UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
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`Page 1
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`________________________________
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`CHANEL, INC.,
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` Petitioner,
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` v. Case No.
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`MOLO DESIGN, LTD., IPR2022-00543
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` Patent Owner.
`
`________________________________
`
` VIDEOCONFERENCE DEPOSITION OF
`
` STEPHANIE FORSYTHE
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`DATE: Friday, March 24, 2023
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`TIME: 11:58 a.m.
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`LOCATION: Remote Proceeding
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` Minneapolis, MN 55402
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`OFFICIATED BY: Tina Nelson, Notary Public
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`JOB NO.: 5793554
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 1
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`
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` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`
`Page 1
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`________________________________
`
`CHANEL, INC.,
`
` Petitioner,
`
` v. Case No.
`
`MOLO DESIGN, LTD., IPR2022-00543
`
` Patent Owner.
`
`________________________________
`
` VIDEOCONFERENCE DEPOSITION OF
`
` STEPHANIE FORSYTHE
`
`DATE: Friday, March 24, 2023
`
`TIME: 11:58 a.m.
`
`LOCATION: Remote Proceeding
`
` Minneapolis, MN 55402
`
`OFFICIATED BY: Tina Nelson, Notary Public
`
`JOB NO.: 5793554
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 1
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`Page 2
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` A P P E A R A N C E S
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`ON BEHALF OF PETITIONER CHANEL, INC.:
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` GEOFFREY M. GODFREY, ESQUIRE (by videoconference)
`
` Dorsey & Whitney LLP
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` 701 Fifth Avenue, Suite 6100, Columbia Center
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` Seattle, WA 98104
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` godfrey.geoff@dorsey.com
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`ON BEHALF OF PATENT HOLDER MOLO DESIGN, LTD. AND
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`STEPHANIE FORSYTHE:
`
` MICHAEL CHIBIB, ESQUIRE (by videoconference)
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` Bracewell LLP
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` 111 Congress Avenue, Suite 2300
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` Austin, TX 78701
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` michael.chibib@bracewell.com
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 2
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`
`
` I N D E X
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`EXAMINATION: PAGE
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` By Mr. Godfrey 5
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`Page 3
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` E X H I B I T S
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`NO. DESCRIPTION PAGE
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`Exhibit 2006 Affidavit of Stephanie Forsythe 10
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`Exhibit 1021 List of General Rules,
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` 2003 DBEW Competition 17
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`Exhibit 1005 PDF Copy of Archived Webpage,
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` DBEW, Softhousing 1 30
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`Exhibit 1014 MOLO_00004200 - MOLO_00004204 33
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`Exhibit 1020 MOLO_00004196 - MOLO_00004199 34
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`Exhibit 2021 E-mail, Evelyn Lacson 39
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`Exhibit 2030 Molo Webpage, 12/14/2022 40
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` (Exhibits attached.)
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 3
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`
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`Page 4
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` P R O C E E D I N G S
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` THE OFFICER: Good afternoon. My name is
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`Tina Nelson; I am the officer assigned by Veritext to
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`take the record of this proceeding. We are now on the
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`record at 11:58 a.m., so I should say, good morning.
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` This is the deposition of Stephanie
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`Forsythe taken in the matter of Chanel, Inc. vs. Molo
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`Design, Limited, on Friday, March 24, 2023, remote via
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`Zoom.
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` I am a notary authorized to take
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`acknowledgments and administer oaths in Minnesota.
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`Parties agree that I will swear in the witness remotely.
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` Additionally, absent an objection on the
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`record before the witness is sworn, all parties and the
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`witness understand and agree that any certified
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`transcript produced from the recording of this
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`proceeding:
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` - is intended for all uses permitted
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` under applicable procedural and
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` evidentiary rules and laws in the same
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` manner as a deposition recorded by
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` stenographic means; and
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` - shall constitute written stipulation
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` of such.
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` At this time will everyone in attendance
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 4
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`
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`Page 5
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`please identify yourself for the record.
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` MR. GODFREY: Geoff Godfrey with Dorsey &
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`Whitney, representing Chanel.
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` MR. CHIBIB: Michael Chibib; Bracewell,
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`representing Molo Design, Limited, and the witness.
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` MS. FORSYTHE: Stephanie Forsythe, of
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`Molo Design, Limited; witness.
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` THE REPORTER: Thank you. Hearing No.
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`objection, I will now swear in the witness.
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` Ms. Forsythe, please raise your right
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`hand.
