·1· · · · ·UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`· · · · · · BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`·2· · · · · · · · - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
`
`·3· ·AUTOLIV ASP, INC.; NIHON PLAST CO., LTD.; NEATON AUTO
`· · ·PRODUCTS MANUFACTURING, INC.; TAKATA CORPORATION; TK
`·4· ·HOLDINGS INC.; TOYODA GOSEI CO., LTD.; HYUNDAI MOBIS
`· · · · CO., LTD.; MOBIS ALABAMA, LLC; AND MOBIS PARTS
`·5· · · · · · · · · · · ·AMERICA, LLC,
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`·6· · · · · · · · · · · · Petitioners
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`·7· · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·v.
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`·8· · · · · · · · AMERICAN VEHICULAR SCIENCES,
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`·9· · · · · · · · · · · ·Patent Owner.
`
`10· · · · · · · · ·- - - - - - - - - - - - - -
`· · · · · Inter Partes Review Case No. IPR2016-01794
`11· · · · · · · · · · · Patent 9,043,093
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·Washington, D.C.
`12· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·Friday, June 9, 2017
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`13· · · · Deposition of STEPHEN W. ROUHANA, Ph.D., the
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`14· ·witness herein, called for examination by counsel on
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`15· ·behalf of the Patent Owner in the above-entitled
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`16· ·matter, pursuant to Notice and 37 C.F.R. Section 42.53
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`17· ·of the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, taken at the
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`18· ·offices of Sughrue Mion, PLLC, 2100 Pennsylvania
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`19· ·Avenue, NW, Washington, D.C. 20037, scheduled to begin
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`20· ·at 10:00 a.m., before Jeaninn Y. Alexis, Court
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`21· ·Reporter and a Notary Public in and for the State of
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`22· ·Maryland.
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`IPR 2016-01794
`American Vehicular Sciences
`Exhibit 2040
`
`
`· · · · · · BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`·2· · · · · · · · - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
`
`·3· ·AUTOLIV ASP, INC.; NIHON PLAST CO., LTD.; NEATON AUTO
`· · ·PRODUCTS MANUFACTURING, INC.; TAKATA CORPORATION; TK
`·4· ·HOLDINGS INC.; TOYODA GOSEI CO., LTD.; HYUNDAI MOBIS
`· · · · CO., LTD.; MOBIS ALABAMA, LLC; AND MOBIS PARTS
`·5· · · · · · · · · · · ·AMERICA, LLC,
`
`·6· · · · · · · · · · · · Petitioners
`
`·7· · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·v.
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`·8· · · · · · · · AMERICAN VEHICULAR SCIENCES,
`
`·9· · · · · · · · · · · ·Patent Owner.
`
`10· · · · · · · · ·- - - - - - - - - - - - - -
`· · · · · Inter Partes Review Case No. IPR2016-01794
`11· · · · · · · · · · · Patent 9,043,093
`· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·Washington, D.C.
`12· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·Friday, June 9, 2017
`
`13· · · · Deposition of STEPHEN W. ROUHANA, Ph.D., the
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`14· ·witness herein, called for examination by counsel on
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`15· ·behalf of the Patent Owner in the above-entitled
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`16· ·matter, pursuant to Notice and 37 C.F.R. Section 42.53
`
`17· ·of the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, taken at the
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`18· ·offices of Sughrue Mion, PLLC, 2100 Pennsylvania
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`19· ·Avenue, NW, Washington, D.C. 20037, scheduled to begin
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`20· ·at 10:00 a.m., before Jeaninn Y. Alexis, Court
`
`21· ·Reporter and a Notary Public in and for the State of
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`22· ·Maryland.
