RIMFROST AS VS.
`AKER BIOMARINE ANTARCTIC AS
`
`DR. STEPHEN J. TALLON
`October 7, 2019
`
`Original File 285817.txt
`Min-U-Script® with Word Index
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0000
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`AKER BIOMARINE ANTARCTIC AS
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`DR. STEPHEN J. TALLON
`October 7, 2019
`
`Original File 285817.txt
`Min-U-Script® with Word Index
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0000
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`1
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` 1 UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
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` 2 BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
` ------------------------------------------------x
` 3 RIMFROST AS,
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` 4 Petitioner,
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` 5 vs.
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` 6 AKER BIOMARINE ANTARCTIC AS,
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` 7 Patent Owner.
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` 8 CASE NUMBER: IPR 2018-01730
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` 9 U.S. Patent No. 9,072,752
` ------------------------------------------------x
`10
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`11 4 Century Drive
` Parsippany, New Jersey
`12
` October 7, 2019
`13 8:55 a.m.
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`14
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`15 Title: BIOEFFECTIVE KRILL OIL COMPOSITIONS
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`16 TRANSCRIPT OF DEPOSITION OF
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`17 DR. STEPHEN J. TALLON
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`18 TRANSCRIPT of the stenographic notes of
` the proceedings in the above-entitled matter, as
`19 taken by and before TAB PREWETT, a Registered
` Professional Reporter, a Certified LiveNote
`20 Reporter, Certified Shorthand Reporter and Notary
` Public.
`21
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`22
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`23 ELLEN GRAUER COURT REPORTING CO. LLC
` 126 East 56th Street, Fifth Floor
`24 New York, New York 10022
` 212-750-6434
`25 REF: 285817
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0001
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` 1 A P P E A R A N C E S:
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` 3 HOFFMAN & BARON LLP
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` 4 Attorneys for Aker Biomarine Antarctic
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` 5 4 Century Drive, Suite 300
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` 6 Parsippany, New Jersey 07054-4606
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` 7 BY: MICHAEL I. CHAKANSKY, ESQ.
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` 8 Phone No. 1 973-331-1700
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` 9 mchakansky@hbiplaw.com
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`10
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`11 CASIMIR JONES S.C.
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`12 Attorneys for Rimfrost
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`13 2275 Deming Way, Suite 310
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`14 Middleton, Wisconsin 53562
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`15 BY: J. MITCHELL JONES, ESQ.
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`16 Phone No. 1 606-662-1277
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`17 jmjones@casimirjones.com
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0002
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` 1 ------------------- I N D E X -------------------
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` 2 WITNESS EXAMINATION BY PAGE
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` 3 DR. STEPHEN J. TALLON MR. JONES 4
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` 4
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` 5
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` 6 ---------------- E X H I B I T S ----------------
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` 7 RIMFROST DESCRIPTION FOR I.D.
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` 8 PREVIOUSLY MARKED
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` 9 Exhibit 1009 PCT Publication W 5
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`10 02007123424, Catchpole
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`11 Patent, Document
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`12
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`13
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`14 (EXHIBIT RETAINED BY ATTORNEY)
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`15
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`17
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0003
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` 1 D R. S T E P H E N J. T A L L O N,
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` 2 G9 Gracefield Road,
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` 3 Lower Hutt, New Zealand,
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` 4 having been duly sworn by the notary public to
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` 5 testify to the truth, testified as follows:
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` 6
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` 7 DIRECT EXAMINATION
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` 8 BY MR. JONES:
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` 9 Q Good morning, Dr. Tallon. So as
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`10 part of the procedure -- we have been through a
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`11 number of these -- do you have any questions
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`12 about the conduct of deposition proceedings?
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`13 A No, I think I am ready to go.
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`14 Q Okay. Good.
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`15 So I will provide you with a copy
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`16 of Exhibit 1086, which is entitled:
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`17 "Reply and Opposition Declaration
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`18 of Dr. Stephen Tallon for IPR 201801730 for US
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`19 patent number 9,072,752."
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`20 And if you will turn to the page,
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`21 the last page, which is page 0159.
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`22 A Okay.
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`23 Q And that's your signature?
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`24 A That's correct.
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`25 Q Okay. Okay. So I'm also going to
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0004
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 provide you with a copy of Rimfrost Exhibit 1009,
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` 3 which is PCT publication W 02007123424, which I
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` 4 think generally has been referred to as
`
` 5 Catchpole. Okay so I would like you refer you to
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` 6 paragraph 12 of your declaration.
