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`UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`EASTERN DISTRICT OF TEXAS
`MARSHALL DIVISION
`CASE NO. 2017-cv-00495-WCB-RSP
`
` CYWEE GROUP LTD.,
`
`Plaintiff,
`
` vs.
`
` HUAWEI DEVICE CO. LTD.,
` HUAWEI DEVICE (DONGGUAN) CO.
` USA, INC.,
`
`Defendants.
` ___________________________________/
`
`Veritext Reporting
`37 N. Orange Avenue
`Suite 500
`Orlando, Florida
`Tuesday, 9:15 a.m.-5:16 p.m.
`September 25, 2018
`
` VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF JOSEPH J. LAVIOLA, JR., Ph.D
`
`Taken on Behalf of the Defendants before
`Lisa Gerlach, Court Reporter, Notary Public
`in and for the State of Florida at Large,
`pursuant to Defendants' Notice of Taking
`Deposition in the above cause.
`
`Pages 1- 169
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`GOOGLE 1025
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` A p p e a r a n c e s :
` C o u n s e l f o r t h e P l a i n t i f f :
` A R I B . R A F I L S O N , E S Q U I R E
` S h o r e C h a n D e P u m p o , L L P
` B a n k o f A m e r i c a P l a z a
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` C o u n s e l f o r t h e D e f e n d a n t s :
` B E N K L E I N M A N , E S Q U I R E
` K i l p a t r i c k T o w n s e n d & S t o c k t o n , L L P
` T w o E m b a r c a d e r o C e n t e r
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` S a n F r a n c i s c o , C A 9 4 1 1 1
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` INDEX
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` WITNESS EXAMINATION PAGE
`
` Joseph J. LaViola, Jr., Ph.D
`
` Direct by Mr. Kleinman 5
`
` Cross by Mr. Rafilson 154
`
` Redirect by Mr. Kleinman 164
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` Certificate of Oath 167
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` Certificate of Reporter 168
`
` EXHIBITS
`
` Exhibit 1 Declaration of Joseph J.
`
` LaViola, Jr., Ph.D in Support
`
`13
`
` of CyWee's Reply Claim
`
` Construction Brief 13
`
`14
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` Exhibit 2 Declaration of Joseph J.
`
`15
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` LaViola, Jr., Ph.D in Support
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` of CyWee's Opening Claim
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` Construction Brief 15
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` Exhibit 3 '438 Patent 19
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` Exhibit 4 '978 Patent 26
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` Exhibit 5 CyWee Group Ltd., Markman
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` Hearing Presentation 166
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` THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Good morning. We are
`
` going on the record at 9:15 a.m. on
`
` September 25th, 2018. Please note that the
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` microphones are sensitive and may pick up
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` whispering, private conversations, and
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` cellular interference. Please turn off all
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` cell phones or place them away from the
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` microphones, as then can interfere with the
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` deposition audio. Audio and video recording
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` will continue unless all parties agree to go
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` off the record.
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` This is media unit one of the
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` video-recorded deposition of Joseph J.
`
` LaViola, Jr., Ph.D, taken by counsel for the
`
` defendants in the matter of CyWee Group Ltd.
`
` Vs. Huawei Device, Ltd., et al., filed in the
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` United States District Court, Eastern
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` District of Texas, Marshall Division.
`
` This deposition is being held at Veritext
`
` Orlando, located at 37 North Orange Avenue,
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` Orlando, Florida. My name is Bailey Gerlach.
`
` I'm from the firm Veritext Legal Solutions
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` and I'm the videographer. The court reporter
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` is Lisa Gerlach from the firm, Veritext
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` Reporting.
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` Counsel will now state their appearances
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` and affiliations for the record beginning
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` with the noticing attorney.
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` MR. KLEINMAN: Ben Kleinman, with
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` Kilpatrick Townsend, representing Huawei.
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` MR. RAFILSON: Ari Rafilson, on behalf of
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` plaintiff, CyWee Group.
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` THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Will the court
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` reporter, please, swear in the witness?
`
` THEREUPON,
`
` JOSEPH J. LAVIOLA, JR., Ph.D,
`
` a witness herein, acknowledged after having been duly
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` sworn, testified upon his oath as follows:
`
` THE WITNESS: I do.
`
` DIRECT EXAMINATION
`
` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Good morning.
`
` A. Good morning.
