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`Page 1
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` IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`
` FOR THE SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF IOWA
`
` DAVENPORT DIVISION
`
` ********************************************************
`
` NUHN INDUSTRIES LTD., Case No. 3:22-CV-00015-SMR-HCR
`
` Plaintiff,
`
` v.
`
` BAZOOKA FARMSTAR, LLC,
`
` Defendant.
`
` ********************************************************
`
` VIDEO-RECORDED REMOTE ZOOM DEPOSITION OF
`
` MAURICE BRYHAM, AS THE REPRESENTATIVE
`
` OF SEALEGS INTERNATIONAL
`
` Taken Tuesday, October 29, 2024
`
` Scheduled for 2:00 P.M. CENTRAL TIME
`
` REPORTED BY: Lori Morrow, RDR, RMR, CRR, CRC
`
` JOB NO.: MW 6972640
`
`www.veritext.com
`
`888-391-3376
`
`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 1 of 176
`
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`Page 1
`
` IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`
` FOR THE SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF IOWA
`
` DAVENPORT DIVISION
`
` ********************************************************
`
` NUHN INDUSTRIES LTD., Case No. 3:22-CV-00015-SMR-HCR
`
` Plaintiff,
`
` v.
`
` BAZOOKA FARMSTAR, LLC,
`
` Defendant.
`
` ********************************************************
`
` VIDEO-RECORDED REMOTE ZOOM DEPOSITION OF
`
` MAURICE BRYHAM, AS THE REPRESENTATIVE
`
` OF SEALEGS INTERNATIONAL
`
` Taken Tuesday, October 29, 2024
`
` Scheduled for 2:00 P.M. CENTRAL TIME
`
` REPORTED BY: Lori Morrow, RDR, RMR, CRR, CRC
`
` JOB NO.: MW 6972640
`
`www.veritext.com
`
`888-391-3376
`
`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 1 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 2
`
` VIDEO-RECORDED REMOTE ZOOM DEPOSITION OF
`
` MAURICE BRYHAM AS THE REPRESENTATIVE OF SEALEGS taken
`
` Tuesday, October 29, 2024, commencing at 2:30 p.m. (CDT)
`
` before Lori Morrow, Certified Diplomate Reporter,
`
` Certified Realtime Reporter, Certified Realtime
`
` Captioner, and a Stenographic Shorthand Reporter and
`
` Notary Public of and for the State of Minnesota.
`
` **********
`
` A P P E A R A N C E S:
`
` On Behalf of the Plaintiff:
`
` Scott E. Yackey, Esquire
`
` HARNESS IP
`
` 2600 Network Boulevard, Suite 230
`
` Frisco, Texas 75034
`
` (469) 777-5423
`
` syackey@harnessip.com
`
` On Behalf of the Defendant:
`
` Thomas J. Leach, Esquire
`
` MERCHANT & GOULD P.C.
`
` 150 South Fifth Street, Suite 2200
`
` Minneapolis, Minnesota 55402
`
` (612) 336-4665
`
` TLeach@MerchantGould.com
`
` (APPEARANCES continued on the next page.)
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 2 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 3
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` APPEARANCES (CONTINUED):
`
` ALSO PRESENT: Brian Ciccone, Videographer
`
` **********
`
` NOTE: The original transcript will be delivered to
`
` Thomas Leach, Esquire.