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` 7 (Previously Marked Exhibit Rimfrost
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` 8 No. 1009, Publication W 02007123424,
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` 9 Catchpole Patent, Document is introduced
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`10 into the proceedings.)
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`11 A Okay.
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`12 Q And there you say the statement
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`13 that:
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`14 "Catchpole by itself in a single
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`15 reference discloses to a POSITA greater than
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`16 5 percent, 6 percent, and 7 percent, and from
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`17 6 percent to 10 percent (in the amended claims)
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`18 ether phospholipids by weight in krill oil."
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`19 So the question I have relates to
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`20 the 6 and 7 percent ether phospholipid limitation
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`21 and the 6 to 10 percent ether phospholipid
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`22 limitation.
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`23 Where does Catchpole specifically
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`24 disclose a krill oil containing either 6 percent
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`25 or 7 percent ether phospholipids or from
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0005
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`6
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 6 percent to 10 percent ether phospholipids?
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` 3 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection. Lack of
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` 4 foundation.
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` 5 A That is the focus of a reasonably
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` 6 substantial section of my declaration. So if you
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` 7 read on, it explains what I mean by this.
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` 8 But to give you a very quick
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` 9 summary, the Catchpole -- specific here to
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`10 concentration of ether phospholipids -- keeping
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`11 in mind that Catchpole has got broader aims than
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`12 that -- but a very brief summary related to ether
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`13 phospholipids, Catchpole describe the types of
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`14 materials that you should use for making an ether
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`15 lipid concentrate.
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`16 It gives a specific example of
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`17 doing an extraction from the krill meal. It
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`18 talks about the different methods that you should
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`19 apply to get to high levels of ether lipids,
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`20 describes desirable targets for ether lipids.
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`21 He talked about the 6 and
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`22 7 percent. Catchpole talks about, you know,
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`23 concentrations, for example, up to 10 percent
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`24 ether lipids as a desirable target, and, you
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`25 know, as I talk about in my declaration,
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0006
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`7
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 describes the methods to make those.
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` 3 So to my mind that's a disclosure
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` 4 of ether phospholipid content certainly in the
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` 5 ranges described here.
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` 6 Q That's -- that's not the question I
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` 7 asked you.
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` 8 Where does Catchpole disclose a
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` 9 krill oil with 6 percent ether phospholipids?
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`10 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection. Lack of
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`11 foundation. You can answer.
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`12 A Well, that was kind of exactly what
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`13 I just answered. You look at the patent as a
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`14 whole, and that's what it describes.
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`15 Q Okay. So I would like to direct
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`16 your attention to page 0024 of Exhibit 1009, and
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`17 example 18, "Fractionation of krill lipids."
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`18 A Yep.
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`19 Q And you see in table 16 that that
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`20 discloses that extract two has 4.8 percent AAPC
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`21 and AAPE?
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`22 MR. CHAKANSKY: You mean the sum of
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`23 them, right?
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`24 MR. JONES: The sum, yeah.
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`25 MR. CHAKANSKY: Okay.
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0007
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`8
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 A Yes, that's --
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` 3 Q And AAPC and AAPE are ether
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` 4 phospholipids, correct?
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` 5 A That's correct.
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` 6 Q Is there another example of an
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` 7 extract -- let's see -- strike that.
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` 8 Is there another example of a krill
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` 9 oil or extract in Catchpole that contains greater
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`10 than 4.8 percent ether phospholipids?
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`11 A Example 18 is the only specific one
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`12 that gives the results for a krill oil extract.
`
`13 Q So there is no other example in
`
`14 Catchpole disclosing a krill oil extract with
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`15 greater than 4.8 percent ether phospholipids; is
`
`16 that correct?
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`17 A Not examples. But there's a lot of
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`18 other content in the patent that refers to krill
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`19 oil and to concentration of ether phospholipids.
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`20 Q Okay. Staying on example 18 in
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`21 Exhibit 1009, the first three lines, it indicates
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`22 that the feed material is freeze dried krill
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`23 powder; is that correct?
`
`24 A That's correct.
`
`25 Q And I would like to direct your
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0008
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`9
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 attention to the page 0060 of your declaration on
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` 3 paragraph 82.
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` 4 A Okay.
