UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`
`Page 1
`
`INTEL CORP., )
`
` )
`
` Petitioner, )
`
` ) Case No. IPR2018-00226
`
` vs. ) U.S. Patent No. 7,124,205
`
` )
`
`ALACRITECH, INC., )
`
` )
`
` Patent Owner. )
`
`_________________________________)
`
` DEPOSITION OF BILL LIN
`
` La Jolla, California
`
` Friday, August 24, 2018
`
`Reported by:
`
`ELIZABETH BORRELLI, CSR No. 7844, CCRR, CLR
`
`JOB NO. 146787
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3 4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`
`
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`
`Page 1
`
`INTEL CORP., )
`
` )
`
` Petitioner, )
`
` ) Case No. IPR2018-00226
`
` vs. ) U.S. Patent No. 7,124,205
`
` )
`
`ALACRITECH, INC., )
`
` )
`
` Patent Owner. )
`
`_________________________________)
`
` DEPOSITION OF BILL LIN
`
` La Jolla, California
`
` Friday, August 24, 2018
`
`Reported by:
`
`ELIZABETH BORRELLI, CSR No. 7844, CCRR, CLR
`
`JOB NO. 146787
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3 4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`
`
`Page 2
`
` Deposition of BILL LIN, Volume I, taken on
`
`behalf of the Patent Owner Alacritech, at 8901
`
`Gilman Drive, La Jolla, California 92037,
`
`commencing at 9:29 a.m., Friday, August 24,
`
`2018, before Elizabeth Borrelli, a Certified
`
`Shorthand Reporter in the State of California,
`
`License No. 7844.
`
` * * *
`
`1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 3
`
`APPEARANCES OF COUNSEL:
`
`For the Petitioner, Intel Corporation:
`
` WEIL, GOTSHAL & MANGES
`
` BY: AMANDA BRANCH
`
` Attorney at Law
`
` 201 Redwood Shores Parkway
`
` Redwood Shores, California 94065
`
`For the Patent Owner, Alacritech:
`
` QUINN EMANUEL URQUHART & SULLIVAN
`
` BY: SEAN LI
`
` Attorney at Law
`
` 50 California Street
`
` San Francisco, California 94111
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`1
`
`2 3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7 8 9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`
`
` I N D E X
`
`WITNESS EXAMINATION
`
`BILL LIN
`
`By MS. LI 5, 111
`
`By MS. BRANCH 108
`
`Page 4
`
` EXHIBITS
`
`LIN PAGE
`
`Exhibit 1 United States Patent Number 7
`
` 7,124,205 B2, 52 pages
`
`Exhibit 2 Document titled "Declaration of 22
`
` Bill Lin in Support of Petition
`
` for Inter Partes Review of U.S.
`
` Patent No. 7,124,205 Under 37
`
` C.F.R. 1.68," 94 pages
`
`Exhibit 3 Document titled "A Reduced 44
`
` Operation Protocol Engine
`
` (ROPE) for a multiple-layer
`
` bypass architecture," 16 pages
`
`Exhibit 4 Document titled "Technical 90
`
` Standard - Protocols for X/Open
`
` PC Interworking: SMB, Version
`
` 2," 162 pages
`
` INFORMATION REQUESTED
`
` (None)
`
` UNANSWERED QUESTIONS
`
` (None)
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6 7 8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`
`
` LA JOLLA, CALIFORNIA; MONDAY, AUGUST 24, 2018
`
` 9:29 A.M.
`
`Page 5
`
` DR. BILL LIN,
`
` having been duly administered
`
` an oath in accordance with CCP 2094,
`
` was examined and testified as follows:
`
` EXAMINATION
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Good morning, Dr. Lin.
`
` A. Good morning.
`
` Q. May I state your -- can you state your
`
`name and spell it, please?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Sean, should we do
`
`appearances?
`
` MR. LI: Yes. Okay.
`
` Sean Li from Quinn Emanuel representing
`
`Alacritech.
`
` MS. BRANCH: Amanda Branch from Weil,
`
`Gotshal on behalf of Intel.
