Deposition of:
`Stephen Wicker , MD
`
`June 21, 2019
`
`In the Matter of:
`Intel Corporation Vs. Hera Wireless
`S.A.
`
`Veritext Legal Solutions
`800.808.4958 | calendar-de@veritext.com |
`
`
`Stephen Wicker , MD
`
`June 21, 2019
`
`In the Matter of:
`Intel Corporation Vs. Hera Wireless
`S.A.
`
`Veritext Legal Solutions
`800.808.4958 | calendar-de@veritext.com |
`
`
`
`Stephen Wicker , MD
`
`Page 1
`
` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`
` ------------------------------------------------
`
` INTEL CORPORATION,
`
` Petitioner,
`
` -vs-
`
` HERA WIRELESS S.A.,
`
` Patent Owner.
`
` Case IPR2018-01700, Patent 7,369,898
`
` Case IPR2018-01701, Patent 7,454,234 B2
`
` Case IPR2018-01702, Patent 7,873,389
`
` ------------------------------------------------
`
` Deposition of STEPHEN B. WICKER, Ph.D.,
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` held at the Marriott Ithaca Downtown,
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` Ithaca, New York, on June 21, 2019, before
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` PAMELA PALOMEQUE, NYRCR, RPR, CRR, and
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` Notary Public in and for the State of
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` New York.
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 2
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` APPEARANCES:
` For the Petitioner:
` PERKINS COIE
` Attorneys at Law
` 2901 North Central Avenue
` Suite 2000
` Phoenix, AZ 85012-2788
` BY: TYLER R. BOWEN, ESQ.
` 602.351.8448
` TBowen@perkinscoie.com
`
` For the Patent Owner:
` DEVLIN LAW FIRM, LLC
` Attorneys at Law
` 1526 Gilpin Avenue
` Wilmington, DE 19806
` BY: SRIKANT CHERUVU, ESQ.
` 302.449.9010
` scheruvu@devlinlawfirm.com
`
` * * *
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 3
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` EXAMINATIONS
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` Page Line
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` 1. Stephen B. Wicker, Ph.D.
`
` EXAMINATION BY MR. CHERUVU 4 23
` EXAMINATION BY MR. BOWEN 184 4
` EXAMINATION BY MR. CHERUVU 185 4
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` * * *
`
` EXHIBITS
` No. Description Page Line
` 1 Declaration of Dr. Wicker re: US . 4 1
` Patent number 7,369,878,
` 2 Declaration of Dr. Wicker re: US . 4 4
` Patent number 7,454,234
` 3 Declaration of Dr. Wicker re: US . 4 7
` Patent number 7,873,389
` 4 US Patent number 7,369,878........ 4 10
` 5 US Patent number 7,454,234........ 4 13
` 6 US Patent number 7,873,389........ 4 16
` 7 International Patent Application . 69 25
` number WO 99/59263, Park
` 8 US Patent Application ............ 110 23
` 2001/0014588, Ishida
` 9 US Patent number 7,158,493, ..... 154 23
` Uhlik
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 4
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` (Wicker Exhibit 1, Declaration of
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` Dr. Wicker re: US Patent number 7,369,878,
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` marked for identification, this date.)
`
` (Wicker Exhibit 2, Declaration of
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` Dr. Wicker re: US Patent number 7,454,234,
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` marked for identification, this date.)
`
` (Wicker Exhibit 3, Declaration of
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` Dr. Wicker re: US Patent number 7,873,389,
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` marked for identification, this date.)
`
` (Wicker Exhibit 4, US Patent number
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` 7,369,878, marked for identification, this
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` date.)
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` (Wicker Exhibit 5, US Patent number
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` 7,454,234, marked for identification, this
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` date.)
`
` (Wicker Exhibit 6, US Patent number
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` 7,873,389, marked for identification, this
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` date.)
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` S T E P H E N B. W I C K E R, Ph.D., having been
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` called as a witness, being duly sworn by the notary
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` public present, testified as follows:
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` EXAMINATION BY MR. CHERUVU:
`
` Q. Good morning, Dr. Wicker.