`
` Q. First things first. Is it Dr. LaViola,
`
` Professor LaViola? Do you have a preference?
`
` A. You can call me Dr. LaViola, I guess.
`
` Q. Thank you. You understand that you are under
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` oath?
`
` A. Uh-huh.
`
` Q. Is there any reason this morning that you
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` couldn't give full and truthful testimony?
`
` A. No.
`
` Q. Is there anything impairing your memory in
`
` particular this morning?
`
` A. No.
`
` Q. No cough medicine?
`
` A. Uh-uh.
`
` Q. Feeling under the weather?
`
` A. No.
`
` Q. I know you've been deposed at least once
`
` before. That was in the Samsung matter related to
`
` these patents. Is that correct?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Have you been deposed any other time?
`
` A. No.
`
` Q. After that Samsung deposition, did you
`
` receive a transcript of that deposition?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Did you review that transcript?
`
` A. I did.
`
` Q. Did you make any errors or inaccurate
`
` statements during your testimony in the Samsung
`
` deposition?
`
` A. I don't believe. I can't recall that I did.
`
` I think there were a few typos that I fixed, but,
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` other than that, I don't think there was anything that
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` I said that needed to be corrected.
`
` MR. RAFILSON: Counsel, for the record,
`
` Dr. LaViola, did submit an errata in that
`
` case. You should be in possession of that
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` errata. If you're not, I'd be happy to get
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` that to you.
`
` MR. KLEINMAN: Thank you, Counsel.
`
` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. When you talk about typos that you may have
`
` corrected, are you referring to filling out that
`
` errata form?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Are there any other statements you made
`
` during that deposition that you now think are
`
` inaccurate?
`
` A. There may be some statements that I made
`
` which, after further analysis of the materials, may
`
` need to be revised.
`
` Q. Do you know what those are now?
`
` A. I don't remember exactly what they would be
`
` off the top of my head.
`
` Q. You know there are some?
`
` A. There might be one or two.
`
` Q. Do you have any specific statements in mind?
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` A. I guess there may be one having to do with
`
` the notion of the patents and the extended Kalman
`
` filter.
`
` Q. And what about the patents and the extended
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` Kalman filter?
`
` A. I believe that, in my testimony under the
`
` Samsung deposition, I mentioned that the patents -- or
`
` one of the embodiments of the patents used an extended
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` Kalman filter, and that is -- after further analysis
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` of the patent, that statement probably needs to be
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` revised.
`
` Q. When you say, "revised," are you saying that
`
` none of the disclosed embodiments in the
`
` specifications are disclosed using an extended Kalman
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` filter?
`
` A. No. What I'm saying is that -- see -- the
`
` extended Kalman filter is a framework for doing
`
` estimation, and there are certain pieces of it that
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` are used in the patent and certain pieces that are
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` not.
`
` So the rephrasing of what I said in that
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` deposition, I have corrected in other briefs. But in
`
` regards to that particular deposition, the -- the
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` statement I made would have to be revised to saying
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` something to the extent that it makes use of
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` components of the extended Kalman filter.
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` Q. Other than that, are there any other
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` inaccuracies or other statements you made that you now
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` think might have been in error?
`
` A. No.
`
` Q. So you're doing fine so far in the deposition
`
` in terms of how we get along in giving a clean record
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` and giving verbal answers.
`
` Two more things I'd like to emphasize before
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` we go further. If you don't understand something I
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` say, please, let me know and just say you don't
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` understand.
`
` A. Okay.
`
` Q. Thank you. And breaks -- feel free to
`
` request a break whenever you want it. It may well be
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` that I take breaks more often than you need. We'll
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` just try not to break while a question is pending and
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` hasn't been answered yet.
`
` A. Uh-huh.
`
` Q. One of the things you testified to is what a
`
` person of ordinary skill in the art would understand
`
` about the claims; correct?
`
` A. Uh-huh, yes.
`
` Q. At what point in time does that person of
`
` ordinary skill have the knowledge that makes them a
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` person of ordinary skill in the art?
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` A. Well, I would say probably either --
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` depending on the level of the education that they
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` had -- it could be immediately after graduation from
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` college or one to two -- perhaps one to two years
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` after college.
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` Q. That that was a poorly-worded question. That
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` wasn't what I was trying to elicit. What I meant was,
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` are they offering that person as a person of ordinary
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` skill in the art today or are they offering that
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` opinion as ordinary skill in the art at a different
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` point in time?