`
` I N D E X
`
` WITNESS:
`
` MAURICE BRYHAM, IN HIS CAPACITY AS THE DESIGNATED
`
` CORPORATE REPRESENTATIVE OF SEALEGS
`
` EXAMINATION BY: PAGE:
`
` Mr. Leach.................. 7
`
` Mr. Yackey................. 99
`
` Mr. Leach.................. 121
`
` Mr. Yackey................. 124
`
` Mr. Leach.................. 126
`
` INSTRUCTIONS: (None)
`
` REQUESTS FOR PRODUCTION: (None)
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`www.veritext.com
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`888-391-3376
`
`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 3 of 176
`
`
`
` E X H I B I T S
`
` EXHIBITS: DESCRIPTION: PAGE:
`
`Page 4
`
` Exhibit 41 U.S. Patent No. 7,314,395,
`
` Amphibious Vehicle (Bates
`
` BAZ15_0001354 - 1380)................ 12
`
` Exhibit 42 SydneyBoating.com Brochure of
`
` Sealegs products
`
` (Bates BAZ15_0193257)................ 18
`
` Exhibit 43 Brochure for Amphibious Rescue
`
` Craft (Bates SEA0000003 - 10)........ 24
`
` Exhibit 44 Screenshots of Sealegs Native
`
` Files' Properties (No Bates)......... 25
`
` Exhibit 45 Sealegs Tax Invoice 13459 to Ideal
`
` House Construction Co., Ltd.,
`
` dated 6/1/2013 (Bates
`
` SEA0000001 - 2)...................... 45
`
` Exhibit 46 Sealegs brochure of products,
`
` story and background, and
`
` customer applications (Bates
`
` SEA0000011 - 66)..................... 54
`
` Exhibit 47 Photos of Sealegs fire
`
` pump craft (in factory)
`
` (Bates SEA0000067)................... 71
`
` (EXHIBITS continued on the next page.)
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`
`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 4 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 5
`
` EXHIBITS (CONTINUED): PAGE:
`
` Exhibit 48 Photo of Sealegs fire pump craft
`
` (inside shipping container)
`
` (Bates SEA0000068)................... 71
`
` Exhibit 49 Web page from Sealegs
`
` International's Facebook page
`
` (Bates BAZ15-0193258 - 193259)....... 76
`
` Exhibit 50 Excerpts from Sealegs' Facebook
`
` page (Bates BAZ15-019350 - 19353).... 81
`
` Exhibit 51 Screenshot of web page from
`
` Sealegs' web site (Bates
`
` BAZ15-0193254)....................... 84
`
` Exhibit 52 Video of Sealegs Fire Rescue
`
` Vehicles (Bates BAZ15-0193260)....... 87
`
` (REPORTER'S NOTE: Quotations from exhibits are
`
` reflected in the manner in which they were read into the
`
` record and do not necessarily indicate an exact quote
`
` from the document.)
`
` **********
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 5 of 176
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` (The following proceedings commenced at
`
` 2:30 p.m. (CDT).)
`
` THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Good afternoon. We are
`
` going on the record at 2:30 p.m. Central
`
` Daylight Time on October 29, 2024.
`
` This is Media Unit Number One of the
`
` video-recorded deposition of Maurice Bryham
`
` taken by counsel for Defendant in the matter of
`
` Nuhn Industries Limited versus Bazooka
`
` Farmstar, LLC, filed in the United States
`
` District Court for the Southern District of
`
` Iowa, Davenport Division. Case Number
`
` 3:22-CV-00015-SMR-HCA.
`
` This deposition is being held via remote
`
` Zoom. My name is Brian Ciccone representing
`
` Veritext Legal Solutions, and I am the
`
` videographer. The court reporter is Lori
`
` Morrow, also from Veritext Legal Solutions.
`
` Will the attorneys please identify
`
` themselves for voice recognition.
`
` MR. LEACH: This is Tom Leach with
`
` Merchant & Gould on behalf of the Defendant,
`
` Bazooka Farmstar.
`
` MR. YACKEY: This is Scott Yackey from the
`
` law firm of Harness IP on behalf of Plaintiff,
`
`www.veritext.com
`
`888-391-3376
`
`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 6 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 7
`
` Nuhn Industries Limited.
`
` And I want to note for the record that
`
` this deposition is being conducted remotely
`
` pursuant to the Court's order dated October 28,
`
` 2024, Docket Number 242.
`
` THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Thank you. Will the
`
` court reporter please swear in the witness.
`
` (The witness was sworn.)
`
` THE VIDEOGRAPHER: You may proceed.
`
` MAURICE BRYHAM,
`
` duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
`
` EXAMINATION
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q Thank you, Mr. Bryham, for your time today.