`
`IPR 2016-01794
`American Vehicular Sciences
`Exhibit 2040
`
`
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`·1· · · · · · · · · · · · APPEARANCES
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`·2· ·On Behalf of the Petitioner:
`· · ·BRIAN C. CLAASSEN, ESQUIRE
`·3· · · · · · ·Knobbe Martens
`· · · · · · · ·2040 Main Street, 14th Floor
`·4· · · · · · ·Irvine, California 92614
`· · · · · · · ·949.760.0404
`·5· · · · · · ·brian.claassen@knobbe.com
`
`·6· ·On Behalf of the Patent Owner:
`· · ·GREGORY J. GONSALVES, ESQUIRE
`·7· · · · · · ·Gonsalves Law Firm
`· · · · · · · ·2216 Beacon Lane
`·8· · · · · · ·Falls Church, Virginia 22043
`· · · · · · · ·571.419.7252
`·9· · · · · · ·gonsalves@gonsalveslawfirm.com
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`10· ·Also Appearing:
`· · ·WILLIAM H. OLDACH III, ESQUIRE
`11· · · · · · ·Vorys, Sater, Seymour and Pease LLP
`· · · · · · · ·1909 K Street, 9th Floor
`12· · · · · · ·Washington, D.C. 20006
`· · · · · · · ·202.467.8880
`13· · · · · · ·wholdach@vorys.com
`· · ·JOHN M. BIRD, ESQUIRE
`14· · · · · · ·Sughrue Mion, PLLC
`· · · · · · · ·2100 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
`15· · · · · · ·Washington, D.C. 20037
`· · · · · · · ·202.775.7584
`16· · · · · · ·jbird@sughrue.com
`· · ·SHIRI ABHYANKAR, ESQUIRE and WES ACHEY, ESQUIRE
`17· · · · · · ·Alston & Bird
`· · · · · · · ·1201 West Peachtree Street
`18· · · · · · ·Atlanta, Georgia 30309
`· · · · · · · ·404.881.4831
`19· · · · · · ·shri.abhyankar@alston.com
`· · · · · · · ·wes.achey@alston.com
`20· ·DANIEL N. YANNUZZI, ESQUIRE (Via telephonically)
`· · · · · · · ·Sheppard Mullin Richter & Hampton
`21· · · · · · ·El Camino Real, Suite 200
`· · · · · · · ·San Diego, California 92130
`22· · · · · · ·858.720.8924
`· · · · · · · ·dcho@sheppardmullin.com
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`
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`·1· · · · · · · · · · · · ·I N D E X
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`·2
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`·3· ·WITNESS:· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · PAGE
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`·4· ·STEPHEN W. ROUHANA, Ph.D.
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`·5· · · · · · ·Examination by Mr. Gonsalves· · · · · · · ·4
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`·6
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`·7· · · · · · · · · · · E X H I B I T S
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`·8
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`·9· ·(No exhibits to attach hereto.)
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`10
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`11
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`12
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`13
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`14
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`15
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`16
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`17
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`18
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`·1· · · · · · · · · ·P R O C E E D I N G S
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`·2· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·(10:16 a.m.)
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`·3· ·Whereupon,
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`·4· · · · · · · · STEPHEN W. ROUHANA, Ph.D.,
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`·5· ·the deponent herein, called for oral examination in
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`·6· ·the matter pending, being first duly sworn to tell the
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`·7· ·truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth,
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`·8· ·testifies as follows:
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`·9· · · · · · EXAMINATION BY COUNSEL ON BEHALF OF
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`10· · · · · · · · · · · THE PATENT OWNER
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`11· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
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`12· · · · Q· · I know that we were just in this room
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`13· ·yesterday for the deposition for the previous IPR, but
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`14· ·I nonetheless have to go over some formalities just
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`15· ·for the record.
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`16· · · · A· · I understand.
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`17· · · · Q· · So you may be bored in the first portion of
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`18· ·the deposition.
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`19· · · · · · ·So could you please recite and spell your
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`20· ·name for the record.
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`21· · · · A· · Dr. Stephen Rouhana, S-t-e-p-h-e-n,
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`22· ·R-o-u-h-a-n-a.
`
`
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`·1· · · · Q· · And could you also recite your business
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`·2· ·address.
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`·3· · · · A· · 47526 Clipper Street, No. 701952, Plymouth,
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`·4· ·Michigan 48170.
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`·5· · · · Q· · And you understand that you're under oath in
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`·6· ·this deposition just as you would be in a trial; is
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`·7· ·that correct?
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`·8· · · · A· · I do.
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`·9· · · · Q· · Is there anything that would inhibit you
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`10· ·from telling the truth and giving accurate testimony
`
`11· ·at this deposition today?
`
`12· · · · A· · No.
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`13· · · · Q· · I'm going to hand to you what's already been
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`14· ·marked in this IPR as Exhibit 1003.
`
`15· · · · · · ·Do you recognize this exhibit?
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`16· · · · · · ·(Exhibit tendered to deponent.)
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`17· · · · A· · Yes, I do.
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`18· · · · Q· · What is it?
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`19· · · · A· · This is my declaration.
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`20· · · · Q· · Is there anything that you would like to
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`21· ·change or modify in your declaration?
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`22· · · · A· · No.
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`
`
`·1· · · · Q· · I'm handing what will be marked in this IPR
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`·2· ·as Exhibit 2020 and it is the file history for Patent
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`·3· ·5772238.
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`·4· · · · · · ·Do you recall reviewing this file history
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`·5· ·before you prepared your declaration?
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`·6· · · · · · ·(Exhibit tendered to deponent.)
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`·7· · · · A· · I do.
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`·8· · · · Q· · Well this file history pertains to
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`·9· ·Application Serial No. 08571247.
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`10· · · · · · ·And if it's okay with you I'll refer to the
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`11· ·application by its last three numbers, '247
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`12· ·application so I won't have to recite all eight
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`13· ·numbers every time I ask you a question about it.
`
`14· · · · · · ·Is that all right?
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`15· · · · A· · Yes.
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`16· · · · Q· · There's page numbers at the bottom
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`17· ·sequentially from one through whatever the last one is
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`18· ·in the 200s.· They're a little bit small but those are
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`19· ·the page numbers I will be referring to.