`
` A. Good morning.
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 5
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` Q. My name is Srikant Cheruvu. I represent Hera
`
` Wireless in the Intel versus Hera IPR concerning the
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` '878, '234 and '898 patents. I can present those
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` patents to you as exhibits but have you had your
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` deposition taken before?
`
` A. Yes, I have.
`
` Q. Approximately how many times?
`
` A. 90 to 100.
`
` Q. Very good. So you know exactly what the
`
` rules are and let's just go over the ground rules.
`
` A. That's fine.
`
` Q. You understand that the deposition you're
`
` giving is related to two, in fact three Declarations you
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` submitted in three related IPRs?
`
` A. That's correct.
`
` Q. In the deposition I'm going to ask you
`
` questions and to the extent you can, you'll provide
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` answers.
`
` A. That's fine.
`
` Q. And we don't have video today so all of our
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` communications should be verbal so please don't nod your
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` head as an answer or --
`
` A. Understood.
`
` Q. Now, I'll try not to talk over you and please
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` don't talk over me either and if there's any problem, if
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 6
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` you have any problem with the question or anything I say
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` is unclear, you need clarification, definitely feel free
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` to ask me.
`
` A. Okay, that's fine.
`
` Q. I just want to let you know that we're here
`
` to figure out where we agree and where we don't and I
`
` just want to get a clear record. So to that extent it
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` would be great if we work together to that goal.
`
` A. That's fine.
`
` Q. Do you understand you're under oath today?
`
` A. Yes, I do.
`
` Q. And you understand that all the information
`
` you give can be used in front of the PTAB?
`
` A. That's my understanding.
`
` Q. Is there anything that would prevent you from
`
` testifying truthfully and accurately today?
`
` A. I have a touch of a cold but I don't think
`
` that would be a problem. I may ask you to repeat things
`
` if I don't hear you clearly. Other than that, we're
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` fine.
`
` Q. Can you describe to me how you became engaged
`
` in this -- these matters?
`
` A. Certainly. I was called by the Perkins
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` firm, I can't remember the exact date, but it was
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` probably going on two years ago, a year and a half ago,
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 7
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` and asked if this was an area I was familiar with and if
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` I would be willing to make comments about the technology
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` in an IPR Declaration.
`
` Q. Now, was that -- were you contacted by the
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` Perkins firm because you had some specific familiarity
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` with the technology at issue?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form.
`
` A. It's my understanding that they contacted me
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` because of my expertise in the field.
`
` Q. Now, I've had the Court Reporter mark most of
`
` the exhibits in advance so let me start by presenting
`
` you with Exhibit 1, Exhibit Wicker 1, which is your
`
` Declaration in the '878 patent IPR, and just to be clear
`
` for the record that is --
`
` A. Is this for counsel and I'll take that one?
`
` Q. Yeah.
`
` A. Okay.
`
` Q. You don't need to review the Declaration,
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` I'll ask some preliminary questions on these and Exhibit
`
` Wicker 2 is your Declaration, IPR number 1701, I think
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` concerning the '234 patent.
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` A. Okay.
`
` Q. And Exhibit Wicker 3 is your Declaration in
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` IPR number 1703 which is concerning the '389 patent.
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 8
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` A. Thank you.
`
` Q. Now, for most of the deposition today I will
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` use one of these Declarations unless there are material
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` differences between them; is that fine?
`
` A. That's all right.
`
` Q. If there are material differences between the
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` Declarations, please point them out to me.
`
` A. Okay.
`
` Q. For convenience I'll refer you to Exhibit 1
`
` which is the Declaration for the '878 patent which is
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` your Declaration.
`
` A. That's fine.
`
` Q. I've also asked the Court Reporter to mark as
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` exhibits the patents at issue in these proceedings. So
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` Exhibit -- the reason I'm presenting them to you right
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` now is so you can easily flip back and forth between.
`
` A. That's correct.
`
` Q. Exhibit Wicker 4 is US Patent number
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` 7,369,878 also known as the '878 patent.
`
` A. Okay. Yes.