`
` I want to quickly start first just to get some
`
` formalities out of the way. If you could please state
`
` your full name for the record.
`
` A Maurice John Bryham.
`
` Q Can you spell that, please?
`
` A M-a-u-r-i-c-e, J-o-h-n, B-r-y-h-a-m.
`
` Q And how old are you, sir?
`
` A I am 58, born on 4th of August, 1965.
`
` Q And where do you live?
`
` A 42 Ocean View Road, Milford, Auckland,
`
` New Zealand.
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 7 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 8
`
` Q Sir, have you ever been deposed before? Have
`
` you ever had a deposition taken before?
`
` A Not in the U.S.
`
` Q Okay. And are you here today voluntarily to
`
` provide facts about Sealegs' amphibious vehicle?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q And you understand that the court reporter just
`
` administered the oath and that you are under oath today,
`
` and it has the same force and effect as if you were in a
`
` courtroom in front of a judge and jury?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q And I will attempt to make my questions as
`
` clear as I can. But if you don't understand a question
`
` or want me to clarify, please ask, and I'll try to do so.
`
` But if you provide an answer, I'll assume you
`
` understood the question. Is that fair?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q And because the court reporter is going to be
`
` taking down everything that's said today, it's important
`
` to give verbal responses like yes, no, or just verbal
`
` answers versus uh-huh or uh-uh or shaking your head.
`
` That's hard for the court reporter to get that down. So
`
` if you could, please provide verbal answers. Is that
`
` fair?
`
` A Yes.
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 8 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 9
`
` Q And then also, because she's trying to take
`
` down what is said, I'll make a point not to speak over
`
` you, and if you could try to wait until I'm done and then
`
` provide your answer so the court reporter can get
`
` everything down that's said. Okay?
`
` A Okay.
`
` Q And then, is there any reason, for example, any
`
` medication you're on that would prevent you from
`
` understanding my questions and answering them truthfully?
`
` A No.
`
` Q And, Mr. Yackey, counsel for Nuhn, may make
`
` objections throughout the course of the proceeding, and I
`
` may when he's asking questions make some objections.
`
` Wait until those objections are done, and then you can
`
` provide your answer. Okay?
`
` A Okay.
`
` Q I want to go through just a little bit of your
`
` background quick, and I'm going to try to be as efficient
`
` as possible. Can you tell me generally, what is your
`
` education?
`
` A My education is just through to New Zealand
`
` high school, which I think would be the same as year 13,
`
` and then I went into business. I didn't go to
`
` university.
`
` Q Okay. And are you currently employed?
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 9 of 176
`
`
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` A Yes.
`
` Q And who are you employed by?
`
` A I have my own company, Sea4 Amphibious
`
` Technology.
`
` Q Okay.
`
` A And then I just do some consulting for Sealegs
`
` International now.
`
` Q Okay. Are you affiliated at all with Sealegs
`
` International?
`
` A I'm the founder and inventor, but I retired
`
` full-time at the end of last year, so now I just assist
`
` on a sort of casual basis.
`
` Q And so you're still a consultant for Sealegs
`
` International?
`
` A Yes. Yeah, as required.
`
` Q How long before you started -- before you
`
` retired and started consulting for Sealegs International,
`
` how long had you owned or worked for Sealegs?
`
` A Over 20 years, so from 2001 until 2023.
`
` Q And I assume you're familiar with Sealegs'
`
` products?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q And can you just briefly explain how you became
`
` familiar with Sealegs' products?
`
` A I came up with the idea. I live on the beach
`
`www.veritext.com
`
`888-391-3376
`
`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 10 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 11
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` and wanted to make it easier to launch and retrieve a
`
` boat, so I thought about it and then came up with an idea
`
` of how to add motorized, retractible, steerable wheels
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` and built the first one in my garage. And that prototype
`
` worked successfully. And from there, I formed a company
`
` and made it into a production product.
`
` Q And just briefly, from 2001 when you started
`
` Sealegs to 2023, have you been intimately involved with
`
` all aspects of Sealegs' business?