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` 5 Q And there you refer to the feed
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` 6 material as freeze dried krill powder, correct?
`
` 7 A That's correct.
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` 8 Q Okay. Okay. So then staying on
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` 9 your declaration, Exhibit 1086, I would like to
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`10 direct your attention to paragraph 16.
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`11 MR. CHAKANSKY: What page is that?
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`12 MR. JONES: Page 0015.
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`13 MR. CHAKANSKY: Thank you.
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`14 Q And it's a bit out of register
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`15 because the exhibit page is 0015 and the actual
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`16 declaration page is 11.
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`17 MR. CHAKANSKY: Yeah.
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`18 MR. JONES: But so we will refer to
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`19 the page numbers following the exhibit.
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`20 MR. CHAKANSKY: The one that starts
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`21 with "Rimfrost."
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`22 MR. JONES: Yes.
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`23 MR. CHAKANSKY: Off the record.
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`24 (There was a discussion off the
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`25 record.)
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0009
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 MR. CHAKANSKY: We are back on.
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` 3 Q So I am going to ask a couple of
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` 4 questions about paragraph 16.
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` 5 MR. CHAKANSKY: Do you want to read
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` 6 the whole paragraph?
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` 7 Q Take your time to review it.
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` 8 A Okay.
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` 9 Q Okay. So on paragraph 16, you are
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`10 talking about example 18, "Fractionation of krill
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`11 lipids" in Exhibit 1009; is that correct?
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`12 A That's correct.
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`13 Q And there in the second line or in
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`14 the first and second lines you refer to krill oil
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`15 extracted from the feed material, correct?
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`16 A That's correct.
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`17 Q And that feed material is the
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`18 freeze dried krill powder, correct?
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`19 A Yeah, indirectly. There is a -- as
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`20 it goes on to say, there were two stages in the
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`21 extraction. But the original feed material is
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`22 the freeze dried krill powder referred to in the
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`23 example.
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`24 Q Okay. And then if you go to the
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`25 top of page 0016, in the first three sentences,
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0010
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 you refer to a freeze dried krill meal, and then
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` 3 followed -- and then followed by extraction of
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` 4 the remaining krill meal using CO2 in 11 percent
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` 5 ethanol co-solvent.
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` 6 Do you see that?
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` 7 A I see that.
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` 8 Q So -- and then are you using the
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` 9 term "freeze dried krill powder" interchangeably
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`10 with "freeze dried krill meal" and "krill meal"?
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`11 A Well, let me -- well, tell me which
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`12 ones you want me to explain.
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`13 But, for example, in the second
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`14 line of page 0016, where it says "freeze dried
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`15 krill meal," in the terminology used in the
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`16 actual Catchpole patent example, it is the --
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`17 it's referring to the same thing as what's
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`18 described by Catchpole as the "freeze dried krill
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`19 powder."
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`20 Q Okay.
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`21 A If that clarifies the point for
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`22 you.
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`23 Q I would like to refer you to
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`24 paragraphs 29 and 30 of Exhibit 1086, page 0021.
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`25 MR. CHAKANSKY: And, again, I
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0011
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`12
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 suggest you read it.
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` 3 A Okay.
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` 4 Q And do you see in paragraph 29 it
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` 5 says:
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` 6 "Further supporting the disclosure
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` 7 of krill meal as a suitable feed source"?
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` 8 A Yep.
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` 9 Q And when you refer to "krill meal,"
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`10 the disclosure of "krill meal as a suitable feed
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`11 source," are you referring to the "freeze dried
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`12 krill powder" disclosed in example 18 of
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`13 Exhibit 1009?
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`14 A No, the paragraph in 29 is a bit
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`15 more general than the specific example.
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`16 Q Okay. Looking at paragraph 30 of
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`17 Exhibit 1086, you see the statement that:
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`18 "Of the feed materials and specific
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`19 examples disclosed by Catchpole, the extract,
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`20 extract two, of the krill meal of example 18
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`21 contains the highest level of ether
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`22 phospholipids."
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`23 Do you see that?
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`24 A Yep.
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`25 Q And does the "krill meal" referred
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0012
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 to in paragraph 30 refer to the "freeze dried
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` 3 krill powder" of example 18 of Exhibit 1009?
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` 4 A That was the original material that
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` 5 the -- that the extract -- the original material
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` 6 that exact two came from.
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` 7 Q And that original material is
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` 8 freeze dried krill powder, correct?