`
` Q. Exhibit Wicker 5 is US Patent number
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` 7,454,234 which we'll refer to as the '234 patent.
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` A. Okay.
`
` Q. And Exhibit Wicker 6 is US Patent 7,873,389
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` which we'll refer to as the '389 patent.
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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` A. All right.
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` Q. Have you reviewed the '878, '234 and '898
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`Page 9
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` patents previously?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. Specifically have you reviewed each of these
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` patents in rendering your opinions for the corresponding
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` IPR proceeding?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Okay. I direct your attention to Exhibit
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` Wicker 4 which is the '878 patent?
`
` A. Certainly.
`
` Q. If you could turn to claim 1 of the '878
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` patent, please.
`
` A. Okay, I'm there.
`
` Q. Now, starting at line 50 of column 26:
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` Wherein the signal is having -- is having first and
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` second bit values which specify first and second
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` reception operations, respectively.
`
` A. Okay.
`
` Q. Do you see that line?
`
` A. Yes, I do.
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` Q. What would a person of ordinary skill in the
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` art understand the term "reception operation" to mean?
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` A. A person of ordinary skill at the time of
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` the invention would have understood reception operation
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 10
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` to be an operation in which a receiver brings in
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` electromagnetic radiation for purposes of processing and
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` acquiring whatever data is on those signals.
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` Q. Where in the -- where in the '878 patent is
`
` that definition of reception operation being used?
`
` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form. You can
`
` answer.
`
` A. Okay. So the definition flows from what is
`
` described in the '878 patent; in other words, the
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` embodiments that show reception operations and shows
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` what's being claimed are what I am using to derive that
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` understanding.
`
` Q. It's not entirely clear to me where in the
`
` '878 patent the definition that you described as
`
` reception operation, which is an operation in which a
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` receiver brings in electromagnetic radiation for the
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` purposes of processing and acquiring whatever data is on
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` those signals, what is the support in the patent or --
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` what is support in the patent for that definition.
`
` A. Okay. So there are a number of places in
`
` the '878 patent in which the written description
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` provides detail regarding how antennas are used to
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` acquire electromagnetic waveforms for purposes of
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` processing. So, for example, if we look at the
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` discussion surrounding the prior art in figures 26A and
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 11
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` 26B, and then 27A and 27B, what is focused on is a
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` problem involved with the acquisition of signals.
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` Q. You used the word "acquire" and
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` "acquisition." What do you mean by those words?
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` A. Okay, the actual process of bringing in
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` electromagnetic radiation into the receiver, acquiring
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` it for purposes of later processing.
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` Q. I'm still unclear what -- where that is
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` happening. So an antenna brings in electromagnetic
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` radiation. Is an antenna then doing the reception
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` operation?
`
` A. The coordination of antennas for purposes of
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` receiving electromagnetic radiation would be examples of
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` a reception operation in the patent.
`
` Q. Great. That wasn't my question. Is the
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` reception operation limited solely to what the antenna
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` is doing?
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` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form. You can
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` answer.
`
` A. What do you mean by "the antenna"? There
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` are multiple antennas in the examples, in the
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` embodiments.
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` Q. One or more antennas?
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` A. So are you asking whether reception
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` operation would be limited to what is being done by one
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 12
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` or more antennas?
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` Q. If that's how you understand the question,
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` yes.
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` A. Is that what your question is?
`
` Q. Why don't you answer that.
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` A. Okay. Certainly the use of one or more
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` antennas to acquire the electromagnetic radiation would
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` be examples of reception operations.
`
` Q. What are some other examples of reception
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` operations?
`
` A. Turning antennas on and off so they may or
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` may not be receiving radiation or at least causing it to
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` pass into the receiver.
`
` Q. And who -- what functionality or what circuit
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` or what logic performs that functionality of turning
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` antennas on or off?
`
` A. So that would be an example of antenna
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` electronics, what would interface the antenna with the
`
` receiver.
`
` Q. Looking through the specification of the
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` figures of the '878 patent, can you show me examples of
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` such antenna electronics?