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` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form.
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` Counsel -- objection, vague.
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` A. So let me try to understand what you're
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` asking me. You're asking me at what time in terms of
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` not an individual's education, but in terms of when
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` the patents were granted?
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Correct.
`
` A. So you're asking me approximately what
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` time -- I mean --
`
` Q. I can rephrase.
`
` A. Please.
`
` Q. Do you understand that a person of ordinary
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` skill in the art, offering an opinion on the meaning
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` of the terms of a claim, that that person of ordinary
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` skill in the art is offering their opinion as of the
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` timeframe that the claims were filed?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. Do you understand that these patents were
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` filed -- one of them was filed in 2010 and the other
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` in 2011?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. Would one of ordinary skill in the art have
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` had access to the Apple or Samsung claim construction
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` orders in this case at that time?
`
` A. Have access to the claim construction orders?
`
` What do you mean by that?
`
` Q. In 2010 or 2011, would a person of ordinary
`
` skill in the art have access to the Apple or the
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` Samsung claim construction orders in this case?
`
` A. So are you talking about these claim
`
` construction orders -- I mean, you're talking about
`
` the claims themselves?
`
` Q. No. I'm talking about the orders issued by
`
` the judges.
`
` A. Oh, okay. Then the answer would be no.
`
` Q. In your second declaration in this Huawei
`
` matter, you refer to an Android programming book.
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` Do you recall that?
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` A. Yes.
`
` Q. When was that book published?
`
` A. I do not know when it was published.
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` MR. KLEINMAN: At this point, I'd like to
`
` introduce exhibit Exhibit 1.
`
` (Exhibit 1 was marked for
`
` identification.)
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. For the record, Exhibit 1 is printed
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` double-sided. It starts at page 1. It concludes
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` with -- and the last page, a separately numbered
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` page 91 from a document titled "Document 99-2" up at
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` the top of that last page of Exhibit 1. At the top of
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` the Exhibit 1, it is titled, "Document 99-1."
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` Dr. LaViola, do you have Exhibit 1 in front
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` of you?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Do you recognize this?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. What is this?
`
` A. This is my reply declaration for the claim
`
` construction brief.
`
` Q. Filed in this case?
`
` A. Yes.
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` Q. Can you just look at page 1 in paragraph 2?
`
` A. Uh-huh.
`
` Q. And actually staying with -- oh, the third
`
` bullet down in paragraph 2.
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Do you see a reference in that third bullet
`
` to professional Android sensor programming?
`
` A. Uh-huh, yes.
`
` Q. Does that bullet say when that book was
`
` published?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. When was that book published?
`
` A. 2012.
`
` Q. Would a person of ordinary skill in the art
`
` have had access to that book at the time they were
`
` interpreting these claims?
`
` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form;
`
` objection, vague.
`
` A. It's possible.
`
` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. How is it possible?
`
` A. Some people will actually put drafts of their
`
` books online, so it is possible that someone of
`
` ordinary skill in the art could have had a version of
`
` this before it was actually officially published.
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` Q. Is the reference you cite to a draft of the
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` book?
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` A. No, it's not.
`
` Q. The person of ordinary skill in the art that
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` you reference in your testimony, what is the art in
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` which that person has ordinary skill?
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` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form objection,
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` vague.
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` A. Would it be possible for you to give me my
`
` original declaration?
`
` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Sure.
`
` MR. KLEINMAN: Counsel yours has the
`
` letter "M" at the top. I apologize.
`
` MR. RAFILSON: That's fine.
`
` MR. KLEINMAN: Mark this as Exhibit 2,
`
` please.
`
` (Exhibit 2 was marked for
`
` identification.)
`
` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. For the record, Exhibit 2 is numbered
`
` Document 79-6. It's also doubled-sided. It begins at
`
` page 1 and it ends at page 42.
`
` Dr. LaViola, do you recognize Exhibit 2?
`
` A. Yes.
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` Q. What is Exhibit 2?
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` A. This is my initial opinions on the claim
`
` construction. It's a brief that I wrote.
`
` Q. In this Huawei matter?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. You asked for this document to be presented
`
` before you?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Is there a particular portion of it you're
`
` looking for?
`
` A. Yes. I'm looking for -- let me see here --
`
` level of ordinary skill in the art on page 4.