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` 9 A In example 18 of Catchpole, that's
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`10 correct.
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`11 Q And then paragraph 30 goes on to
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`12 state that:
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`13 "Further supporting the disclosure
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`14 of krill meal as a preferred source for achieving
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`15 greater than 5 percent, greater than 10 percent,
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`16 and higher levels of ether phospholipids are
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`17 claimed in the invention."
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`18 And is the "krill meal" referred to
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`19 there the "freeze dried krill powder" of example
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`20 18?
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`21 A No, in that case, it's a slightly
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`22 more general use of the term "krill meal."
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`23 Q Does Exhibit 1009 contain a
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`24 declaration of any other krill feed material
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`25 other than freeze dried krill powder?
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0013
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 A Well, I need to read back through
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` 3 to say that for certain.
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` 4 But the patent does refer in
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` 5 places, in general, to "krill meal" -- well, to
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` 6 krill as a -- as a source. And, you know,
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` 7 turning krill into a meal was a reasonably
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` 8 well-established sort of process. And I mean
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` 9 "krill meal" itself is a reasonably broad term as
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`10 well.
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`11 But there are -- yeah, there are
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`12 places in the patent that refer to -- otherwise
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`13 to krill in general. And for that matter, the --
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`14 I mean, the krill feed material, as far as the --
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`15 the Catchpole patent is concerned, I mean, it
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`16 doesn't have to be just the krill meal. It could
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`17 even be an extract from krill that fits the kind
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`18 of definition of the "feed material" as far as
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`19 the Catchpole patent goes.
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`20 Q The question, though, I asked:
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`21 Does Exhibit 1009 Catchpole
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`22 specifically disclose "krill meal"?
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`23 MR. CHAKANSKY: If you can answer
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`24 without looking at the patent.
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`25 A Yeah, two things I can -- two
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0014
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 things say for certain without reading through
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` 3 all the words.
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` 4 Q Then feel free to read through it.
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` 5 A Okay. I can read through and see
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` 6 if the word "meal" itself appears; or maybe there
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` 7 is a -- I don't know if there is a shortcut way
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` 8 where someone can do a quick search for it.
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` 9 But my second comment is, you know,
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`10 regardless of whether the word "meal" itself
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`11 appears, I mean, yes, I see that "krill meal" is
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`12 a fairly standard kind of form for a krill
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`13 starting material. It would be a reasonably
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`14 obvious -- one of the options to use.
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`15 Q Okay. But --
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`16 A Sorry. To answer your question, am
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`17 I going to read through the patent, or can
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`18 someone do -- can someone do a word search?
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`19 MR. CHAKANSKY: I just did a word
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`20 search on an OCR'd dot version of this, and
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`21 I could not find "meal" anywhere.
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`22 A Okay. I am happy to go with that.
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`23 The word "meal" doesn't appear in the Catchpole
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`24 patent.
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`25 Q And the words "krill meal" don't
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0015
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`16
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 appear in the Catchpole patent either; do they?
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` 3 A By association. Yes.
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` 4 Q But Catchpole does describe --
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` 5 okay. So going back to paragraph 30 of your
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` 6 declaration, Exhibit 1086 --
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` 7 A Okay.
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` 8 Q -- is it your testimony that "krill
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` 9 meal" as used in line two of 30, paragraph 30,
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`10 means something different than "krill meal" as
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`11 used in line four of paragraph 30?
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`12 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection to the
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`13 form of the question.
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`14 A But, yeah, that's correct. The
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`15 "krill meal" in line two is referring
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`16 specifically to the krill meal that was detailed
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`17 in the -- or krill powder, if you like, that was
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`18 used in example 18 of Catchpole.
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`19 And my use of the term in the
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`20 line -- in the fourth line is, yeah, a more
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`21 general description of what takes into context
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`22 the whole that the Catchpole patent, what it's
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`23 describing.
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`24 Q Let's go to Paragraph 32 of your
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`25 declaration, Exhibit 1086.
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0016
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`17
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 MR. CHAKANSKY: Could he read 31 as
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` 3 well that leads into 32.
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` 4 MR. JONES: Sure.
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` 5 MR. CHAKANSKY: Okay. I think he's
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` 6 ready.
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` 7 A Okay.
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` 8 Q Okay. So on Paragraph 32, it says:
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` 9 "Krill meal disclosed in that
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`10 example 18 meets all of these criteria."