`
` THE WITNESS: Bill Lin, B-I-L-L, L-I-N.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Good morning, Dr. Lin.
`
` A. Good morning.
`
` Q. Have you been deposed before?
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3 4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`
`
`Page 6
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` A. I have.
`
` Q. How many times?
`
` A. Maybe about 10 times. I don't know
`
`exactly.
`
` Q. Okay. So let me go through with you the
`
`ground rules for this deposition so we are all on
`
`the same page.
`
` A. Okay.
`
` Q. During this deposition I'll be asking you
`
`a series of questions. My questions and your
`
`answers will be transcribed by the court reporter.
`
`Because the court reporter cannot record our, you
`
`know, speaking when we talk over each other, so we
`
`should try to avoid talking over each other.
`
` Do you understand?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. During the deposition your lawyer will
`
`object to my questions, but you still have to answer
`
`my questions as long as your lawyer does not
`
`instruct you not to answer.
`
` Do you understand?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. We'll take a break, you know, every now
`
`and then, maybe every hour or so. If you want a
`
`break, let me know, but if there's a pending
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`question before the break, you have to finish the
`
`Page 7
`
`question.
`
` Do you understand?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Are you on any medication that could
`
`impede your ability to tell the truth?
`
` A. No.
`
` Q. Is there any reason that you cannot tell
`
`the truth today?
`
` A. No.
`
` MR. LI: I'm going to introduce the first
`
`exhibit. This will be Exhibit No. 1.
`
` (Whereupon Exhibit 1 was marked for
`
` identification.)
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Do you recognize this document?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Can you tell us what the document is?
`
` A. It's what we refer to as the '205 patent.
`
` Q. Okay. Do you see there's a label on the
`
`lower right corner said "Intel Exhibit 1001"?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Did you use this exhibit in your
`
`declaration for this case?
`
` A. I believe so.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 8
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` Q. When did you first read this -- this
`
`patent?
`
` A. I don't remember the exact date. It would
`
`-- it's been a couple of years, so sometime late
`
`2016. I don't remember exact date.
`
` Q. Is that fair to say is after -- before
`
`June 2016?
`
` A. I honestly don't recall right now.
`
` Q. Was it after June of 2016?
`
` A. I honestly don't recall.
`
` Q. Okay. But it was in 2016?
`
` A. I -- I don't know for sure. I would have
`
`to -- it's been a while so I don't remember exactly.
`
` Q. Do you remember who presented this
`
`document to you first?
`
` A. I also don't remember.
`
` Q. Did you find this patent by yourself?
`
` A. No. I was asked to -- I was asked to
`
`serve as an expert witness on this case, and I think
`
`I must have seen this patent, you know, whenever I
`
`was engaged at the time.
`
` Q. Okay. Before you were engaged, did you
`
`see this patent?
`
` A. I'm not sure. I don't -- I'm not sure.
`
` Q. Who asked you to be an expert witness in
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 9
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`this case?
`
` MS. BRANCH: I caution the witness not to
`
`reveal the contents of any privileged
`
`communications, but you may the answer the question
`
`with the basic information.
`
` THE WITNESS: Yeah. I was approached by
`
`the law firm Weil, Gotshal.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Do you remember who at the law firm
`
`approached you first?
`
` A. Actually, I don't remember.
`
` Q. Do you have engagement letter with Weil,
`
`Gotshal or Intel?
`
` A. I don't remember, but I -- I don't
`
`remember, but I think it was with Intel and Apple.
`
`I'm sorry, sorry. Actually, I don't remember. I
`
`don't remember.
`
` Q. Okay. Do you have engagement letter
`
`with -- with -- with companies other than Intel in
`
`this case?
`
` A. I'm trying to remember. So I -- so I
`
`don't remember the -- the exact content of the
`
`engagement letter. So -- but I was approached by
`
`the law firm Weil, Gotshal to be an expert witness
`
`and -- and I was also approached by, I think, the
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`law firm Duane Morris --
`
` [Reporter requests clarification.]