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`20· · · · · · ·So could you turn to Page No. 121?
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`21· · · · A· · I'm there.
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`22· · · · Q· · Do you see Item No. 4 underneath the phrase
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`
`
`·1· ·"Other principle objects and advantages of this
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`·2· ·invention are"?
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`·3· · · · A· · I do.
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`·4· · · · Q· · And I will read Item 4 into the record.
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`·5· · · · · · ·"No. 4, to provide an air bag module where a
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`·6· ·single module can be used to protect both a front and
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`·7· ·a rear passenger of the vehicle in side impacts."
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`·8· · · · · · ·Did I read that correctly?
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`·9· · · · A· · Yes, you did.
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`10· · · · Q· · Does this sentence that I just read indicate
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`11· ·that the '247 application discloses a single-side air
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`12· ·bag extending across two rows of the vehicle?
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`13· · · · A· · It indicates that an air bag monitor, a
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`14· ·single monitor can be used to protect both front and
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`15· ·rear passengers.
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`16· · · · Q· · Can you turn to Page 123 of this same
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`17· ·exhibit?
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`18· · · · A· · I'm there.
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`19· · · · Q· · And can you look at the sentence that says
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`20· ·"Briefly the air bag module in accordance."
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`21· · · · · · ·Do you see that one?
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`22· · · · A· · Yes, I do.
`
`
`
`·1· · · · Q· · So I'll read the entire sentence.
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`·2· · · · · · ·"Briefly the air bag module in accordance
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`·3· ·with the invention is long and thin and can
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`·4· ·conveniently be made in any length and bent into
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`·5· ·almost any generally linear shape."
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`·6· · · · · · ·"This module is typically mounted on or
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`·7· ·slightly below a surface in the passenger compartment
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`·8· ·such as the ceiling, instrument panel, seat or knee
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`·9· ·bolster support structure."
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`10· · · · · · ·Did I read those two sentences correctly?
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`11· · · · A· · Yes, you did.
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`12· · · · Q· · Did these two sentences indicate that the
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`13· ·air bag disclosed in the '247 application can be
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`14· ·mounted in different places in the passenger
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`15· ·compartment?
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`16· · · · · · ·MR. OLDACH:· I object to the form.
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`17· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· Yes.
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`18· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
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`19· · · · Q· · Two of the places that the air bag can by
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`20· ·mounted are the ceiling as well as a knee bolster
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`21· ·support?
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`22· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Same objection.
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`
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`·1· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· Those are two of the places
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`·2· ·listed in the sentence you've just read.
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`·3· · · · Q· · Can you turn your attention to Page 124 of
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`·4· ·the exhibit that's in front of you?
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`·5· · · · A· · I'm there.
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`·6· · · · Q· · And then we will be looking at that as well
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`·7· ·as what goes on to the very next page, Page 125.
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`·8· · · · A· · Okay.
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`·9· · · · Q· · Do you see the sentence that begins "The
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`10· ·surface of the passenger compartment to which the
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`11· ·module is mounted"?
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`12· · · · A· · Yes.
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`13· · · · Q· · And does that sentence -- take your time to
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`14· ·read it the entire sentence.
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`15· · · · · · ·Does that sentence indicate to you that the
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`16· ·module can be mounted to various places that are
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`17· ·identified in that sentence?
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`18· · · · A· · Can you repeat the question please?
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`19· · · · Q· · Sure.· Does this sentence list various
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`20· ·locations where the air bag module can be mounted?
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`21· · · · A· · Yes, it does.
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`22· · · · Q· · And is one of those locations where the air
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`
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`·1· ·bag can be mounted, a location along a side of the
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`·2· ·vehicle and suitable for mounting the module for
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`·3· ·protecting occupants of both front and rear seats in a
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`·4· ·side impact?
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`·5· · · · A· · Yes.
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`·6· · · · Q· · And does the phrase that I just read
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`·7· ·indicate that the '247 application discloses a single
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`·8· ·side air bag extending across two rows of the vehicle?
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`·9· · · · A· · Yes.
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`10· · · · Q· · Can you please turn to Page 127 of the
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`11· ·exhibit that's in front of you.
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`12· · · · A· · I'm there.
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`13· · · · Q· · Do you see the phrase that reads, "A single
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`14· ·air bag module can provide protection for both a
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`15· ·front-seat occupant and a rear-seat occupant on the
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`16· ·same side of the vehicle"?
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`17· · · · A· · Can you give me some help as to where that
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`18· ·is?· I don't see it.
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`19· · · · Q· · I believe it's the first full paragraph on
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`20· ·Page 127.
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`21· · · · A· · Yes, okay.· Yes, I see that.