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`11 A I can see that.
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`12 Q And is that referring to the
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`13 "freeze dried krill powder" disclosed in
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`14 example 18 of Exhibit 1009?
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`15 A That's correct.
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`16 Q So there -- is it correct to say
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`17 then that you used the "freeze dried krill
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`18 powder" as disclosed in example 18 of
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`19 Exhibit 1009 interchangeably with the term "krill
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`20 meal"?
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`21 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection.
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`22 Misstates his testimony.
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`23 A I am referring to the powder that's
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`24 used in example 18 of Catchpole in this case as a
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`25 "krill meal."
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0017
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`18
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 Q Okay.
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` 3 A Well, an example of the "krill
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` 4 meal."
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` 5 Q Okay. Let's move on to
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` 6 Paragraph 33 of Exhibit 106, on page 0023.
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` 7 A Okay.
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` 8 Q And this paragraph provides some
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` 9 quotes from Exhibit 1009, Catchpole, correct?
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`10 A Correct.
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`11 Q And I would like to direct your
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`12 attention to the quote at the bottom of page 0023
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`13 in paragraph 33 where it says:
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`14 "Preferably, the product contains
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`15 more acyl-alkyl [sic] phospholipids and/or
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`16 plasmalogens in the feed material."
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`17 Do you see that sentence?
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`18 A I can see it. Yes.
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`19 Q And does that sentence mean that
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`20 the product can contain a higher mass of
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`21 acyl-alkyl phospholipids and/or plasmalogens than
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`22 the feed material?
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`23 A What do you mean by a "higher
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`24 mass"?
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`25 Q Well, let's see if we can -- I am
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0018
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`19
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 trying to understand what that sentence means.
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` 3 So, say, for example, you had feed
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` 4 material, 100 grams of feed material. And you
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` 5 analyze it, and it -- so let's stick with just
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` 6 phospholipid.
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` 7 Okay. So, first off, let's just
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` 8 stick with phospholipids.
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` 9 Say you have 100 grams of feed
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`10 material. And you analyze it, and it contains
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`11 20 percent phospholipids.
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`12 A Okay.
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`13 Q Okay. So what would the mass of
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`14 the phospholipids be in the feed material then?
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`15 A 20 percent of 100 grams, I think
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`16 you said would be --
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`17 Q Yes.
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`18 A -- nominally 20 grams of
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`19 phospholipids.
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`20 Q Okay. And say you make an extract
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`21 of that feed material.
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`22 A Okay.
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`23 Q And you have a 50 percent yield,
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`24 and it contains -- and you do the analysis, and
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`25 it contains 60 percent by weight phospholipids.
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`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0019
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`20
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` 1 TALLON
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` 2 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection.
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` 3 Incomplete hypothetical.
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` 4 Q What would the mass of
`
` 5 phospholipids be in the extract then?
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` 6 A Yes, you wouldn't achieve that
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` 7 combination of extract yield in composition out
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` 8 of a -- that 100 grams of starting material that
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` 9 you described. If -- I mean -- I mean, 50 grams
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`10 of a lipid extract that has -- I think you said
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`11 60 percent phospholipids -- that would be
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`12 300 grams of phospholipids.
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`13 Q 30 or 300?
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`14 A 300 grams. Did I say 30?
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`15 MR. CHAKANSKY: No.
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`16 A 300.
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`17 Q 60 percent of 50?
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`18 A Yes. 30 grams, you are right.
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`19 Yes, my apologies.
`
`20 Q So in the hypothetical that I just
`
`21 gave, the feed material has 20 grams of biomass
`
`22 of phospholipids. And then the extract you just
`
`23 calculated would have 30 grams of phospholipids;
`
`24 is that correct?
`
`25 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection.
`
`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0020
`
`
`
`21
`
`
` 1 TALLON
`
` 2 Misstates his testimony. And incomplete
`
` 3 hypothetical.
`
` 4 A Would -- would it be useful if I
`
` 5 explain that -- what that sentence means that you
`
` 6 are talking about?
`
` 7 I mean, your -- your hypothetical,
`
` 8 you know, doesn't make sense. You are talking
`
` 9 about a -- I mean, yeah, the sentence here from
`
`10 Catchpole is not saying that you can start
`
`11 with --
`
`12 Q Well, let's stick with the
`
`13 hypothetical.