`
` MS. BRANCH: Duane.
`
` THE WITNESS: Duane Morris. And I believe
`
`Page 10
`
`Alston & Bird.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Who approached you first?
`
` A. What do you mean?
`
` Q. Which law firm approached you first in
`
`this case?
`
` A. I believe it was Weil, Gotshal.
`
` Q. And when was that?
`
` A. I don't remember. It -- this was a while
`
`ago already now.
`
` Q. Is that fair to say it's sometime in 2017?
`
` A. I -- I just don't know. If I could
`
`actually look up the engagement letter, then I would
`
`be able to tell you, but I just don't remember.
`
` Q. Okay. I do not believe the engagement
`
`letter is produced in this case, but let me ask you
`
`this: How -- what's your hourly rate in this case?
`
` A. I believe it's $600 an hour.
`
` Q. How many hours have you been working on
`
`this case?
`
` A. Oh, a lot. Several hundred by now.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Page 11
`
` Q. Several hundred hours?
`
` A. Yeah.
`
` Q. And what --
`
` A. But I don't remember precisely the number.
`
` Q. Uh-huh. When you send out your bills, who
`
`-- who do you send it to?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I -- I send it through the
`
`law firms.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. You send through the law firms, but in
`
`your invoice, who is the -- who is the party that's
`
`going to pay you?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I believe in the case of
`
`Weil, Gotshal, it's Intel.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Do you also get paid by other companies in
`
`this case?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: Again, I have engagement
`
`Duane Morris and Alston & Bird.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Does -- does Duane Morris pay you
`
`directly?
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 12
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't think so.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Who pays you directly?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I guess I'm not quite sure I
`
`understand the question.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. So you said you have -- you have
`
`engagement letter with Duane Morris and Alston &
`
`Bird?
`
` A. Uh-huh.
`
` Q. And do you bill the two law firms, or you
`
`bill a company or companies through these two law
`
`firms?
`
` A. I believe I --
`
` MS. BRANCH: Same objection.
`
` THE WITNESS: I believe I bill it through
`
`the -- the companies through the law firms.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Which companies do you bill to --
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. -- through these law firm -- these two law
`
`firms?
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 13
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` MS. BRANCH: Sorry. Objection.
`
`Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: Yeah, I'm not sure of the
`
`relevance, but, again, I think I submit my invoices
`
`for Intel through Weil, Gotshal.
`
` MR. LI: Uh-huh.
`
` THE WITNESS: And -- and I do the same
`
`thing with respect to the other two law firms.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Yeah, but who are the two companies behind
`
`these two law firms that you submit your bill to?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I would have to
`
`double-check. For some reason, I'm drawing a blank,
`
`but I believe I submit my invoices to Cavium through
`
`Duane Morris, and for Dell through Alston & Bird.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. You said you worked on this case for
`
`several hundred hours --
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. -- so far.
`
` And how many hours have you been working
`
`on for Intel, roughly?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: Again, I -- I didn't
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`prepare -- it's -- you know, the invoices were sent
`
`for over quite a long period of time, and I don't
`
`remember precisely, but it's mostly through -- for
`
`Page 14
`
`Intel.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Is that fair to say over 80 percent is for
`
`Intel?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Form.
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't remember the
`
`percentage.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Is that more than 80 percent?
`
` A. I think -- I don't remember the percentage
`
`so I cannot answer more or less if I don't remember
`
`what it was.
`
` Q. How many -- let's see. How often do you
`
`-- do you bill Intel --
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. -- in this case?
`
` A. I think just through periods where I've
`
`actually done work.
`
` Q. Do you -- do you send out your bills every
`
`month or every week or every season?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 15
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` THE WITNESS: They -- they -- I think they
`
`-- they were -- during the periods when I'm actively
`
`working on the case, I think they were at an
`
`interval maybe one or two months.
`
` MR. LI: Okay.
`
` THE WITNESS: But certainly not weekly.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Is that fair to say you have been working
`
`for Cavium -- well, let's -- let me rephrase the
`
`question.