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`22· · · · Q· · And do you also see a little bit further
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`
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`·1· ·that it reads: "In this case mounting -- means mount
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`·2· ·-- the air bag module to a surface of the passenger
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`·3· ·compartment, such that it extends in the horizontal
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`·4· ·direction from a front portion in the front to the
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`·5· ·passenger compartment toward a rear portion of the
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`·6· ·passenger compartment adjacent the side of the
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`·7· ·vehicle."
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`·8· · · · A· · Yes.
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`·9· · · · Q· · Did I read that correctly?
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`10· · · · A· · You did.
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`11· · · · Q· · Do these two sentences indicate that the
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`12· ·'247 application discloses a single-side air bag
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`13· ·extending across two rows of the vehicle?
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`14· · · · A· · Yes.
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`15· · · · Q· · I'm going to ask you to look at two pages of
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`16· ·the exhibit that's in front of you at the same time.
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`17· · · · A· · Okay.
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`18· · · · Q· · One of the pages is on Page 89.
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`19· · · · A· · Okay.· Got that.
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`20· · · · Q· · And do you see that Figure 5 is on Page 89?
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`21· · · · A· · I do.
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`22· · · · Q· · And the other page is 129.
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`
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`·1· · · · A· · I see that.
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`·2· · · · Q· · Do you see the sentence on Page 129 that
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`·3· ·begins "Figure 5 is a view of another preferred
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`·4· ·embodiment of the invention"?
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`·5· · · · A· · I do.
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`·6· · · · Q· · So let me read that whole sentence.
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`·7· · · · · · ·"Figure 5 is a view of another preferred
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`·8· ·embodiment of the invention shown mounted in a manner
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`·9· ·to provide head protection for a front- and a
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`10· ·rear-seat occupant in side-impact collisions and to
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`11· ·provide protection against impacts to the roof support
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`12· ·pillars and angular frontal impacts."
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`13· · · · · · ·Did I read that correctly?
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`14· · · · A· · Yes, you did.
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`15· · · · Q· · Does this sentence indicate that the
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`16· ·single-side air bag shown in Figure 5 extends across
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`17· ·two rows of the vehicle?
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`18· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
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`19· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· Can you repeat the question
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`20· ·please?
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`21· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
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`22· · · · Q· · Does the sentence that I just read indicate
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`
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`·1· ·that the single-side air bag shown in Figure 5 extends
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`·2· ·across two rows of the vehicle?
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`·3· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Same objection.
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`·4· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· It states that the invention
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`·5· ·shown is mounted in a manner to provide head
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`·6· ·protection for the front- and rear-seat occupants in
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`·7· ·side impacts.
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`·8· · · · Q· · And in order to provide head production for
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`·9· ·a front- and a rear-seat occupant, the air bag would
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`10· ·have to extend across two rows of the vehicle.
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`11· · · · · · ·Is that your understanding?
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`12· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
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`13· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· Yes.
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`14· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
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`15· · · · Q· · Can you turn your attention to Page 148 of
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`16· ·the exhibit that's in front of you?
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`17· · · · A· · Are we done with the other pages?
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`18· · · · Q· · Yes.· So now you can just look at one page
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`19· ·at time.
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`20· · · · A· · Page 148?
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`21· · · · Q· · Yes.
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`22· · · · A· · I'm there.
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`
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`·1· · · · Q· · So can you please direct your attention to
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`·2· ·the last paragraph on Page 148.· And the sentence that
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`·3· ·begins with "In this embodiment the Air bag 310 will
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`·4· ·be deployed"?
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`·5· · · · · · ·Are you there?
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`·6· · · · A· · Yes.
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`·7· · · · Q· · Okay.· So let me read those three sentences.
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`·8· · · · · · ·"In this embodiment the Air bag 310 will be
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`·9· ·deployed from the ceiling in the event of a side
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`10· ·impact of sufficient severity that an occupant's head
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`11· ·would otherwise be injured.
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`12· · · · · · ·This implementation is significant since the
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`13· ·air bags for the front and rear seats are combined
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`14· ·which results in significantly greater protection in
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`15· ·side impacts when the windows are broken.
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`16· · · · · · ·The air bags are less likely to project
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`17· ·outside of the windows if they are restrained by the B
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`18· ·Pillar 320 and other vehicle structures such as the A
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`19· ·Pillar 322 as shown in Figure 1."
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`20· · · · · · ·Does this passage that I just read indicate
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`21· ·that the '247 application discloses a single-side air
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`22· ·bag extending across two rows of a vehicle?
`
`
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`·1· · · · · · ·MR. OLDACH:· Object to the form.
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`·2· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· Yes.
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`·3· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· I want to note for the record
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`·4· ·before you start the next question that you read from
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`·5· ·Page 148 and Page 149.
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`·6· · · · · · ·So the quote continued onto Page 149.
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`·7· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
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`·8· · · · Q· · Thank you.
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`·9· · · · · · ·Can you turn your attention to Page 131.
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`10· · · · A· · I'm there.
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`11· · · · Q· · Do you see in the first full paragraph the
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`12· ·sentence that begins with the term "air bag"?