`
` Q. Okay. Paragraph 14?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. I'm going to ask that question again then.
`
` What is the art in which this person has ordinary
`
` skill?
`
` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form;
`
` objection, vague.
`
` A. If you are talking about the technical skills
`
` that would be necessary for somebody at this level,
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` then it would be someone who has experience -- at
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` least a bachelor's degree in computer science,
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` electrical engineering, mechanical engineering,
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` physics, or some other equivalent discipline, and
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` would have had also potentially some knowledge of
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` magnetometers, and mobile computing.
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` And, in addition, the person would be
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` familiar with Kalman filters and extended Kalman
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. What is the field of art for the '438 patent?
`
` A. There really is not one field of art for the
`
` '438 patent. I mean, it's -- in general, it is
`
` computing, as well as an understanding of electronics,
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` so there's -- the basic things that you would get in a
`
` computer science degree or electrical engineering or
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` any of these other technical degrees that I mentioned
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` in my report, that is what we would consider the art
`
` of the '438 patent.
`
` Q. Is the same true for the '978 patent?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Do the claims of a patent necessarily cover
`
` all of the disclosed embodiments in that patent?
`
` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form;
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` objection, vague.
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` A. Well, that's a question that I would have
`
` difficulty answering, given the fact that I'm not a
`
` lawyer.
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
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` Q. Were you given information on relevant law
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` when you formed your opinions on the construction of
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` the claims in this case?
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` A. I was given some information about relevant
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` law as I formed my opinions.
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` Q. Were you given any information on whether the
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` claims of a patent have to cover all of the disclosed
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` embodiments in a patent?
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` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form. And I'll
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` just instruct the witness not to disclose the
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` content of any privileged communications, but
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` you can answer.
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` A. To the best of my knowledge, I believe that
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` the embodiments described -- the specification of the
`
` embodiments described within the patent should be, I
`
` guess, examples that represent the claims that are
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` being presented in the patent.
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Does every embodiment in a patent have to be
`
` claimed?
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` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form; objection
`
` vague.
`
` A. Does every embodiment in a patent have to be
`
` claimed? Embodiments are not necessarily claimed.
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` Right? They represent an example of how one might
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` practice the claims.
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
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` Q. Can a patent contain examples of how the
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` invention might be practiced, even if those examples
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` are outside the scope of the claims?
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` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form.
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` A. That, I can't really answer at this point. I
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` don't have enough legal knowledge to know the answer
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` to that question.
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Do you recall that the '438 and the '978
`
` patent have a Figure 6?
`
` A. Yes, I do.
`
` Q. Do you recall what that Figure 6 illustrates?
`
` A. Do you have a copy of the '438 patent?
`
` Q. Sure.
`
` (Exhibit 3 was marked for
`
` identification.)
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. What has been marked as Exhibit 3 is printed
`
` double-sided and it is labeled Patent No. US
`
` 8,441,438. The first page is not numbered. The last
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` page has column numbers 21 and 22 on it.
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` A. My copy is not double-sided.
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` printed double-sided. That's an unfortunate treatment
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` of our trees.
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` Dr. LaViola, do you have Exhibit 3 in front
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` of you?
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` A. Yes, I do.
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` Q. Do you recognize Exhibit 3?
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` A. Yes, I do.
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` Q. What is it?
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` A. This is the '438 patent.
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` Q. Okay. Do the claims of the '438 patent
`
` necessarily cover Figure 6?
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` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form.
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` A. Based on what I see here, I would say that
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` the claims describe -- or, in other words, Figure 6
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` would be something -- a representation of an
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` embodiment that would be covered in the claims.
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. You answered that question after glancing at
`
` the claims?
`
` A. I looked at some of the claims and also the
`
` specification.
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` Q. If a claim did not literally cover Figure 6,
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` would a person of ordinary skill in the art be
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` obligated to interpret the claim as if it did cover
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` Figure 6?
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` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form.
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` A. I couldn't answer that question.
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Why not?
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` A. Because I don't know all of the legal
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` ramifications of the patent law.
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` Q. Okay. When you offered your testimony as to
`
` how a person of ordinary skill in the art would
`
` understand the claims of the '438 patent, did you
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` assume that, regardless of the literal language of
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` those claims, a person of ordinary skill in the art
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` would have to construe the claims to cover Figure 6?
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` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form; objection
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` vague.
