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`STATE OF ILLINOIS)
`) ss.
`COUNTY OF DUPAGE )
`
`I, STEPHANIE A. BATTAGLIA, CSR and Notary
`
`Public in and for the County of DuPage and State of
`
`Illinois, do hereby certify that on May 28, 2021, at
`
`9:08 a.m., Central Time,
`
`the deponent JEFFREY C.
`
`SUHLING, Ph.D., virtually appeared before me.
`
`I further certify that the said JEFFREY C.
`
`SUHLING, Ph.D., was by me first duly sworn to testify
`
`and that the foregoing is a true record of the
`
`testimony given virtually by the witness.
`
`I further certify that the deposition was
`
`terminated at 6:17 p.m. Central Time.
`
`I further certify that I am not counsel for
`
`nor related to any of the parties herein, nor am I
`
`interested in the outcome hereof.
`
`In witness whereof,
`
`I have hereunto set my
`
`hand and seal of office this lst of June, 2021.
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