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`13· · · · A· · I do.
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`14· · · · Q· · So let me read that entire sentence.
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`15· · · · · · ·"The term 'air bag' as used herein means
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`16· ·either the case where the Air Bag Module 100 contains
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`17· ·a single air bag as in most conventional designs or
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`18· ·where the Air Bag Module 100 contains a plurality of
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`19· ·air bags or where the Air Bag Module 100 contains a
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`20· ·single air bag having a plurality of compartments
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`21· ·which deploy in constant to protect an occupant."
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`22· · · · · · ·Did I read that sentence correctly?
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`
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`·1· · · · A· · You did.
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`·2· · · · Q· · Does the sentence that I just read indicate
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`·3· ·that the '247 application discloses a single air bag
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`·4· ·having a plurality of compartments?
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`·5· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
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`·6· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· No.
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`·7· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
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`·8· · · · Q· · Does the sentence that I just read indicate
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`·9· ·to you that the Air Bag Module 100 can be of three
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`10· ·different types?
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`11· · · · A· · It indicates that Air Bag Module 100 can be
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`12· ·of three different types, yes.
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`13· · · · Q· · And one of those types is a single air bag
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`14· ·as in most conventional designs?
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`15· · · · A· · That's correct.
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`16· · · · Q· · And another is an air bag module containing
`
`17· ·a plurality of air bags?· Is that the second one?
`
`18· · · · A· · Yes.· Air Bag Module 100 can contain a
`
`19· ·plurality of air bags.
`
`20· · · · Q· · And is the third type a single air bag
`
`21· ·having a plurality of compartments which deploy in
`
`22· ·constant to protect an occupant?
`
`
`
`·1· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`·2· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· Again, yes, Air Bag Module
`
`·3· ·100 can contain a single air bag having a plurality of
`
`·4· ·compartments which deploy in concert to protect an
`
`·5· ·occupant.
`
`·6· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`·7· · · · Q· · Can you turn your attention to Page 88 of
`
`·8· ·the exhibit?
`
`·9· · · · A· · I'm there.
`
`10· · · · Q· · Does the air bag displayed in Figure 4 have
`
`11· ·a plurality of compartments?
`
`12· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`13· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· It's impossible to tell from
`
`14· ·this drawing.
`
`15· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`16· · · · Q· · Do you see an air bag on Figure 4?
`
`17· · · · A· · I do.
`
`18· · · · Q· · And how is that referred to?· By what
`
`19· ·reference number is it referred to?
`
`20· · · · A· · 200 or 210.
`
`21· · · · Q· · And what type of air bag is shown in Figure
`
`22· ·4?
`
`
`
`·1· · · · A· · It would appear to be a knee air bag.
`
`·2· · · · Q· · And do you see that there's a series of
`
`·3· ·circular lines on the air bag that's shown in Figure
`
`·4· ·4?
`
`·5· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`·6· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· I do.
`
`·7· · · · Q· · And what would those circular lines mean to
`
`·8· ·person of ordinary --
`
`·9· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Same objection.
`
`10· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· They could mean a whole list
`
`11· ·of things.
`
`12· · · · · · ·Blue.
`
`13· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection.
`
`14· · · · · · ·Is that a question?
`
`15· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`16· · · · Q· · Okay.· I'll be more explicit with my
`
`17· ·question.
`
`18· · · · · · ·You had indicated it could mean different
`
`19· ·things; is that correct?
`
`20· · · · A· · That's correct.
`
`21· · · · Q· · So what is one of the things it could mean?
`
`22· · · · A· · It could be contoured lines that are used in
`
`
`
`·1· ·engineering, drawings to show a curved shape.
`
`·2· · · · Q· · Okay.· What's another thing that it could
`
`·3· ·mean?
`
`·4· · · · A· · It could be pattern from tethers that are in
`
`·5· ·the air bags which are very common in air bags.
`
`·6· · · · Q· · Would a tether separate an air bag into
`
`·7· ·multiple compartments?
`
`·8· · · · A· · Not necessarily.
`
`·9· · · · Q· · Would tethers separate an air bag into
`
`10· ·multiple compartments in some situations and not
`
`11· ·others?
`
`12· · · · · · ·The reason I'm asking is you said "Not
`
`13· ·necessarily", so it seems to suggest to me that it may
`
`14· ·or may not separate the air bag into compartments.
`
`15· · · · A· · That would depend on the design of the
`
`16· ·tether.
`
`17· · · · Q· · Can you describe a design of the tether that
`
`18· ·would separate the air bag into multiple compartments?
`
`19· · · · A· · Yes.
`
`20· · · · Q· · Would you do so please.
`
`21· · · · A· · If you had a tether that was over designed
`
`22· ·in terms of design and filled the entire
`
`
`
`·1· ·cross-sectional area of the air bag in question.
`
`·2· · · · Q· · So when we were discussing the circular
`
`·3· ·lines in Figure 4, you indicated one possibility that
`
`·4· ·could be contour lines.