`
` A Fairly much. I've been mainly focused on the
`
` design and development of the product, so the technical
`
` side in charge of the R&D team with up to eight
`
` engineers, but also being fairly involved in sort of
`
` marketing and promotional activities as well.
`
` Q Okay. And so can you provide just a little bit
`
` of background? What were the challenges, or what
`
` problems were you looking to solve when you came up with
`
` the Sealegs idea and built a prototype?
`
` A Basically, to make an amphibious boat that
`
` could self-propel, drive in and out of the water just to
`
` make it much easier to launch and retrieve a boat without
`
` a trailer and a tow vehicle and multiple people, so it
`
` just became a one-person operation, very quick and easy
`
` just to drive in, push a button, retract the wheels, and
`
` then it basically became a normal -- a boat on the water.
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 11 of 176
`
`
`
` Could go high speed, planing.
`
` Q And so you were intimately involved in the
`
` design and development? In fact, it was your creation of
`
`Page 12
`
` the Sealegs boat, correct?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q And as the owner of the company for years or
`
` decades, you also were intimately involved in the
`
` marketing, promotion, and sales of the Sealegs products,
`
` correct?
`
` A Yes. And I -- yeah. I basically was a patent
`
` owner. There are other shareholders as well.
`
` Q Sure. And can you tell me when you came up
`
` with the idea for the Sealegs product, about what time
`
` frame, what year?
`
` A Yeah. It was in 2001. So I filed a
`
` provisional patent December 2001, and I wrote that
`
` myself.
`
` Q Okay. Let's actually just pull that up. I'm
`
` going to -- just give me a second here.
`
` (Deposition Exhibit Number 41 was marked.)
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q Mr. Bryham, if you go into the marked exhibits,
`
` I have marked Defendant's Exhibit 41.
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q Can you see that?
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`
`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 12 of 176
`
`
`
` A Just opening it now. Yes.
`
` Q And you filed a few patents on the Sealegs
`
`Page 13
`
` idea, correct?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q And so Exhibit 41 is U.S. Patent Number
`
` 7,314,395, correct?
`
` A Just a moment. 7,314,395, yes.
`
` Q And this patent was filed on December 6, 2005,
`
` correct?
`
` A The application.
`
` Q It says "Filed."
`
` A Patent, yeah. Hang on. I have to move across.
`
` Q Yeah. You want to be in the left-hand column,
`
` sir.
`
` A All right. January the 1st, 2008.
`
` Q No. That's the date it issued. If you go to
`
` the left column.
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` A Yes.
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` Q Line 22, or it says 22, "Filed: December 6,
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` 2005."
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` A Oh, yes, December 6, 2005, yeah.
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` Q Yeah. And this was a continuation of an
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` application that you filed previously, I think
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` December 17, 2002, and maybe there was an earlier one.
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` A Yeah. The original --
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 13 of 176
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`Page 14
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` Q But anyway --
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` A Correct. The original provisional that I filed
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` was in New Zealand in 2001. But these are all, yeah,
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` from that original provisional.
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` Q Okay. Perfect. And your patent was directed
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` to an amphibious vehicle?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q And can you describe generally what the patent
`
` is directed to? Is it directed to adding powered,
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` steerable wheels to a boat to make it easier to get in
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` and out of lakes and streams and the ocean?
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` A Correct, yeah. Powered, so motorized,
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` retractible, steerable wheels, yes.
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` Q And your idea was borne out of the difficulties
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` in getting in and out of lakes, the ocean, rivers, using
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` a trailer, especially where there was no boat launch
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` available, correct?
`
` A Correct.
`
` MR. YACKEY: Objection, form, leading.
`
` THE WITNESS: Yeah. So the -- yeah. The
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` main objective was to make it easier to launch
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` and retrieve a boat in and out of the water,
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` yeah, water front, beach front, lakes, rivers,
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` to make it a single-person operation where you
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` didn't have to get in and out of the craft.
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 14 of 176
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`
`
`Page 15
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` You could stay in the boat and just drive it
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` into the water, retract the wheels. And then
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` conversely, you could drive it out of the
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` water, deploy the wheels in the water and then
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` drive out, steer it, and drive out of the
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` water.