`
` How many hours do you estimate that you --
`
`you have billed Cavium for this case?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: Again, I -- I didn't review
`
`those invoices before this declaration so I just
`
`don't remember.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Is that over 100 hours?
`
` A. No, certainly not.
`
` Q. Is that over 50 hours?
`
` A. I -- I don't think so, but I'm not sure,
`
`actually.
`
` Q. When was the last time you sent bill to --
`
`to Cavium?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 16
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` THE WITNESS: I -- I don't remember. Was
`
`that this year? I don't -- actually don't know. It
`
`could have been, but I don't -- I don't remember.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. When was the last time you sent bill to --
`
`to Intel?
`
` A. Maybe in June or maybe -- you know, yeah,
`
`I don't remember. Maybe it was in June or in May.
`
`I just don't remember. May or June timeframe.
`
` Q. When was the last time you sent bill to
`
`Dell?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I, again, don't remember.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Was that in this year?
`
` A. I just don't remember.
`
` Q. Have you ever sent bill to -- to Dell?
`
` A. Yes, of course.
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. How many hours do you estimate you worked
`
`for Dell?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Same objection.
`
` THE WITNESS: I -- I just don't remember.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 17
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` Q. Is that fair to say it's over 50 hours?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Same objection.
`
` THE WITNESS: No, I don't think so.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Did you prepare for this deposition?
`
` A. Yes, I did.
`
` Q. How long have you been working on the
`
`preparation for this deposition?
`
` A. Maybe around 10 hours.
`
` Q. Okay. When did you start working on that?
`
` A. Earlier this week.
`
` Q. Did you review any documents?
`
` A. I did.
`
` Q. What document did you review?
`
` A. The '205 patent. I reviewed the Thia
`
`reference. I reviewed what we call the SMB
`
`reference. And I reviewed the Carmichael reference.
`
` Q. Did you review any other documents?
`
` A. I don't think so.
`
` Q. Did you talk with any attorneys to prepare
`
`this deposition?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Caution the witness not to
`
`reveal the contents of any communication, but you
`
`can answer the question with the basic information.
`
` THE WITNESS: Yes. I've met with Amanda
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 18
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Branch from Weil, Gotshal.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. And when was that?
`
` A. Yesterday.
`
` Q. How long was the meeting?
`
` A. About six hours, I think.
`
` Q. Did you talk with any other lawyers for
`
`this deposition?
`
` A. Yeah. I think I might have -- well, we
`
`had a brief phone call with Anne Cappella.
`
` Q. Who is Anne Cappella?
`
` A. She's with the Weil, Gotshal also.
`
` MS. BRANCH: I -- Counsel, I can tell you
`
`she's of record in the proceeding.
`
` MR. LI: Yeah, okay.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Did you talk with anyone at Duane Morris?
`
` A. I did not.
`
` Q. Did you talk with anyone at Alston & Bird?
`
` A. I did not.
`
` Q. When was the last time you talked with
`
`lawyers at Duane Morris?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't remember.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 19
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` Q. Was that in this year?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Same.
`
` THE WITNESS: Possible, but I don't
`
`remember.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. When was the last time you talked with
`
`lawyers at -- at Alston & Bird?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: As -- I just don't recall
`
`right now.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Was that in this year?
`
` A. Possible, but I don't remember.
`
` Q. Do you remember -- do you remember having
`
`any conference with -- with lawyers from Weil,
`
`Gotshal, Alston & Bird and Duane Morris together any
`
`time?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't think so.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Have you ever talked with -- you know,
`
`since this case, have you ever talked with any
`
`employees of Dell?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Vague.
`
`Objection. Relevance.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't recall talking to
`
`Page 20
`
`Dell -- employees from Dell.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Do you recall talking with any employees
`
`from Intel?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Form. Objection.
`
`Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't recall. I may have,
`
`but I don't recall right now.
`
` MR. LI: Uh-huh.
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't remember right now.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Why do you think you may have?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Form. Objection.