`
`·5· · · · · · ·Is that what you said?
`
`·6· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`·7· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· Yes.
`
`·8· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`·9· · · · Q· · And the second possibility is it could be
`
`10· ·tethers?· Is that what you said also?
`
`11· · · · A· · That is what I said, yes.
`
`12· · · · Q· · And are there any other possibilities
`
`13· ·besides those two that you've just mentioned?
`
`14· · · · A· · Yes, there are.
`
`15· · · · Q· · Could you identify the next one?
`
`16· · · · A· · Sure.· May I go into my declaration?· I've
`
`17· ·listed them.
`
`18· · · · Q· · Sure.
`
`19· · · · · · ·(Deponent reviewing documents.)
`
`20· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Just so the record is clear,
`
`21· ·the witness is now turning to Exhibit 1003.· And he
`
`22· ·appears to be looking at Page 27 of Exhibit 1003.
`
`
`
`·1· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· Would you like me to go on?
`
`·2· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`·3· · · · Q· · Sure.
`
`·4· · · · A· · "Physical contouring on the front of the air
`
`·5· ·bag by the design of the so pattern to help keep the
`
`·6· ·knees from sliding off the air bag."
`
`·7· · · · Q· · Okay.· And can you now turn your attention
`
`·8· ·to Page 154 of Exhibit 2020?
`
`·9· · · · A· · I'm there.
`
`10· · · · Q· · Do you see the sentence that begins "With
`
`11· ·the development of the film air bag as described in
`
`12· ·the co-pending patent applications referenced above"?
`
`13· · · · A· · Yes, I do.
`
`14· · · · Q· · So I'm going to read a few sentences and
`
`15· ·stop there.
`
`16· · · · · · ·"With the development of the film air bag as
`
`17· ·described in the co-pending applications referenced
`
`18· ·above and the inflator design described herein.
`
`19· · · · · · ·A very thin air bag module is possible which
`
`20· ·can be made in any length typically the module length
`
`21· ·will exceed 10 to 20 times the width or thickness of
`
`22· ·the module and in all cases at least five times.
`
`
`
`·1· · · · · · ·The length of the gas generator will
`
`·2· ·typically be 40 to 80 times its thickness and in all
`
`·3· ·cases at least ten times.· This shape permits the
`
`·4· ·module to be easily mounted in many location and to be
`
`·5· ·bent or conserved match the interior shape of the
`
`·6· ·vehicle."
`
`·7· · · · · · ·"For example one could be positioned so as
`
`·8· ·to conform to the ceiling to protect rear-seat
`
`·9· ·occupants.· Another one could stretch the length of
`
`10· ·the car on each side to protect both front and rear
`
`11· ·occupants from head injuries in side impacts."
`
`12· · · · · · ·"A similar system could be used for a
`
`13· ·deployable knee bolster.· And eventually a single
`
`14· ·module can be used for both the passenger and driver
`
`15· ·in frontal impacts when used in conjunction with
`
`16· ·electronics steered by wire system for example."
`
`17· · · · · · ·Did I read that collection of sentences
`
`18· ·properly?
`
`19· · · · A· · Yes.
`
`20· · · · Q· · Does the passage that I just read indicate
`
`21· ·to you that the air bag of the '247 application can be
`
`22· ·positioned along the length of the car across two rows
`
`
`
`·1· ·on each side or as a knee bolster?
`
`·2· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`·3· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· It specifically says another
`
`·4· ·one can stretch the length of the car on each side to
`
`·5· ·protect both front and rear occupants from head
`
`·6· ·injuries in side impacts.
`
`·7· · · · · · ·And it says that a similar system can be
`
`·8· ·used for a deployable knee bolster.
`
`·9· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`10· · · · Q· · Can you turn the page to Page 117.
`
`11· · · · · · · Do you see on Page 117 that the '247
`
`12· ·application mentions US Patent No. 50045862?
`
`13· · · · A· · Yes.
`
`14· · · · Q· · I'm going to hand to you what is going to be
`
`15· ·marked as 2026.
`
`16· · · · · · ·Have you ever read this Patent 5004586
`
`17· ·before today?
`
`18· · · · · · ·(Exhibit tendered to deponent.)
`
`19· · · · A· · I don't recall.
`
`20· · · · Q· · Do you recall whether you considered this
`
`21· ·patent in writing your declaration?
`
`22· · · · A· · I don't recall.
`
`
`
`·1· · · · Q· · Can you turn to Column 1, Line 7 of Exhibit
`
`·2· ·2026?
`
`·3· · · · A· · Yes.
`
`·4· · · · Q· · Do you see that Patent 5004586 mentions a
`
`·5· ·rubber boat?
`
`·6· · · · A· · Yes.
`
`·7· · · · Q· · If you could just set that aside for a
`
`·8· ·moment and return your attention back to the file
`
`·9· ·history Exhibit 2020.
`
`10· · · · · · ·And can you turn to Page 119?