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` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q Okay. I want to break that up just a little
`
` bit. And so one of the points -- well, can you tell me,
`
` in terms of entering a body of water or a lagoon, what
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` were some of the challenges that a user with a trailer
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` would face and that your idea solved?
`
` A Yeah. So basically, it eliminated the need for
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` a trailer. If the amphibious boat was near the water,
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` you could just drive to the water and in and out without
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` needing a trailer. You therefore didn't need a tow
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` vehicle to tow the trailer. So basically, it eliminated
`
` the need for a tow vehicle and a trailer and didn't need
`
` to back the trailer into the water. Didn't need to find
`
` a ramp where you could do that operation. Didn't involve
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` someone to hold the boat in the water while the tow
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` vehicle driver went and parked the tow vehicle and the
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` trailer. So it made it a lot easier. Also, instead of
`
` reversing the boat into the water on the trailer, you
`
` could drive in bow first. It was a lot safer. You
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 15 of 176
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`
`
`Page 16
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` weren't stopping in the wave zone or a current or a tidal
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` area. So someone wasn't standing in the water on a
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` slippery ramp. So it became a lot simpler, a lot easier,
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` and just one-person operation, and obviously much, much
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` quicker as well. It turned what could be at least a half
`
` hour operation into, yeah, a minute or two.
`
` Q And in the patent you show some of your wheels
`
` in kind of maybe stick figure-ish figures. But can you
`
` describe what your prototype or what your product, what
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` type of wheels it had in terms of its danger or its
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` ability to climb out of maybe steeper banks or different
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` areas that don't have a boat ramp?
`
` A Uh-huh. Yeah. So through the development
`
` phase, I tried a number of different types of tires and
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` different sized tires and wheels. But basically,
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` finalized onto, effectively, a sort of an all-terrain,
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` large flotation sort of terrain grip tire that's used
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` often on -- similar to what's used on all-terrain
`
` vehicles, some of the Polaris all wheel drive vehicles,
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` that type of, you know, all-terrain off-road tire.
`
` Q So the products that were sold prior to, say,
`
` 2013, the Sealegs products, could those navigate steep
`
` banks, muddy banks, rocky banks, and climb out of a body
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` of water with the tires that were being used?
`
` A Yes, very much so. So it was very much a low
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 16 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 17
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` speed, typically around sort of six miles per hour on
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` land but all-terrain, so very high torque. It was a
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` thousand meters per wheel and, yeah, very capable of
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` driving across rocky, difficult, muddy terrain up hills.
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` It can effectively drive up steps, so plenty of torque.
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` But the hydraulic motors are very similar to a Bobcat
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` earth-moving equipment motor in the wheels. So it was
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` hub motors at the wheel driving the wheel in very much
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` your high torque, low speed, all-terrain operation.
`
` Q And were those hub motors, at least prior to
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` 2013, did you have an all wheel version, or was the
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` vehicle all wheel drive?
`
` A Initially, it was just the rear two wheels were
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` driven, and the front wheel was non-driven but steerable.
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` And then later, we added all wheel drive, so it made the
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` front wheel also driven with a hub motor.
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` Q And about when did you make the front wheel
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` driven?
`
` A I would have to -- from memory, I think it was
`
` around the year two thousand and -- I think it was
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` around -- it was about, I think, around 2010, early 2010,
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` from memory. It was a few years after we saw the first
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` ones here.
`
` (Court reporter clarification.)
`
` THE WITNESS: So I think it would be after
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 17 of 176
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`Page 18
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` 2010.
`
` MR. LEACH: I'm going to just mark another
`
` exhibit quick.
`
` (Deposition Exhibit Number 42 was marked.)
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q Mr. Bryham, I'm marking Defendant's Exhibit 42.