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`WHEREUPON,
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` STEPHANIE FORSYTHE,
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`called as a witness, and having been first duly sworn to
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`tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the
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`truth, was examined and testified as follows:
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` THE REPORTER: Go ahead, Counsel.
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` EXAMINATION
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`BY MR. GODFREY:
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` Q Good morning, Ms. Forsythe.
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` A Good morning.
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` Q Would you please state your full name and
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`address for the record?
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` A My full name is Stephanie Jo Forsythe, and
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`my -- sorry; address is what you asked for?
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 5
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` Q Yes.
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` A 1470 Venables Street, Vancouver, British
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`Columbia, Canada.
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` Q Have you ever been deposed before?
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` A Yes. I have been deposed once before for one
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`other case.
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` Q If I ask a question that you don't fully
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`understand, please tell me and I'll do my best to
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`clarify. If you don't ask me to clarify, I am going to
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`assume that you understood the question; is that okay?
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` A Yes.
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` Q If you need a break at any time, please ask;
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`okay?
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` A Yes.
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` Q Do you understand that you are under oath
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`today?
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` A Yes, I do.
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` Q Is there anything that might impair your
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`ability to testify truthfully and accurately today?
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` A No.
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` Q Is there anyone else in the room with you
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`today?
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` A No. My dog.
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` Q Would you please confirm that you will not
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`communicate with Counsel or anyone else while we are on
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`www.veritext.com
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 6
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`the record at the deposition today?
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` A Yes, I agree.
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` Q Other than the programs that are needed to run
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`the deposition, do you have any other programs or notes
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`up and running on your computer right now?
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` A No, just what I need to run the deposition.
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` Q Okay. And within your immediate vicinity
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`there, do you have any documents or other materials that
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`are related to this case?
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` A I just have the deposition exhibits, the paper
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`of the exhibits that were signed by your lawyers.
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` Q Nothing beyond that?
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` A Just a blank pad of paper.
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` Q Okay. Did you talk with Mr. MacAllen about
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`your deposition?
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` A Yes, I did.
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` Q And when was that?
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` A Yesterday.
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` Q Okay. And what did you talk about?
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` A We talked a little bit about how his
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`deposition went and just how I was feeling about mine.
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` Q Did you discuss the substance of any of the
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`questions or topics from Mr. MacAllen's deposition
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`earlier in the week?
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` A There were a couple -- only a couple specific
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`www.veritext.com
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 7
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`
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`Page 8
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`things that he brought up, but because there was an
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`error in the -- the affidavit, the personal affidavit
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`that was, kind of, came to light during his deposition,
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`and I have a similar affidavit, so I -- I checked mine
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`and the same error is -- it's kind of a typing error
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`that's in both of them; that's the same.
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` Q Okay. Were there any other issues that you
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`remember discussing?
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` A The -- the -- I don't recall any other
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`specific things.
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` Q Did you review a rough transcript of Mr.
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`MacAllen's deposition?
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` A No. I haven't seen any transcript.
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` Q Do you recall discussing any other exhibits
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`with Mr. MacAllen?
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` A The only other exhibit that he mentioned was a
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`financial one for the sales of softblocks and softwalls
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`over the years, by fiscal year.
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` Q And what did you discuss about that exhibit?
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` A He just mentioned that was one of the exhibits
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`that -- that came up and that there were some things
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`about it that he couldn't be 100 percent sure of because
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`he wasn't really part of creating that exhibit.
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` Q Did you do any preparation so that you would
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`be able to address that exhibit with the financial data?
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 8
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` A No, I didn't.
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` Q More generally, what did you do to prepare for
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`your deposition today, beyond what we have discussed?
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` A I met with our lawyers and they -- they
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`prepared me. I've never had a U.S. deposition before,
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`so the one other time I've been deposed was in Canada.
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`The rules are slightly different, but very similar, so
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`they went over the rules and how a deposition works with
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`me.
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` Q Okay. And when was that meeting?
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` A I believe that was Monday. I'm not even 100
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`percent sure what day that was; it's been a blur lately.
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` Q It was before MacAllen's deposition though; is
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`that correct?
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` A Yes, it was before Mr. MacAllen's -- it might
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`have been Tuesday. Monday or Tuesday; somewhere near
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`the beginning of this week.
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` Q And I'm not asking about the substance of any
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`conversations with the lawyers, but did you speak with
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`any of your lawyers again after Mr. MacAllen's
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`deposition?