`
` A. I believe that, looking at the claims and
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` reading the specification, you would be able to
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` determine that the patent claims were -- or the claims
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` themselves would cover Figure 6.
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Are there any preferred embodiments in the
`
` '438 patent?
`
` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form.
`
` A. The preferred embodiments would be -- I don't
`
` recall if the patent specification actually says the
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` word "preferred," but I can say that the specification
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` that they talk about for the main embodiment they
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` present in the specification would probably be the
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` preferred embodiment.
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
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` Q. Is the embodiment illustrated in Figure 6 of
`
` the '438 patent a preferred embodiment of the '438
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` patent?
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` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form.
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` A. I would say that Figure 6 represents part of
`
` a preferred embodiment.
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. What's the basis for you saying that?
`
` A. Well, based on the nature of the claims, as
`
` well as the nature of the description in the abstract
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` and the -- what is it now -- the summary invention --
`
` it appears that, from those two, along with the
`
` claims, that Figure 6 would be an integral piece of
`
` the embodiment.
`
` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. What is it about the abstract that suggests
`
` that Figure 6 is -- I believe you said an integral
`
` piece?
`
` A. Yeah. Well, the abstract mentioned a 3D
`
` pointing device. It mentions six-axis motion sensor
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` module, and it mentions that there's processing and
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` processing modules that are used to help determine 3D
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` orientation. And Figure 6 shows a pointing device and
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` it also shows components of the pointing device, such
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` as the accelerometer, gyroscope, and processing and
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` transmitting modules.
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` Q. Does Figure 5 also show those things?
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` A. Figure 5, yes, it does.
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` Q. Is there anything in the '438 patent that
`
` makes you think Figure 6 is a preferred embodiment and
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` Figure 5 is not?
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` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form; objection
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` vague.
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` A. Yes, because, in the specification, it also
`
` mentions the notion of having the pointing -- a
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` screen -- display screen -- being a part of the
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` three-dimensional pointing device, and Figure 6 shows
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` that.
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` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Can you turn to column 10 of Exhibit 3,
`
` please?
`
` A. Column 10. Okay.
`
` Q. Do you see, around line 9, there's a
`
` paragraph beginning "Figure 6"?
`
` A. Yeah.
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` Q. Is that the portion of the specification you
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` were just referring to?
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` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Is there another portion of the specification
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` you are also referring to?
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` A. Well, you asked me about Figure 5, so the
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` other place would be in column 9, starting around
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` line 6.
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` Q. Is there any other portion of the
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` specification that refers to the built-in display?
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` A. There are other places in the patent that
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` mention display. That would refer to, in general,
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` having a display attached to the 3D pointing device or
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` it would be as part of the 3D pointing device.
`
` Q. Are you saying that there are other portions
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` of the specification that refer to a display, and that
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` it's your opinion that reference to a display would
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` also apply to the built-in display?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Are there any other portions that you recall
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` that refer specifically to the built-in display other
`
` than column 10, starting at line 9?
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` A. There may be others, but I don't recall them
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` at the moment.
`
` Q. Can you turn to column 5 of the '438 patent?
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` A. Uh-huh.
`
` Q. Do you see the paragraph starting at line 14,
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` "According to another example embodiment"?
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` A. Yes.
`
` Q. So in the line I just mentioned, line 14, it
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` refers to an example embodiment; correct?
`
` A. Uh-huh.
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` Q. Can you look down at line 18, the sentence
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` that starts at the end of line 18?
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` A. "In one preferred?"
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` Q. Correct. Can you see how that full -- the
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` more complete beginning of that sentence that starts
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` at the end of line 18 is, "In one preferred embodiment
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` of the present invention"?
`
` A. Uh-huh.
`
` Q. Is that correct?
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` A. It says, "In one preferred embodiment of the
`
` present invention."
`
` Q. Okay. Can you turn back to column 10?
`
` A. Uh-huh.
`
` Q. Is there anything in column 10, between lines
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` 9 and 41, that refers to any aspect of Figure 6 as
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` part of a preferred embodiment?
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` A. To the best of my knowledge, I don't see
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` anything that refers to -- wait a minute -- okay.
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` There is a "preferred" word in there, but it is not
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` referring to Figure 6.
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` Q. What are you referring to?
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` A. This is column 10, line 35, "spatial pointer
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` reference frame, preferably about each of the three
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` orthogonal coordinate axes."