`
`11· · · · A· · Okay.
`
`12· · · · Q· · Right around Line 15.
`
`13· · · · · · ·Do you see that the '247 application
`
`14· ·mentions Patent 3158314 to Young?
`
`15· · · · A· · I do.
`
`16· · · · Q· · I'm handing you what will be marked as
`
`17· ·Exhibit 2027 which is Patent 3158314 to Young.
`
`18· · · · · · ·Have you read Patent 3158314 before today?
`
`19· · · · A· · I don't believe so.
`
`20· · · · Q· · Can you turn your attention to Column 1,
`
`21· ·Line 11 of Patent 3158314?
`
`22· · · · A· · Yes.
`
`
`
`·1· · · · Q· · Do you see in the area of Patent 3158314
`
`·2· ·that I just identified that there's a mention of an
`
`·3· ·inflatable dinghy?
`
`·4· · · · A· · It mentions inflatable dinghies plural, yes.
`
`·5· · · · Q· · Do you know what an inflatable dinghy is?
`
`·6· · · · A· · I believe I do.
`
`·7· · · · Q· · What is it?
`
`·8· · · · A· · It's a boat that's used as a life raft when
`
`·9· ·you're in another boat.
`
`10· · · · Q· · I'm go to hand to you what will be marked in
`
`11· ·this proceeding as Exhibit 2030, and it's information
`
`12· ·on inflatable boats.
`
`13· · · · · · ·And can you familiarize yourself with the
`
`14· ·photographs and namely the photographs that are on the
`
`15· ·second page and on the subsequent pages until the end.
`
`16· · · · · · ·(Exhibit tendered to deponent.)
`
`17· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· I'll note for the record that
`
`18· ·Exhibit 2030, there's a copyright date of 2012.· It
`
`19· ·appears to have a series of photographs and a picture
`
`20· ·of a hand.
`
`21· · · · · · ·It appears to be a collection of
`
`22· ·photographs.· It's unclear who has taken the
`
`
`
`·1· ·photographs and how they relate to the first page of
`
`·2· ·the Exhibit 2030.
`
`·3· · · · · · ·MR. GONSALVES:· Well I'll represent to you
`
`·4· ·that these are photographs of the inflatable boat
`
`·5· ·that's shown on the first page of Exhibit 2030.
`
`·6· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· I have reviewed them.
`
`·7· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`·8· · · · Q· · Now taking a look at the pictures of the
`
`·9· ·inflatable boat, does the floor of the inflatable boat
`
`10· ·shown in Exhibit 2030 contain a plurality of
`
`11· ·compartments?
`
`12· · · · A· · I don't know.
`
`13· · · · Q· · Can you take a look at the fifth page from
`
`14· ·the beginning?
`
`15· · · · A· · Yes, I see it.
`
`16· · · · Q· · Do you see the cylinder-shaped portions of
`
`17· ·the floor of the inflatable boat on that photograph?
`
`18· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection the form.
`
`19· · · · · · ·If you're representing this is the floor of
`
`20· ·the boat --
`
`21· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· Is this the picture?
`
`22
`
`
`
`·1· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`·2· · · · Q· · Yes.
`
`·3· · · · A· · I don't see cylinders.· I see material that
`
`·4· ·has lines but without looking inside I can't tell what
`
`·5· ·the shape of that surface is in the three dimensions.
`
`·6· · · · Q· · Does the floor of the inflatable boat that's
`
`·7· ·shown in Exhibit 2030 have only one nozzle for
`
`·8· ·receiving air?
`
`·9· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`10· · · · · · ·I'm going to assume you are asking based
`
`11· ·upon the photograph shown in Exhibit 2030.
`
`12· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· It's a little hard to tell
`
`13· ·because of the image at the bottom of the fabric is
`
`14· ·kind of wrinkled but it appears -- all I can see in
`
`15· ·the photographs is one port.
`
`16· · · · · · ·Yes, there is a second port.· There may
`
`17· ·actually be three ports.
`
`18· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`19· · · · Q· · Well my question was restricted to the floor
`
`20· ·of the inflatable raft.
`
`21· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`22· · · · · · ·You haven't defined what "the floor of the
`
`
`
`·1· ·raft" is.
`
`·2· · · · · · ·MR. GONSALVES:· The floor is the bottom.
`
`·3· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Then define what "the bottom"
`
`·4· ·is.
`
`·5· · · · · · ·MR. GONSALVES:· The bottom is the opposite
`
`·6· ·side of the top.
`
`·7· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Same objection.
`
`·8· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· The item would be on the next
`
`·9· ·to the last page.· It looks like the bottom of the
`
`10· ·boat.
`
`11· · · · Q· · And if you look at the very last page, would
`
`12· ·it be your understanding of the bottom of the boat is
`
`13· ·where the two people are sitting?
`
`14· · · · A· · The bottom of the boat is the surface that's
`
`15· ·in contact with the water; is that not correct?