`
`Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I'm not sure. I just don't
`
`remember. It's -- it's been so long.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Do you remember talking with any employees
`
`from -- from Cavium?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection.
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't remember --
`
` MS. BRANCH: Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: -- talking to somebody from
`
`Cavium.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 21
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Do you have any engagement letter with --
`
`with the company Wistron?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't believe so.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Do you have any engagement letter with
`
`Century Link?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't believe so.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Have you ever talked with attorneys
`
`representing Century Link or Wistron?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I don't think so.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. So you just said you -- you worked on --
`
`worked on the preparation of this deposition for
`
`about 10 hours?
`
` A. Roughly.
`
` Q. Roughly.
`
` And you had a six-hours meeting with --
`
`with Counsel yesterday?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Is that included in this 10 hour?
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 22
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. So basically you worked on the preparation
`
`for four hours before you met Counsel?
`
` A. I don't -- I don't know it was before or
`
`-- you know, some before, some after.
`
` Q. Some before, some after.
`
` And who are you going to bill those hours
`
`to?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I think most likely through
`
`-- to Intel.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Are you going to bill any of them to -- to
`
`Cavium or Dell?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: I'm not sure.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. What do you mean by you're not sure?
`
` A. My -- I think I will bill these 10 hours
`
`to Intel.
`
` MR. LI: I'm going to introduce the next
`
`exhibit, which is Exhibit No. 2.
`
` (Whereupon Exhibit 2 was marked for
`
` identification.)
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 23
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` Q. Exhibit No. 2 is labeled as Intel
`
`Exhibit 1003.
`
` Do you recognize this document?
`
` A. Yes, I do.
`
` Q. What is this document?
`
` A. It appears to be my declaration.
`
` Q. When did you draft this declaration?
`
` [Reporter requests clarification.]
`
` MR. LI: Draft.
`
` THE WITNESS: Again, I don't remember.
`
`It's been some time ago.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Is that in 2017?
`
` A. I just don't remember.
`
` Q. Let's turn to page with Bates No.
`
`Exhibit 1003.050.
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Do you see your signature there?
`
` A. Yes, okay.
`
` Q. That's your signature?
`
` A. Correct.
`
` Q. Do you see the date?
`
` A. I do.
`
` Q. What is the date?
`
` A. It says May 5, 2017.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` Q. Is that fair to say this declaration was
`
`Page 24
`
`drafted before May 5, 2017?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Does that refresh your memory when exactly
`
`this was prepared?
`
` A. It was filed -- or I signed the
`
`declaration on May 5, 2017, so it was prepared
`
`before then.
`
` Q. Do you believe there's any work in this
`
`declaration was done after May 5, 2017?
`
` A. I don't understand the question.
`
` Q. Do you -- so the sig- -- the date here is
`
`May 5, 2017, right?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. All of the work you did for the
`
`declaration was done before May 5, 2017; is that
`
`right?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Form. Objection.
`
`Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: Yeah, this declaration, the
`
`text that's in the four corners of this document,
`
`was finalized by May 5, 2017.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. But do you know when this document was
`
`actually filed with the -- with the board?
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`Page 25
`
` A. I do not know.
`
` Q. I'll represent to you this document was
`
`filed as part of the petition 2018-00226.
`
` Do you believe you've added any new
`
`information or content to this document after May 5,
`
`2017?
`
` A. I don't believe so.
`
` Q. Okay. So if you go to the first page, the
`
`cover page of this document it says "U.S. Patent
`
`No. 7,124,205.
`
` Do you see that?
`
` A. Correct.
`
` Q. So this declaration is about a declaration
`
`for -- for -- for this patent, this 7,124,205; is
`
`that right?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. How long have you been spending on -- on
`
`this declaration, you know, to prepare it?
`
` A. Again, it's been some -- quite some time I
`
`submitted my invoices for billing, but I believe
`
`until this time I -- I would have spent quite a bit
`
`of time.
`
` Q. Do you have an estimation?