`
` Q. While we're doing this, I'm going to
`
` introduce Exhibit 4, which will be the '978 patent.
`
` A. Okay.
`
` (Exhibit 4 was marked for
`
` identification.)
`
` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Exhibit 4 is double-sided. At the top of
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` the first page, which is not numbered, it has
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` US 8,552,978. And the back of the last page has
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` columns 37 and 38.
`
` A. Uh-huh.
`
` Q. Dr. LaViola, do you have Exhibit 4 in front
`
` of you?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Do you recognize Exhibit 4?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. What is it?
`
` A. The '978 patent.
`
` Q. Can you turn to Figure 6 of the '978 patent?
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` A. Uh-huh, yes.
`
` Q. Is that the same as Figure 6 of the '438
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` patent?
`
` A. It's slightly different.
`
` Q. How is it different?
`
` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form.
`
` A. The numbering of certain pieces. It
`
` introduced an additional piece.
`
` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Oh, that's right. So 645 is present in the
`
` '978 patent, but not in the '438 patent?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Also, 602 is labeled in the '978 patent and
`
` not in the '438 patent?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Are there any other differences that you see?
`
` A. Not that I see.
`
` Q. Can you turn to column 13 of Exhibit 4, the
`
` '978 patent?
`
` A. Uh-huh, yes. Okay.
`
` Q. Do you see that line 5 of column 13 begins,
`
` "Figure 6 is an exploded diagram"?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Can you take a moment and look for yourself
`
` at column 13, lines 5 through 59, and let me know when
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` you're done?
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` A. Okay.
`
` Q. I'm just going to be asking you if you see
`
` anything in those lines that refers to any aspect of
`
` Figure 6 as a preferred embodiment of the '978 patent.
`
` A. I do not see anything referring to preferred
`
` embodiment in those lines that you mentioned.
`
` Q. Are you aware of any other aspect of the '978
`
` patent that describes any elements of Figure 6 as part
`
` of a preferred embodiment?
`
` A. Not that I'm aware of.
`
` Q. Are you doing okay?
`
` A. Yeah.
`
` Q. Can you turn back to Exhibit 2? That is your
`
` declaration in support of CyWee's opening claim
`
` construction brief?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Can you turn to page 6, paragraph 20?
`
` A. Page 6, paragraph 20. Yes.
`
` Q. Do you see at the beginning of -- sorry -- in
`
` the middle of the second line of paragraph 20 --
`
` A. Uh-huh.
`
` Q. -- continuing to the end of the 5th line, you
`
` present CyWee's alternative proposal for the
`
` construction of the term "six-axis motion sensor
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` module"?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Do you have an understanding as to how this
`
` proposed construction would be used by the parties and
`
` the courts if it's adopted by the court?
`
` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form.
`
` A. If it's adopted by the court, then it
`
` represents what -- it would provide a meaning to the
`
` term "six-axis motion sensor module."
`
` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Instead of using the term "six-axis motion
`
` sensor module," when, for example, the jury is
`
` presented with this claim, they would be told that
`
` six-axis motion sensor module has the meaning of
`
` whatever it is the court orders the construction to
`
` be?
`
` MR. RAFILSON: Objection, form.
`
` A. I don't know what they would tell a jury or
`
` not. I've never been to a jury trial.
`
` BY MR. KLEINMAN:
`
` Q. Have you ever been an expert in an IPR
`
` proceeding?
`
` A. Yeah. One or two.
`
` Q. Did you offer opinions about claim
`
` construction in those proceedings?
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` A. I can't recall if I did or I didn't.
`
` Q. Keeping that Exhibit 2 in front of you, can
`
` you also bring out Exhibit 3?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Can you turn towards the back to column 18,
`
` claim 1?
`
` A. Column 18, claim 1. Yes, I see it.
`
` Q. Do you see that claim 1 recites that the
`
` six-axis motion sensor module is attached to the PCB?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Do you see that -- let me start that again.
`
` Can you read that third element, beginning at
`
` "Six-axis motion sensor module," but replace "Six-axis
`
` motion sensor module" with "CyWee's alternative
`
` proposed construction"?
`
` A. So -- let's see here. "A collection of
`
` components comprising of a rotation sensor, comprising
`
` of one or more gyroscopes for collectively generating
`
` three angular velocities, and one or more
`
` accelerometers for collectively generating three axial
`
` accelera