`
`16· · · · Q· · Correct.
`
`17· · · · A· · So that would be the next to the last page.
`
`18· ·That's not what people would not sit on.
`
`19· · · · Q· · So if you see the next to the last page, you
`
`20· ·see the bottom of the boat; is that correct?
`
`21· · · · A· · Sorry.· The third from the last.· This is
`
`22· ·the page I'm referring to.· That's the bottom of the
`
`
`
`·1· ·boat.
`
`·2· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· I'm going to note for the
`
`·3· ·record that my copy of Exhibit 2030 is different from
`
`·4· ·the witness's copy of the exhibit.
`
`·5· · · · · · ·MR. GONSALVES:· So let me try to fix this so
`
`·6· ·we can try to talk about the same pictures at the same
`
`·7· ·time.
`
`·8· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· That would be helpful.
`
`·9· · · · · · ·MR. GONSALVES:· If you could hand them back,
`
`10· ·I will fix this.
`
`11· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· While you are doing that
`
`12· ·would it be an appropriate time to take a break?
`
`13· · · · · · ·MR. GONSALVES:· Yes, that will be fine as it
`
`14· ·may take me a couple of minutes.
`
`15· · · · · · ·(Short recess taken.)
`
`16· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`17· · · · Q· · So I'm handing you back Exhibit 2030 and
`
`18· ·here is a copy for your attorney.
`
`19· · · · A· · Thank you.
`
`20· · · · Q· · Could the two of you confirm that on all the
`
`21· ·pages are in the same order in the two copies that I
`
`22· ·gave to you?
`
`
`
`·1· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· I'll note for the record that
`
`·2· ·the versions of Exhibit 2030 that have just been
`
`·3· ·handed to us are now matching in order.
`
`·4· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`·5· · · · Q· · And also when we refer to the pages, just so
`
`·6· ·that we are all consistent in how we refer to them, we
`
`·7· ·will refer to them counting from the -- to the
`
`·8· ·beginning.
`
`·9· · · · A· · Okay.
`
`10· · · · Q· · Otherwise it's difficult to determine which
`
`11· ·page we are talking about.
`
`12· · · · A· · I understand.
`
`13· · · · Q· · So if you could take a look at the fourth
`
`14· ·page of the exhibit.
`
`15· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Note for record that the
`
`16· ·witness just held up the fourth and it's a photograph
`
`17· ·of a hand and he showed opposing counsel, both
`
`18· ·nodding.
`
`19· · · · Q· · Can you turn to the fifth page?
`
`20· · · · A· · Yes.
`
`21· · · · Q· · Do you see there's a portion of the boat,
`
`22· ·inflatable boat that has writing on it?
`
`
`
`·1· · · · A· · I do.
`
`·2· · · · Q· · What portion of the boat would you identify
`
`·3· ·that as?
`
`·4· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`·5· · · · Q· · Do you have a term that you prefer?
`
`·6· · · · A· · "The seating surface."
`
`·7· · · · Q· · The seating surface.· On the seating surface
`
`·8· ·the inflatable boat of Exhibit 2030 has only one
`
`·9· ·nozzle for receiving air; is that correct?
`
`10· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`11· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· I can't tell from this
`
`12· ·picture.· But if you go back to Page 1, this model has
`
`13· ·three nozzles and it's not clear where those nozzles
`
`14· ·fill.
`
`15· · · · · · ·It could all be one chamber or filled from
`
`16· ·three different nozzles.
`
`17· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`18· · · · Q· · So is it your understanding that all three
`
`19· ·nozzles are directed toward what you refer to as the
`
`20· ·seating surface of the boat?
`
`21· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`22· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· No, it's not my
`
`
`
`·1· ·understanding.· What I said is I don't know from this
`
`·2· ·drawing without knowing the construction inside which
`
`·3· ·nozzles feed which part of the boat or what the inside
`
`·4· ·construction looks like.
`
`·5· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`·6· · · · Q· · You can set this exhibit aside for now.
`
`·7· · · · · · ·What are the advantages of having the
`
`·8· ·plurality of compartments and float communication in
`
`·9· ·an air bag?
`
`10· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`11· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· That's a general question.
`
`12· · · · Q· · It's a question about air bags?
`
`13· · · · A· · It depends on the design of the air bag and
`
`14· ·what advantages you might get from having compartments
`
`15· ·and float communication.
`
`16· · · · Q· · What are some of the advantages that are
`
`17· ·associated with having -- an air bag having
`
`18· ·compartments of float communications with each other?
`
`19· · · · · · ·MR. CLAASSEN:· Objection to form.
`
`20· · · · · · ·THE DEPONENT:· Again it depends on the
`
`21· ·design of the air bag.
`
`22
`
`
`
`·1· · · · · · ·BY MR. GONSALVES:
`
`·2· · · · Q· · And how would it depend on the design of the
`
`·3· ·air bag?
`
`·4· · · · A· · I would have
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