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` A Yes, I did. Yesterday, I spoke to my lawyers
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`again briefly.
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` Q Approximately how long?
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` A About half an hour or less. Yeah -- or less.
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`www.veritext.com
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 9
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` Q Okay. Did you review any documents that
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`refreshed your memory, in preparation for your
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`deposition?
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` A No, I decided that this is all our work and
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`our life, and it was better not to obsess over trying to
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`look up anything, and just go from what I know of --
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` Q Did you do anything else to prepare, beyond
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`what you have mentioned already?
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` A No. Just a good night's sleep, tea.
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` Q Okay. I am going to upload to the Exhibit
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`Share, an Exhibit No. 2006.
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` (Exhibit 2006 was marked for
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` identification.)
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` A And -- oh, so should I go into the Veritext
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`when you're doing this? I have never done --
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` MR. CHIBIB: So if I may, there is an
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`electronic version of these exhibits up in what they
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`call the Exhibit Share, and you can access it that way.
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`And you will have the ability to scroll yourself, so not
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`necessarily what Geoff is showing you or not. But I
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`know that you also have the hardcopies, so you're -- you
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`can do either.
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` THE WITNESS: Okay.
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` MR. CHIBIB: But on the screen, he may be
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`pointing to things and, you know, using the cursor, and
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`www.veritext.com
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 10
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`
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`Page 11
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`you may want to watch that.
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` THE WITNESS: Okay, yeah. I wasn't sure
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`whether -- I'll just kind of watch and ask questions if
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`they come up, but I wasn't sure about that -- the
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`digital part. I do have -- I do have a folder opened
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`with the Exhibit Share.
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` MR. GODFREY: Okay. And I've put up on
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`my screen, an electronic copy of Exhibit 2006.
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`BY MR. GODFREY:
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` Q Do you see that?
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` A Yes.
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` Q Exhibit 2006 is titled, Affidavit of Stephanie
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`Forsythe. Do you recognize this exhibit?
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` A Yes, I do.
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` Q Who wrote this affidavit?
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` A I wrote this together with our lawyers.
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` Q Did you carefully review this affidavit before
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`signing it to ensure it was accurate?
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` A Yes, I did. But as I mentioned earlier, we
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`did discover this week through Todd's deposition that
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`there is one typing error.
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` Q Is the error you are referencing in paragraph
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`17 of your affidavit, and more particularly, in this
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`sentence that I've highlighted here?
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` A Yes. So that sentence should read, "In the
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 11
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`Page 12
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`foreground is a softroom, in the background is" -- it
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`should say, "is another softroom," not "another
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`softwall." And the fact that it says, "another,"
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`obviously just is a typing error, "that is secured to a
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`wall for support at one end and has fallen over or
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`collapsed on the other end."
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` Yeah, so if -- yeah if we -- I -- I can
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`describe it more clearly if we go to this photo.
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` Q Yeah, we may come back to this. I just wanted
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`to confirm the error that you were referencing earlier.
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`Are there any other errors or typos that you're aware of
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`in your affidavit?
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` A Not -- not that I'm aware of.
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` Q Okay. I'd like to direct your attention to
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`page 4 of that affidavit, and in particular, these two
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`photographs that are in paragraph 11. Do you see those?
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` A Yes, I do.
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` Q Okay. Please look at the photo on the left to
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`start. In the background left of this photo, is an
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`expanded softwall prototype; correct?
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` A That is correct.
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` Q And in the background, middle, and right of
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`the photo, are two expanded softblock prototypes;
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`correct?
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` A In the background, yes. Middle and right;
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 12
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`Page 13
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`that is correct.
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` Q Is the expanded softwall prototype in this
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`photo attached to anything?
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` A I don't actually remember if the end of that
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`one -- it very well might have. One end might have
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`been -- one or more ends might have been attached to
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`something, but I -- I can't actually remember.
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` Q Were you able to see any attachments such as
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`that in this photo?
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` A No, because both ends of the wall are hidden
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`in the photo.
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` Q Are there any temporary weights such as books,
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`on top of the softwall prototype in this photo in the
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`left?
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` A There could be, but again, because the ends of
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`the wall are hidden from view, and there's a good chance
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`they are there, but the -- we had to stage these photos
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`in order to -- so we were obviously being careful not to
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`show things like books or awkward things, staging a view
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`or our concept or the expression of the idea that we
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`had.
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` Q You are not able to actually see any books or
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`other weights in this photo; correct?