`
` A. Okay. So if we're looking, for example, at
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` column 1, beginning on line 45, it talks about a PDMA
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` scheme, PDMA, where it says, quote, an adaptive array
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`Page 13
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` technique is currently employed, in which an uplink
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` signal from each user's terminal antenna is received by
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` an array antenna of a base station and extracted with
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` reception directivity through an adaptive array process.
`
` The process by which the adaptive array
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` functionality is implemented in the receiving antenna
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` would be an example of antenna electronics.
`
` Q. Let me direct your -- so I'm more of a visual
`
` person, which I have some trouble understanding the
`
` scope of what you're discussing here. Let me direct you
`
` to figure 11 of the '878 patent. So sorry, before we do
`
` this, I did want to -- I did want to ask you whether all
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` the specifications of the '878, '234, and '389 patents
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` are the same?
`
` A. They are very close to identical. In other
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` words they share common descriptions.
`
` Q. So for this line of questioning I'm going to
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` be referring to the '878 patent if that's all right.
`
` A. That's fine.
`
` Q. So if you turn to the figure 11 of the '878
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` patent, can you point me to what circuit or what logic
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` or what functional block in figure 11 is performing
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` reception operation?
`
` A. Okay. So, for example, I would look to
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` block 14 where 14A says literally reception operation
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`Stephen Wicker , MD
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`Page 14
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` indicating signal analyzing apparatus, and that is
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` providing information to the adaptive array reception
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` and diversity reception addressing
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` transmission/reception, there's a typo but it's
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` understandable, apparatus.
`
` Q. So is it only 14A that's performing the
`
` antenna reception operation or the entirety of block 14
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` which includes 14B as well?
`
` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form.
`
` A. So if we look at column 20, beginning on
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` line 28, it states here that the terminal shown in
`
` figure 11 is at least capable of selectively performing
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` the diversity reception and the adaptive array reception
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` using a plurality of antennas. Specifically, the
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` diversity reception and the adaptive array reception are
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` assumed to be performed selectively with software by
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` adaptive array reception and diversity reception
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` addressing transmission/apparatus, 14B.
`
` 14B would play a role in a receiving or
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` reception operation.
`
` Q. Is 14B the only circuit or only block that
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` would play a role in performing the reception operation?
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` A. If we look further down, column 20, line 60,
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` it says: Further, the output of demodulator circuit 16
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` is provided to reception operation indicating signal
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` analyzing apparatus 14A of DSP 14. It goes on to
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` explain that: "Reception operation indicating signal
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` analyzing apparatus 14A extracts the terminal reception
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` operation indicating signal (bit) that is added to a
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` downlink signal in a manner included in the frame
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` formats.
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` The reception operation in terms of the
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` acquisition of the signal would be 14B and in terms of
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` extracting the bit that indicates how the reception
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` operation is to be performed, that would be 14A.
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` Q. That's a little more -- that's a little more
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` confusing than I expected. Maybe this was a
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` misstatement but you mentioned that the reception
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` operation, in terms of the acquisition of the signal,
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` would be 14B and then extracting the bit would be
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` performed in 14A, correct?
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` A. That's right.
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` Q. So are you testifying then that it's a
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` combination of 14A and 14B; in other words, block 14,
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` figure 11 that performs the reception operation or is it
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` only 14A -- sorry, only 14B?
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` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form.
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` A. Okay, 14A is what determines which reception
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` operation is to be performed based on its extraction of
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` the indication bit. The actual reception operation is
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`Page 16
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` performed by 14B in this embodiment.
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` Q. Are there any other circuits in this
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` embodiment that perform the reception operation?
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` A. In figure 11, is that what you mean by "this
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` embodiment"?
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` Q. Right.
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` A. The reception operation would be performed
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` in part by antennas A11 and A12 or some combination of
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` A11 and A12.
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` Q. Just to be clear, that is part of acquiring
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` the electromagnetic signals that you're referring to
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` previously, right?
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` A. That's right.
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` Q. Any other circuits, any other functional
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` blocks in this figure perform reception operation?
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` A. 13 is a reception level comparing apparatus.