`
` A. I don't recall. I think it would be -- it
`
`would surely be over 100 hours by then, but I don't
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 26
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`know a particular number.
`
` Q. Is that over 200 hours?
`
` A. I don't -- I don't recall.
`
` Q. Can you turn to page 017?
`
` A. 017.
`
` Q. That's page 14 of the declaration.
`
` A. I'm there, yes.
`
` Q. Okay. Do you see there's a Section No. 2,
`
`"Portions of the Protocol Offloaded"?
`
` [Reporter requests clarification.]
`
` MR. LI: "Portions of the Protocol
`
`Offloaded."
`
` THE WITNESS: Yes.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Okay. And paragraph 31 says, "As
`
`explained in Dr. Horst's declaration (see paragraph
`
`61), the portion of the protocol offloaded can be
`
`between full and partial offload."
`
` Do you see that?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. And you mention Dr. Horst here.
`
` Do you know who Dr. Horst is?
`
` A. I -- I believe he's one -- he's one of the
`
`witnesses retained for some of the other patents.
`
` Q. Have you ever talked with Dr. Horst in
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 27
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`this case?
`
` A. Not about the case, no.
`
` Q. Have you ever talked with Dr. Horst ever?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Form.
`
` THE WITNESS: I -- I think I might have,
`
`but nothing about -- nothing about this matter.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Okay. But -- but you have -- you have met
`
`him?
`
` A. I have not met with him as a person, I
`
`mean, in terms of one on one, but we might have been
`
`at the Weil, Gotshal office at the same time, when,
`
`you know, there were lunch -- you know, open lunch
`
`area.
`
` Q. And you have not talked with Dr. Horst
`
`about this case ever?
`
` A. No.
`
` Q. Have you reviewed Dr. Horst's declaration
`
`in this case?
`
` A. I believe I -- I reviewed the -- the
`
`portion of the declaration that pertains to the
`
`background section only.
`
` Q. Okay. Who sent you the declaration,
`
`Dr. Horst's declaration?
`
` A. So, again, I think I've -- I've only
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 28
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`reviewed the background portion of the declaration.
`
`I don't believe I've seen the rest of his
`
`declarations. And I re- -- I think it was Weil,
`
`Gotshal that provided with that background section
`
`to review.
`
` Q. How long did you spend on reviewing the --
`
`the -- the -- Dr. Horst's declaration?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Relevance.
`
` THE WITNESS: Just to be clear, I just
`
`reviewed the background section. I don't think I
`
`was provided with any other parts of his
`
`declaration. And I don't remember precisely how
`
`much time I spent on this.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Did you review any -- any exhibits cited
`
`in Dr. Horst's declaration?
`
` A. For -- I think for all of the references
`
`that I've cited to here in my own declaration, I've
`
`reviewed those -- those references myself.
`
` Q. So if we look at paragraph 30, it mentions
`
`several exhibits, for example, Woodside, TCP/IP
`
`protocol offload from -- for Bach, Erickson, Morris,
`
`Cooper, Kung, and all these references in paragraph
`
`30.
`
` Have you reviewed all of them?
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 29
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
` A. I believe I've reviewed them to the extent
`
`that I reviewed Dr. Horst's background declaration,
`
`and read -- and I reviewed the -- the explanation to
`
`the extent that each of these references provide an
`
`example of a full offload and partial offload and so
`
`forth. So I've reviewed those references to confirm
`
`that, indeed, those references were about certain
`
`types of partial offload or certain types of full
`
`offload.
`
` Q. What do you mean by "full offload"?
`
` A. Full offload usually means the enti- --
`
`the implementation of the entire protocol stack away
`
`from the host CPU.
`
` Q. What do you mean by "entire protocol
`
`stack"? What does that include?
`
` A. It depends on the -- the paper or the
`
`reference that describes the capability. So, for
`
`example, some of the references talk about
`
`implementing the TCP/IP protocol suite --
`
` [Reporter requests clarification.]
`
` THE WITNESS: TCP/IP protocol suite in a
`
`separate piece of computing -- separate piece of
`
`computing hardware from the host CPU.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. So is offloading TCP/IP full offload or --
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 30
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`or partial offload?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Form.