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` A No, I can't see anything like that.
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` Q And now, with regard to the photo on the
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 13
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`right, on the right side of that photo, is that another
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`Page 14
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`expanded softwall prototype?
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` A Yes, it is.
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` Q And in the left in the background, is that
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`another expanded softblock prototype?
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` A Yes, it is.
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` Q Is the softwall prototype in this photo
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`attached to anything?
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` A I don't believe it is. I don't think it's
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`attached to anything, that one, just because I know the
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`room and that there wouldn't be something -- I'm pretty
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`sure it's not attached.
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` Q Okay. I am going to direct your attention to
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`page 6 of your affidavit.
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` A It is important to note that despite the fact
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`that they're not attached to anything, doesn't mean that
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`they're stable.
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` Q Okay. Paragraph 16 to 18 of your affidavit,
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`so starting on page 6 and then carrying over onto page
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`7, "Describe your participation in the 2003 Design
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`Beyond East and West Competition"; do you see that?
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` A Yes.
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` Q And I'm going to say DBEW as shorthand for
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`Design Beyond East and West; do you understand that
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`shorthand?
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`www.veritext.com
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 14
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` A Yes.
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` Q When did you first learn about the DBEW
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`competition?
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` A I don't recall exactly when we learned about
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`it, but we were working on it in 2002.
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` Q How did you learn about the DBEW competition?
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` A That I don't remember either. It was early
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`days for internet resources to find these kind of
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`things. And so a lot of the -- some of the competitions
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`we were entering and looking at at the time, it was
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`often through magazines. So journals -- architectural
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`journals -- and it's possible that that's how we learned
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`about it, but that was the usual source at the time.
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` Q Do you have any actual memory today of
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`specifically how you learned about the competition?
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` A No, I don't have any actual memory of how we
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`learned about that competition.
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` Q Why did you choose to participate in the 2003
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`DBEW Competition?
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` A We were very interested at the time in looking
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`at -- we were specifically looking for different
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`competitions that would help us explore our interest in
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`flexible space-making. And particularly in housing, but
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`not only in housing. And we liked the idea that these
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`competitions that were taking place in different
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 15
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`countries could expand our perspective and let us view
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`the subject that we were already considering from
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`different vantage points.
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` And it would be -- we also liked the
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`competitions because they gave us a deadline and a way
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`of, kind of -- kind of, putting together, formulating
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`ideas into a kind of, a package, and then standing back
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`and looking at it. We graduated from university in
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`2000, and so this was a period where we felt we had a
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`few more years to act like students, but we really were
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`trying to give shape to how we wanted -- what direction
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`we wanted the work we were going to do for the rest of
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`our lives to take.
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` Q Can you describe what was involved in entering
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`the DBEW Competition, what you had to do?
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` A Yes. So at this competition, like many of the
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`competitions we were doing at the time, had --
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`specific -- they give everybody specific formats that
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`the work, in this case, had to be submitted on physical
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`boards. So we would print -- and of a specific size,
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`and a specific number, and mounted to, kind of, foam
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`board type board, and then physically mailed to the
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`competition organizers.
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` And this competition, like most of the
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`competitions we entered, needed to be anonymous. So
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 16
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`your information of who you are is in a sealed envelope
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`that's included in the package, but the judges don't
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`look at any of that until after they've chosen winners.
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` Q At some point, you went to the DBEW website to
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`get the submission requirements and to register for the
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`competition; is that correct?
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` A I'm not 100 percent sure if we found out that
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`information online or on -- in a magazine.
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` Q I'm just in the process of uploading what's
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`going to be marked as Exhibit 1021.
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` (Exhibit 1021 was marked for
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` identification.)
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` Okay. Exhibit 1021 includes excerpts from the
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`DBEW website. And page 1 of Exhibit 1021 lists some
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`general rules for the 2003 DBEW Competition. Let me
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`zoom in here.
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` And in No. 1, it says, "All the entrants must
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`register for the competition entry. Registration is
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`completed by entering at the membership through the
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`competition website." Do you see that?
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` A Yes, I do.
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` Q Does that refresh your memory as to whether
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`you registered for the 2003 DBEW Competition through the
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`DBEW website?
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` A It doesn't refresh my memory, but we obviously
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 17
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`must have if that was the rule.
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` Q You have no reason to doubt that you followed
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`the rule?
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` A No, I don't have a reason to doubt that.