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` If we go back to where we were, there is a short
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` description of what's going on there. If we look at
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` column 20, line 19: In reception, the reception levels
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` of signals received at the antennas A11 and A12,
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` respectively, are compared to each other by reception
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` level comparing apparatus 13, and the comparison result
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` is output. The output of the reception level comparing
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` apparatus 13 is also provided to adaptive array
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` reception and diversity reception addressing
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` transmission/reception apparatus 14B.
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` So 13 could play a role in reception
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` operation.
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` Q. So just to be clear, what you've testified so
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` far is in figure 11, blocks 14B, A11, A12 and block 13
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` could potentially perform reception operation?
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` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form.
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` A. Some combination of them would be involved
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` in reception operations.
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` Q. But is that an accurate characterization?
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` Was my characterization correct?
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` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form.
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` A. To the extent that your characterization
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` indicated that a combination of those elements can be
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` used in a reception operation, yes.
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` Q. Are blocks A11, 12, 13 and 14B the only
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` blocks, are the only functional circuits or the
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` functional logic in figure 11 that perform reception
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` operation?
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` A. They're the only ones in figure 11 that are
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` described in the written description as doing so.
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` Q. All right. Let me direct you to figure 19 of
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` the '878 patent.
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` A. Okay.
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` Q. This should be a little easier now that I
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` understand what you're saying. Would you -- is it your
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` opinion that analogous to figure 11 it's -- the blocks
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` A11, A12, 13 and -- let me stop there.
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` First, is it your opinion that blocks A11,
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` A12 and 13 play some part in performing reception
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` operation?
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` A. They can, yes.
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` Q. Are there any other functional blocks in
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` figure 19 that perform reception operation?
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` A. Yes. Elements 19, 11 and 12B.
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` Q. In figure 19, it's blocks A11, A12, 13, 19,
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` 11 and 9B that in combination could perform a reception
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` operation, correct?
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` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form. You can
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` answer.
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` A. Put it slightly different, I'd say a
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` combination of A11, A12, 13, 12B, 19 and 11 could be
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` used in reception operations.
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` Q. Are there any other functional blocks in
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` figure 19 that may perform a reception operation?
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` A. Those are the blocks that I would point to
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` for the actual reception operation.
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` Q. I get that but are those the only blocks you
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` would point to?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. If I may direct you to figure 28 of the '878
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`Page 19
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` patent.
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` A. Okay, I'm there.
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` Q. The same questions here. Can you enumerate
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` all the blocks in figure 8?
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` A. A11, A12, 13, 14 and 14B, excuse me --
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` excuse me, let me do that again. I misspoke. A11, A12,
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` 13, and 14B.
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` Q. Now, you've described the reception operation
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` as involving the acquisition of electromagnetic
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` information and processing the information, correct?
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` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form.
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` A. That's incorrect.
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` Q. Let me just -- hold up. So you defined
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` reception operation as an operation in which a receiver
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` brings in electromagnetic radiation for the purposes of
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` processing and acquiring whatever data is on those
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` signals; correct?
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` A. That's right. The clarification being the
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` reception operation does not include the later
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` processing.
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` Q. What later processing are you -- do you have
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` in mind?
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` A. For whatever purposes the information has
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` been acquired. So, for example, error control coding,
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`Page 20
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` demodulation, I would not include those as reception
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` operations.
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` Q. Got it. And the identification of these
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` blocks in the figures of the patent like the A11, 12, 13
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` and 14B in figure 20, those are consistent with the
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` definition in the clarification you just provided,
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` correct?
`
` A. Yes.
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` Q. Great. Is a reception operation a singular
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` operation?
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` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form.
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` A. Can you restate the question? I'm not sure
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` what you mean by "a singular operation."
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` Q. In other words, is there only -- how many
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` types of reception operations, if a plurality, does the
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` '878 patent teach?
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` A. I haven't gone through the embodiments for
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` purposes of counting the possible number of reception
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` operations. If we look at a specific claim, it may
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` point to one or two reception operations.
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` Q. Let me rephrase. The phrase a reception
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` operation, a singular phrase or the word as opposed to
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` the plurality of reception operations, so I'm referring
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` to the former, a reception phrase that refers to one
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` single reception operation, correct?