`
` THE WITNESS: I think in each reference
`
`that -- that I refer to, they, themselves, will say
`
`what they're offloading. So if the paper is about
`
`offloading TCP/IP protocol, then it will be a full
`
`offloading of the TCP/IP protocol.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Does that mean it will also offload
`
`protocol -- I guess -- I guess my question is, what
`
`does "full" mean here? Like, the scope of "full"
`
`does not mean offload every protocol layers?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Form.
`
` THE WITNESS: I think the references
`
`that -- that talk about the full offloading of
`
`TCP/IP, it will be the full offloading of TCP and
`
`IP.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. Okay. Does that mean offloading any other
`
`layers?
`
` A. I think the references, when they talk
`
`about the full offloading of TCP/IP, they're
`
`offloading the TCP processing and they're offloading
`
`the IP processing, and it's well known that the
`
`layers below IP, they're often implemented in
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`Page 31
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`hardware already.
`
` Q. By "hardware," you mean what? What does
`
`"hardware" mean here?
`
` A. It -- some of the data link layer and
`
`physical layer are typically inter -- implemented in
`
`some form of interface adapter.
`
` Q. So -- so you said when TCP/IP are
`
`offloaded, the lower layers are naturally offloaded
`
`to -- to the -- to the interface adapter?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Form.
`
` THE WITNESS: I think the references that
`
`talk about offloading TCP and IP, the authors know
`
`that it's well known in the art already that the
`
`layers below IP, offloading of those has already
`
`been done before.
`
`BY MR. LI:
`
` Q. But does that mean they -- they are
`
`necessarily offloaded to the adapter? Does that
`
`mean the -- the lower layers are necessarily
`
`offloaded to adapter?
`
` MS. BRANCH: Objection. Form.
`
` THE WITNESS: I think it depends on the
`
`particular disclosure in these references. If they
`
`-- if they describe the offloading of the TCP/IP as
`
`part of some network interface device, then it would
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`
`
`1
`
`2
`
`3
`
`4
`
`5
`
`6
`
`7
`
`8
`
`9
`
`10
`
`11
`
`12
`
`13
`
`14
`
`15
`
`16
`
`17
`
`18
`
`19
`
`20
`
`21
`
`22
`
`23
`
`24
`
`25
`
`include the -- the lower layers. If they showed as
`
`a separate card from the interface device, then the
`
`offloading of the TCP/IP will be on one card, and
`
`the offloading of the lower layer protocols will be
`
`Page 32
`
`on anoth
Accessing this document will incur an additional charge of $.
After purchase, you can access this document again without charge.
Accept $ Charge
Still Working On It
This document is taking longer than usual to download. This can happen if we need to contact the court directly to obtain the document and their servers are running slowly.
Give it another minute or two to complete, and then try the refresh button.
A few More Minutes ... Still Working
It can take up to 5 minutes for us to download a document if the court servers are running slowly.
Thank you for your continued patience.
This document could not be displayed.
We could not find this document within its docket. Please go back to the docket page and check the link. If that does not work, go back to the docket and refresh it to pull the newest information.
Your account does not support viewing this document.
You need a Paid Account to view this document. Click here to change your account type.
Your account does not support viewing this document.
Set your membership
status to view this document.
With a Docket Alarm membership, you'll
get a whole lot more, including:
- Up-to-date information for this case.
- Email alerts whenever there is an update.
- Full text search for other cases.
- Get email alerts whenever a new case matches your search.
One Moment Please
The filing “” is large (MB) and is being downloaded.
Please refresh this page in a few minutes to see if the filing has been downloaded. The filing will also be emailed to you when the download completes.
Your document is on its way!
If you do not receive the document in five minutes, contact support at support@docketalarm.com.
Sealed Document
We are unable to display this document, it may be under a court ordered seal.
If you have proper credentials to access the file, you may proceed directly to the court's system using your government issued username and password.
Access Government Site