`
`14 MR. CHAKANSKY: Let him finish.
`
`15 Q Let's stick with the hypothetical
`
`16 first. Then we'll go to the sentence in
`
`17 Catchpole and clarify that.
`
`18 MR. CHAKANSKY: And he was
`
`19 answering when you interrupted him.
`
`20 So if you have anymore to say,
`
`21 please say it.
`
`22 A Yes. Your hypothetical, yes,
`
`23 obviously, it doesn't make sense that you can
`
`24 create an extract that has a greater amount of --
`
`25 a greater mass of a substance than was in the --
`
`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0021
`
`
`
`22
`
`
` 1 TALLON
`
` 2 in the material that it was derived from.
`
` 3 Q So is that impossible?
`
` 4 A Yes. That's impossible.
`
` 5 But -- so coming to the sentence in
`
` 6 Catchpole, I can explain what it means. It's
`
` 7 certainly not referring to that scenario.
`
` 8 Q Okay.
`
` 9 A The section quoted out of
`
`10 Catchpole -- in fact, the quote in my declaration
`
`11 goes on, and, I mean, the context is fairly clear
`
`12 from reading the rest of it.
`
`13 It's referring to -- I mean, it
`
`14 says contains more, in this case, acyl-alkyl
`
`15 phospholipids and/or plasmalogens. It's talking
`
`16 about the concentrations of those components in
`
`17 the -- in that extract fraction.
`
`18 And you can see immediately after
`
`19 that sentence it's talking about concentration,
`
`20 talking about, for example, 5 percent or in
`
`21 10 percent concentrations.
`
`22 Q And just to clarify, though, we are
`
`23 talking about the mass of the material or the
`
`24 weight, not the concentration.
`
`25 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection.
`
`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0022
`
`
`
`23
`
`
` 1 TALLON
`
` 2 Misstates his testimony.
`
` 3 MR. JONES: I haven't even asked a
`
` 4 question yet.
`
` 5 MR. CHAKANSKY: You just -- go
`
` 6 ahead. I think you did.
`
` 7 Q So if we are talking about the mass
`
` 8 of phospholipids as opposed to the concentration
`
` 9 of phospholipids, it's impossible to have a
`
`10 greater mass of phospholipids in the extract than
`
`11 was in the starting material; is that correct?
`
`12 A That's certainly true that, in an
`
`13 extraction or separation process, you are not
`
`14 creating anything. You are just simply taking
`
`15 the mass of material that you start with and
`
`16 separating it into different fractions.
`
`17 So the fractions that you separate
`
`18 it into are going to contain -- you know, in the
`
`19 sum are going to contain the same amount of
`
`20 material as the starting material, both of which
`
`21 will be less than or equal to the amount of
`
`22 material that was in the starting material.
`
`23 MR. JONES: Want to take a break?
`
`24 MR. CHAKANSKY: Sure.
`
`25 (There was a discussion off the
`
`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0023
`
`
`
`24
`
`
` 1 TALLON
`
` 2 record.)
`
` 3 (A break is taken.)
`
` 4 CONTINUED EXAMINATION
`
` 5 BY MR. JONES:
`
` 6 Q So I'd like to direct your
`
` 7 attention to paragraph 92 of your declaration,
`
` 8 Exhibit 1086, which is page 0063.
`
` 9 A Okay.
`
`10 MR. CHAKANSKY: You should read it.
`
`11 Q And as long as you are reading,
`
`12 let's look at paragraph 91 as well, the top of
`
`13 the page.
`
`14 A Okay.
`
`15 Q Okay. So let's refer to paragraph
`
`16 91. There you see that you estimate the amount
`
`17 of neutral lipids in the feed to be 739 grams; is
`
`18 that correct?
`
`19 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection to the
`
`20 form of the question.
`
`21 A Yes, in this case, the example I'm
`
`22 giving here describes a calculation showing a
`
`23 neutral lipid concentration of 739 grams.
`
`24 Q And is it correct to say that
`
`25 that -- that 739 grams is the estimated amount of
`
`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0024
`
`
`
`25
`
`
` 1 TALLON
`
` 2 neutral lipids in the feed material of example 18
`
` 3 of Catchpole?
`
` 4 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection to the
`
` 5 form of the question.
`
` 6 A The context of the discussion
`
` 7 that's in the declaration, yep.