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` A. From a grammatical standpoint, yes.
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` Q. What about from the standpoint of a person of
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` ordinary skill in the art?
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` A. So a person of ordinary skill would
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` understand that we can talk about a reception operation
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` but that as an operation it might involve a number of
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` different suboperations. In other words, there may be
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` several things involved in what we are calling a
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` reception operation.
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` Q. Such as?
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` A. Let's take, for example, acquisition of
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` information by multiple antennas. Each antenna will
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` perform an acquisition operation. There will be an
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` interface of what is received on that antenna with, for
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` example, adaptive array processing, so there are several
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` different things that would occur that would be part of
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` this reception operation.
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` Q. You just mentioned adaptive array processing.
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` Is the phrase adaptive array processing or is the
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` concept of adaptive array processing a single reception
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` operation?
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` MR. BOWEN: Objection, form.
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` A. In substance adaptive array processing could
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` constitute a single reception but adaptive arrays allow
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` for variations and their performance would constitute a
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` diversity reception operation.
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` Q. Is diversity reception a different type of
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` reception operation from adaptive array processing?
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` A. A diversity reception is a more general term
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` that would include adaptive array reception.
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` Q. Where in the '878 patent do you find support
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` for your statement that a diversity reception may
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` include adaptive array reception?
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` A. Okay, let's go to the background art
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` beginning on column 1, line 35. And let me be specific.
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` I don't want to read the whole thing in the record.
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` Okay. What's being described here is something that's
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` called path division multiple access. It says: This is
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` a scheme in which radio terminal apparatuses, that's the
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` way it's stated, terminals, of a plurality of users can
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` be connected to a radio base station apparatus, base
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` station, in a spatial multiplexing manner, by spatially
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` dividing an identical time slot of an identical
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` frequency for improving the frequency effectiveness of a
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` radio wave.
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` Now it's speaking generally of diversity
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` reception. It goes on to say: In this PDMA scheme, an
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` adaptive array technique is currently employed. That's
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` one way of doing it, the adaptive array, in which an
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` uplink signal from each user's terminal antenna is
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` received by an array antenna of a base station and
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` extracted with reception directivity through an adaptive
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` array process.
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` Q. I'm still unclear as to where a diversity
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` operation is discussed in these lines that you've read?
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` A. Okay. It's diversity in the sense that
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` what's happening is multiple receive antennas are being
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` used to distinguish multiple transmissions from
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` different antennas. The diversity lies in the use of
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` the multiple antennas to, for example, implement
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` directivity.
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` Q. Where are you getting this definition of
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` diversity from?
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` A. What one of ordinary skill in the art would
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` have understood at the time of the patent. This is what
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` I've been teaching for 32 years.
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` Q. Is that what is discussed -- is that what is
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` taught by the patent?
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` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Where does the patent discuss your definition
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` of diversity reception?
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` A. Look at column 1, line 64. As for a
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` terminal, one performing selective diversity reception,
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` hereinafter referred to as diversity reception, using a
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` plurality of antennas is known. In reception, such a
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` terminal operates to select one antenna with higher
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` reception level as a reception antenna from, for
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` example, two antennas. Such a conventional diversity
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` reception terminal performs the above-mentioned
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` diversity reception regardless of whether the base
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` station to be connected is an adaptive array base
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` station performing transmission directivity control or a
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` nondirectional base station.
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` So several things here, it's saying that
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` diversity includes the possibility of adaptive array
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` processing but it's not necessary, and it involves the
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` use of multiple antennas to provide options, if you
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` will, for the receiving element.
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` Q. It's in the background section, correct?
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` A. Yes, it is.
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` Q. Let me direct you to figure 22 of the '878
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` patent.
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` A. Okay, I'm there.
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` Q. Excuse me, that was figure 23.
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` A. Figure 23, okay.
`
` Q. Do you see a box S53 which reads: Indicate
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` diversity operation?
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` A. Yes, I do.
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` Q. To the left of that and below do you see box
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` S55 that reads: Indicate adaptive array reception and
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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