`
` And you may have to zoom in a little bit on this, but it
`
` is a capture from the Wayback Machine of an article that
`
` was on the web February 22, 2011. But more importantly,
`
` if you look at the, basically, first -- second paragraph,
`
` I should say, of the text, it's talking about the Sealegs
`
` adding the agility of all wheel drive. And then it says,
`
` "With the front and two rear wheels driving, Sealegs can
`
` scale steep river banks and beachheads to power
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` seamlessly from sea to shore, without breaking a sweat.
`
` This new option is available on Sealegs amphibious boats
`
` built from May 2010 onwards and means that an additional
`
` wheel motor is added to the front wheel." Do you see
`
` that?
`
` A Yes. Yeah.
`
` Q Does that refresh your recollection that around
`
` May of 2010, Sealegs put all wheel drive on the Sealegs
`
` products?
`
` A Yes. Yes. And the photo is over -- that's of
`
` the all wheel drive Sealegs driving up a quite difficult
`
`www.veritext.com
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`888-391-3376
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 18 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 19
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` pebbly beach.
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` Q And so going back to your knowledge about the
`
` Sealegs product, prior to 2013, as we established, you
`
` were the original developer and designer of the product.
`
` You are intimately familiar with the research, design --
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` or strike that.
`
` Are you intimately familiar with the research,
`
` design, development of the Sealegs product?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q And then back prior to 2013, I think you also
`
` mentioned you were involved in sales and marketing. So I
`
` want to ask, prior to 2013, were you also personally
`
` knowledgeable about the sales and marketing of the
`
` Sealegs product?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q So going back to the design and development,
`
` through your personal experience, designing, developing
`
` and testing and probably supporting the Sealegs
`
` amphibious vehicle, is that how you became personally
`
` familiar with the products?
`
` MR. YACKEY: Objection, form.
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q Let me ask a better question. That was a
`
` little long.
`
` Prior to 2013, you were involved with the
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 19 of 176
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`
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`Page 20
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` design and development of the product, correct?
`
` A Yes.
`
` MR. YACKEY: Objection, form.
`
` THE WITNESS: Sure.
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q Well, were you involved in testing of the
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` product?
`
` A Yes.
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` MR. YACKEY: Objection to form.
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q Were you involved in supporting the products
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` that were sold?
`
` MR. YACKEY: Objection, form.
`
` THE WITNESS: Yes.
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q Would it be fair to say that you're one of the
`
` persons most familiar with the design, structure, and
`
` capabilities of the Sealegs product?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q Can you briefly tell me how you became
`
` personally familiar with the sales and marketing of the
`
` Sealegs amphibious vehicle?
`
` A Yeah. So previous companies that I've founded,
`
` I was also very involved in sales and marketing. And at
`
` Sealegs, yeah, basically, right from choosing the company
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 20 of 176
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`
`
`Page 21
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` name to, you know, designing the logo, fonts, marketing
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` material, had very much overview and a hand in the look
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` and feel of Sealegs' marketing, was involved in signing
`
` off on brochures and marketing material.
`
` Q Did you attend trade shows?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q And were you involved in all of those
`
` activities prior to 2013?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q So would it be fair to say prior to 2013 you
`
` were familiar with all aspects of the Sealegs company?
`
` A Yeah, from an executive level and on, yeah,
`
` sales, marketing, and product development from a hands-on
`
` level.
`
` Q Can you briefly describe the Sealegs product
`
` that was advertised, sold, and used prior to 2013?
`
` A Yeah. So it was a range of amphibious boats
`
` using the Sealegs system. Originally, they were rigid
`
` inflatable boats, so with inflatable tubes, aluminum
`
` hull, through to full aluminum hulls with what we call a
`
` D tube, which was aluminum air filled sides for
`
` additional flotation. And then the size grew from,
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` originally it was six meters and then later on became
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` seven meters in length.
`
` (Court reporter clarification.)
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 21 of 176
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` THE WITNESS: Aluminum hull.
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q And can you briefly describe the retractible
`
` wheels? How did they operate?
`
` A Yeah. So they had -- each of the retractible
`
` wheels had a hydraulic cylinder that by pressing a button
`
` activates the hydraulic fluid from a hydraulic pump to
`
` raise or deploy the leg with a wheel on the end. A
`
` little bit like an aeroplane undercarriage, you could
`
` just press a button to raise or lower the wheels.