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` Q In the top left of Exhibit 1021, there's a
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`colorful logo for Hanssem. Do you know what Hanssem's
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`relationship is to the DBEW Competition?
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` A I vaguely remember looking them up at the
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`time, but it was a long time ago. And to my -- the best
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`of my memory, they are a Korean manufacturer of
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`furniture or kitchens, or some kind of something related
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`to the building industry. Yeah, but I can't -- I really
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`can't remember any details about them.
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` Q I'd like to direct your attention to page 4 of
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`Exhibit 1021. Page 4 lists submission requirements for
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`the DBEW International Design Competition 2003; do you
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`see this?
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` A Yes.
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` Q And at the top of the page it says, "The works
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`can be submitted only once, either by mail or online;"
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`do you see that?
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` A Yes.
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` Q Was your submission to the 2003 DBEW
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`Competition by mail or online?
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` A It was by mail. I remember printing them off,
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`www.veritext.com
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 18
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`and I can remember them being mounted on foam board, and
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`I would -- dropping -- dropping them off at UPS.
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` Q A little bit further down on the page under
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`the heading, "Application Form," it says, "- by mail:
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`download an application form and print, fill out, and
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`send it with every entry"; do you see that?
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` A Yes.
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` Q Did you download an application form from the
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`DBEW website and submit it by mail?
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` A I don't remember, but if that's how they're
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`saying it was done, I don't have any reason to doubt
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`that that's -- that was the process.
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` Q A little bit further down on page 4, under the
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`heading, "submissions by mail or direct delivery," there
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`are requirements for submission by mail. And one of the
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`requirements calls for submissions to be on A3-sized
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`paper only; do you see that?
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` A Yes.
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` Q Were the images you submitted to the 2003 DBEW
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`Competition on A3-sized paper?
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` A They were A3-sized, but they were mounted
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`on -- on something. "Do not mount" -- oh, it says, "Do
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`not mount the printout," that's funny, "with any
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`backing." It's funny, I can swear I can remember them
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`being mounted, but yeah. But we would have followed the
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 19
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`guidelines, yes.
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` Q Okay. So you would have submitted A3-sized
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`printouts of your images?
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` A Yes -- yes.
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` Q And the next requirement for mail submission
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`says, "Maximum of five presentations can be submitted";
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`do you see that?
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` A Yes.
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` Q In your DBEW 2003 submission included five
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`presentations or panels of A3-size; correct?
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` A Yes. It had five -- I believe that's right.
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`Five panels. I don't have that in front of me though.
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`That sounds right, but --
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` Q The next submission requirement says, "Attach
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`a label on the back of every presentation item, report
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`drawing, and image. The label form is downloadable from
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`the competition website"; do you see that?
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` A Yes, I do.
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` Q Did you download the label form from the DBEW
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`website and attach labels to the back of your submission
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`items?
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` A One of Todd or I must have if that was the
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`rule, yeah.
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` Q And the next submission requirement by mail is
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`submission of a CD. And specifically, under subsection
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 20
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`A, it says, "A CD in which data files of all
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`presentations for an entry are -- must be enclosed"; do
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`Page 21
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`you see that?
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` A Yes, I do.
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` Q Did your DBEW 2003 submission include a CD
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`containing data files for your softhousing imaging and
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`other presentation materials?
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` A I -- if -- I assume it must have. We would
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`have followed the rules of the -- the entry. I don't
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`remember any of that level of detail.
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` Q But you have no reason to doubt that you
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`submitted a CD as required here?
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` A I have no reason to doubt.
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` Q Subsection B of the CD requirement says, "All
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`files in the CD should be made in accordance with
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`general rules"; do you see that?
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` A Yes.
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` Q Now, I am going to jump back to page 1 of
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`Exhibit 1021, in the general rules. And in particular,
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`let's look at Rule 8b. Under 8b, it says, "For data
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`files, only DWG, JPEG, PDF, or ZIP compressed from these
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`three formats are permitted"; do you see that?
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` A Yes.
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` Q The data files you submitted to the 2003 DBEW
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`Competition included JPEGs of your five presentation
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 21
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`panels; correct?
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` A I don't remember whether it was JPEGs or PDFs.
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`It would have been the two most likely. We drew the
`
`overall designs for the panels -- composed them in
`
`different software, CorelDRAW, so that wouldn't have
`
`been -- isn't one of these, so they would have been
`
`converted to something that was allowable, but I don't
`
`remember what they were converted to. Probably PDF.