`
` 8 Q Okay. And example 18 of Catchpole
`
` 9 discloses that 650 grams of neutral lipids were
`
`10 extracted in the neat CO2 step; is that correct?
`
`11 MR. CHAKANSKY: He's just looking
`
`12 at it right now.
`
`13 Let the record reflect he's looking
`
`14 at Catchpole page 0024, example 18.
`
`15 A I think what you are asking is
`
`16 where the 650 grams is the mass of neutral
`
`17 lipid -- or at least substantially all neutral
`
`18 lipids that was extracted by Catchpole into
`
`19 extract one.
`
`20 Yes, that's correct.
`
`21 Q Okay. So then is it fair to say
`
`22 that you could divide 650 grams by 739 grams of
`
`23 neutral lipids, as you calculated in paragraph 91
`
`24 of your declaration, to determine the percentage
`
`25 of neutral lipids that were extracted in step one
`
`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0025
`
`
`
`26
`
`
` 1 TALLON
`
` 2 of Catchpole?
`
` 3 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection to the
`
` 4 form of the question.
`
` 5 A You could divide 650 grams out of
`
` 6 Catchpole by the 739 grams estimated neutral
`
` 7 lipid content; and, yeah, you would get an
`
` 8 approximation of the proportion of the total
`
` 9 neutral lipid that was extracted.
`
`10 Q Then I calculate 650 divided by
`
`11 739 grams to be 0.879 percent or -- sorry --
`
`12 87.9 percent, which is rounded to 88 percent.
`
`13 Does that sound correct to you?
`
`14 MR. CHAKANSKY: You want to go and
`
`15 do it yourself or --
`
`16 A No, it sounds approximately
`
`17 correct, if you calculate the ratio of 650 to
`
`18 739.
`
`19 Q Do you want to calculate it or
`
`20 accept 88 percent?
`
`21 A No, I'm okay with the -- with that
`
`22 calculation.
`
`23 Q Okay. Let's move on to
`
`24 paragraph 92.
`
`25 A Okay.
`
`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0026
`
`
`
`27
`
`
` 1 TALLON
`
` 2 Q There in the first sentence you
`
` 3 state that:
`
` 4 "The total" -- "As the total weight
`
` 5 of extract two was 242 grams, the amount of
`
` 6 neutrals in extract two was 37 percent or
`
` 7 89 grams over 242 grams."
`
` 8 Do you see that?
`
` 9 MR. CHAKANSKY: But he also has
`
`10 more to that sentence, so I'll object to
`
`11 the form.
`
`12 A But, yes, I can see that text in
`
`13 the -- in paragraph 92.
`
`14 Q And in the last sentence of
`
`15 paragraph 91, you state that the neutral lipids
`
`16 in extract two was 89 grams weight -- okay.
`
`17 Let's strike that.
`
`18 Okay. So the last sentence of
`
`19 paragraph 91 of your declaration says:
`
`20 "Thus, the neutral lipids in
`
`21 extract two was 89 grams (739 grams minus
`
`22 650 grams) weight for weight krill oil."
`
`23 Do you see that sentence?
`
`24 A I can see it. The -- it looks like
`
`25 a typographical point. It should be that the --
`
`AKER EXHIBIT 2026 PAGE 0027
`
`
`
`28
`
`
` 1 TALLON
`
` 2 yeah -- the extract two was -- it's a finite
`
` 3 extract.
`
` 4 So it should just be describing
`
` 5 that 89 grams is the amount of neutral lipid in
`
` 6 that extract two, so probably strike the "weight
`
` 7 for weight krill oil" -- would be -- would be a
`
` 8 better description of what it means.
`
` 9 Q Yeah, I agree. I agree.
`
`10 So the amount of neutral lipids in
`
`11 extract two is calculated to be 89 grams; is that
`
`12 correct?
`
`13 MR. CHAKANSKY: Objection to the
`
`14 form of the question. Lack of foundation.
`
`15 A In the context of what's described
`
`16 in my declaration and in this particular
`
`17 calculation, 89 grams is the -- the neutral lipid
`
`18 content.
`
`19 Q Okay. And, now, I would like to
`
`20 direct your attention to paragraph 100 of your
`
`21 declaration on page 067, with Exhibit 1086.
`
`22 A Okay.
`
`23 Q And there you state that table 16
`
`24 discloses that extract two weighs 242 grams,
`
`25 correct?
`
`AKER EXHIBI
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