`
` Q I think you mentioned that the hull was a
`
` floatable or a buoyant hull; is that correct?
`
` A Yes. Yeah.
`
` Q So in some respects, or in some versions, it
`
` had more like a raft type hull; is that correct?
`
` A Yeah. In some versions, the rigid inflatable
`
` had an aluminum hull with Hypalon inflatable rubber tubes
`
` on the sides similar to what's used for Coast Guard or
`
` whitewater rafting type boats.
`
` Q And then later did it have a more traditional
`
` hull?
`
` A Yeah.
`
` MR. YACKEY: Objection to form.
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q So let me rephrase the question. Did you also
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`www.veritext.com
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`888-391-3376
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 22 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 23
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` employ a different type of hull at some point?
`
` A Yes. So subsequently we had full aluminum hull
`
` with no inflatable tubes, so the entire boat hull was
`
` made of aluminum.
`
` Q And can you describe what that bulk hull was in
`
` comparison to what people would think of as a traditional
`
` bulk hull?
`
` A Yeah. So there was a monohull, so a V-shaped
`
` hull with aluminum sides. So I think most people, you
`
` know, most laymen would just recognize it as a boat.
`
` Q Okay. Did that V-shaped hull have any chambers
`
` in it that you filled with foam for flotation in case it
`
` got swamped?
`
` A Not normally. Normally, they were not foam
`
` filled. But occasionally, we did do foam in the cavities
`
` for some commercial operators or Coast Guard
`
` requirements.
`
` Q And do you know whether the amphibious boats
`
` that you made that included foam filled chambers, were
`
` those built prior to 2013?
`
` A I wouldn't know absolutely. But I suspect
`
` there may have been some before 2013. But yeah, without
`
` going back to records, I couldn't be absolutely sure.
`
` Q Okay. And the Sealegs boat also had a number
`
` of, say, tools or attachments on it; is that correct?
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 23 of 176
`
`
`
`Page 24
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` MR. YACKEY: Objection, form.
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q Strike that. Let me -- there were different
`
` versions of the boat -- strike that again.
`
` Were there different versions of the boat, like
`
` for fire and rescue or for military use or like that?
`
` A Yes. So we had our standard recreational
`
` craft, and then we had -- which we called the white
`
` boats, the recreational crafts. Then we had the red
`
` boats, which were for rescue departments, fire
`
` departments, flood rescue, which would have attachments
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` like stretchers. Sometimes we would have power take-offs
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` from the hydraulics to do an auxiliary propeller or pump,
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` fire pump, water pump for fire department. And then we
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` would have what we call black boats, which were for
`
` military or security forces, police departments.
`
` MR. LEACH: Okay. I'm going to mark
`
` another exhibit.
`
` (Deposition Exhibit Number 43 was marked.)
`
` BY MR. LEACH:
`
` Q Mr. Bryham, I've marked Defendant's Exhibit 43.
`
` If you could take a look at this document, please.
`
` A Okay.
`
` Q Can you tell me what this document is?
`
` A Yeah. This is a brochure specifically for the
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`888-391-3376
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Exhibit 1138
`Bazooka v. Nuhn - IPR2024-00098
`Page 24 of 176
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`
`
`Page 25
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` red boat market, for the rescue craft market for fire
`
` departments, fire rescue. What you can see in some of
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` the photos is a fire boat. There's civil defense and
`
` fire department craft in different countries, including
`
` New Zealand, Italy, India. And at the end you can see
`
` the aluminum craft listed first and then a six-meter and
`
` a seven-meter rigid inflatable craft after that. And a
`
` lot of the options and accessories are on the last page.
`
` Q Okay. Let's go through this document a little
`
` bit. Is this an advertisement or brochure for the
`
` Sealegs rescue craft products?
`
` A Yes.
`
` Q And was this publicly distributed prior to
`
` 2013?
`
` A I think there may be a date at the end. Yeah,
`
` I can't s
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