`
`That would be the most usual thing to do.
`
` Q And the data files you submitted to DBEW were
`
`later posted on the DBEW website; correct?
`
` A I don't know. I don't remember.
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` Q Do you still have a copy of your submission
`
`materials for the 2003 DBEW Competition?
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` A We have the original CorelDRAW file, and I
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`recently had my father convert it to a PDF for me
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`because I don't have that software anymore. So we have
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`a PDF version of it as well.
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` Q When did you last review the submission
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`materials that you have?
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` A During the course of this case and that's when
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`I asked my father to convert the original files for me.
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` Q Why did you review your submission materials?
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`And again, I don't want to know about any conversation
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`between you and your counsel.
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 22
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` A It was to provide those to our counsel.
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` Q Do you have a copy of the CD for your 2003
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`DBEW submission?
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` A No, not that I know of. We don't have
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`anything to put a CD in.
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` Q Apart from the CorelDRAW file and the
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`converted PDF, do you have any other electronic files
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`for the materials from your 2003 DBEW submission?
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` A There are PDFs that were created
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`post-competition win of that work, shortly after the
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`competition win to -- in order to share it with press
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`and -- and in general.
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` Q And were those PDF files also created by
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`converting the CorelDRAW file into PDF?
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` A Sorry. Say that again, the question?
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` Q The PDFs that you just referenced that were
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`created post-win, were those PDFs generated by
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`converting the CorelDRAW file that you described
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`earlier?
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` A Yes, but we -- we did some -- the only real
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`changes we would have done to those along the way --
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`one, would putting our names on it, on the front,
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`because the -- the front of the presentation for the
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`competition would have had to have been anonymous. And
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`then, as we, kind of, developed the ideas around
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 23
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`softhousing, softwall, we were -- those became, kind of,
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`working documents in a way and are -- so some of the --
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`as time went along, some of the PDFs that were created
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`might have had different annotations and notes as we
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`were thinking about and developing the ideas -- the
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`text. The images stayed primarily the same, I believe,
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`as we created things -- or documents.
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` Q Okay. So you'd -- you'd have the same images
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`you submitted to DBEW, but you might add or change some
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`of the text that was accompanying those images; is that
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`correct?
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` A Yeah, in order to explain the idea. So as we
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`sent news of this concept to different magazines and to
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`tell them about -- and explain the concept and make it a
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`little clearer. One thing is we -- we also knew when we
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`submitted the design, that it was being submitted to an
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`international jury panel of jurors from four different
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`countries, representing English and non-English speaking
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`countries. And so it was a very visual presentation for
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`the most part, and it was also, kind of, early in the
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`conceptual timeline of the work.
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` Q Let's switch back to Exhibit 2006, your
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`affidavit. And I'd like to look at paragraph 17.
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`Paragraph 17 starts out, it reads, "For the 2003 Design
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`Beyond East and West Competition, MacAllen and I
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 24
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`submitted prototypes of our softrooms and softwalls,
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`which at the time did not have folding end panels or
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`supports." What did you mean by that?
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` A That this was very early conceptual stage
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`of -- of expressing the idea. So we hadn't worked out
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`any of the design details of how these structures could
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`be freestanding, for example. And -- in -- and even in
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`this case, we weren't even trying to make them
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`freestanding. We were in -- in Design Beyond East and
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`West, we were focused on to make this apartment of a
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`given size very flexible. And so we had flexible rooms
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`and flexible walls. And -- but -- but didn't take the
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`design details beyond what's shown in those boards.
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` Q What did you mean when you say, "the softwalls
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`at the time, did not have folding end panels or
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`supports"?
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` A So our current softwalls are -- have folding
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`end panels to give them structural stability. And at
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`this stage of Design Beyond East and West, we hadn't
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`developed that design.
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` Q Did you mean that these prototype softwalls
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`did not have folding end panels that were different from
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`the polyethylene panels of the core structure?
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` A Can you repeat the question?
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` Q Yeah. Do you mean that the prototype softwall
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`Petitioner Chanel, Inc. Exhibit 1050, Page 25
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`you had, it didn't have end panels that were different
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`from the polyethylene sheets that make up the core of
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`the honeycomb structure? The prototypes lacked anything
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`different at the ends; is that correct?
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` A The prototypes of the flexible walls in the
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`competition lacked anything different at the ends.
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`Yeah, they -- they didn't -- they really just expressed
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`the concept that you could have a wall that
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