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` UNITED STATES PATENT & TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
`
` - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
`
` APPLE, INC.,
`
` Petitioner,
`
` vs.
`
` PERSONALIZED MEDIA COMMUNICATIONS, LLC,
`
` Patent Owner.
`
` - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
`
` Case No. IPR2016-01520
`
` Patent No. 8,559,635
`
` - - - - - - - - - - -
`
` Videotaped Deposition of
`
` Alfred C. Weaver, Ph.D.
`
` Washington, D.C.
`
` Wednesday, July 26, 2017
`
` 10:11 a.m.
`
`Reported by:
`
`Laurie Bangart Donovan, RPR, CRR
`
`Job No. 19233
`
`TransPerfect Legal Solutions
`212-400-8845 - Depo@TransPerfect.com
`
`APPLE EXHIBIT 1051
`APPLE v. PMC
`IPR2016-01520
`Page 1
`
`

`

`Page 2
`
`Page 4
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` EXAMINATION INDEX
` PAGE
` EXAMINATION BY MR. SERNEL . . . . . . . . . 6, 166
` EXAMINATION BY MR. SCHREINER . . . . . . . . 123
`
` E X H I B I T S
` (None marked)
`
`Page 5
`
` P R O C E E D I N G S
` THE VIDEOGRAPHER: This is media
` number 1 of the videotaped deposition of
` Dr. Alfred Weaver in the matter of Apple,
` Inc. versus Personalized Media
` Communications, LLC, in the United States
` Patent & Tradmark Office before the Patent
` Trial and Appeal Board, number IPR
` 2016-01520.
` This deposition is being held at
` Kirkland & Ellis, 655 15th Street, Northwest,
` Suite 1200, Washington, D.C., 20005, on
` July 26, 2017, at approximately 10:11 a.m.
` My name is David Campbell, and I am
` the legal video specialist. The court
` reporter is Laurie Donovan. Both of us are
` in association with TransPerfect.
` Counsel, will you please identify
` yourself for the record, and the witness will
` be sworn in.
` MR. SERNEL: My name is Marc Sernel
` with the law firm of Kirkland & Ellis, and I
` represent Apple.
` MR. SCHREINER: My name is Stephen
` Schreiner, and I'm with the law firm of
`
`2 (Pages 2 to 5)
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` Videotaped Deposition of
` ALFRED C. WEAVER, Ph.D.
`
` Held at the offices of:
` Kirkland & Ellis, LLP
` 655 15th Street, NW
` Suite 1200
` Washington, D.C. 20005
` (202)879-5233
`
` Taken pursuant to notice, before
` Laurie Bangart Donovan, Registered
` Professional Reporter, Certified Realtime
` Reporter, and Notary public in and for the
` District of Columbia.
`
`Page 3
`
` A P P E A R A N C E S
` ON BEHALF OF THE PATENT OWNER, PERSONALIZED MEDIA
` COMMUNICATIONS:
` Goodwin Procter, LLP
` 901 New York Avenue, N.W.
` Washington, D.C. 20001
` (202)346-4000
` By: Stephen T. Schreiner, Esq.
` sschreiner@goodwinlaw.com
` ON BEHALF OF THE PETITIONER, APPLE, INC.:
` Kirkland & Ellis LLP
` 300 North LaSalle Street
` Chicago, Illinois 60654
` (312)862-2389
` By: Marcus E. Sernel, Esq.
` marc.sernel@kirkland.com
` ALSO PRESENT:
` David Campbell, Videographer
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`TransPerfect Legal Solutions
`212-400-8845 - Depo@TransPerfect.com
`
`APPLE EXHIBIT 1051
`APPLE v. PMC
`IPR2016-01520
`Page 2
`
`

`

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` Goodwin Procter, and I represent Personalized
` Media Communications, LLC.
` ALFRED C. WEAVER, Ph.D.,
` having been first duly sworn, testified
` upon his oath as follows:
` EXAMINATION BY COUNSEL FOR APPLE
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Good morning, sir.
` A Good morning.
` Q Could we get your full name for the
` record again?
` A Sure. Alfred Charles Weaver.
` Q What is your current home address?
` A My home address is 1400 Ballard Woods
` Court, Charlottesville, Virginia, 22901.
` Q Now, I know you've been deposed several
` times before, and we've had the pleasure of being
` together for a deposition in the past. I want to
` go over a few of the sort of ground rules that
` will govern our deposition here today.
` It's important that you understand each
` of my questions and every part of the question.
` If for some reason you don't understand a question
` or a part of a question, you need to tell me that
` so that I can clarify the question for you. So.
`
`Page 7
`
` Will you agree to tell me if you don't
` understand a question or part of a question?
` A I will agree.
` Q It's also important that you hear each
` of my questions and every part of a question. If
` for some reason you don't hear a question or you
` think you've missed part of a question, you need
` to tell me that so that I can reask the question
` to you.
` So will you agree to tell me if you
` don't hear a question or a part of a question?
` A I do.
` Q It's also important that we don't talk
` over one another, in part for the court reporter's
` ability to take down everything that's said, but
` also I don't want to cut you or prevent you from
` finishing an answer. I want full complete answers
` to my questions. So if I ever cut you off or
` prevent you from finishing an answer, you need to
` tell me that.
` So will you agree to do that?
` A I will.
` Q Is there any medication or illness that
` would prevent from you testifying truthfully and
` accurately today?
`
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` A No.
` Q Okay. So I referenced the fact that
` you've given prior depositions with respect to
` issues for PMC patents, including in matters
` involving Apple, correct?
` A That's correct.
` Q Do you recall off the top of your head
` how many depositions you've had with regard to
` your opinions regarding PMC patents?
` A No.
` Q Rough guess of five?
` A Four.
` Q Four?
` A But it's a guess.
` Q Okay. In any of your prior depositions,
` do you -- strike that.
` Sitting here today, do you recall any
` testimony you've provided regarding PMC patents in
` the past that you now believe to have been
` inaccurate in any way?
` A No, I, I don't recall.
` Q Same question for any expert reports or
` declarations that you've submitted in prior
` proceedings regarding PMC's patents: Anything,
` sitting here today, that you would recall as being
`Page 9
`
` inaccurate that you've provided at a prior
` declaration or expert report?
` A Nothing that I recall.
` Q Okay. Now, you understand today the
` focus of our discussion is going to be on the
` PMC's '635 patent.
` Do you have that understanding?
` A I do.
` Q And do you understand that PMC is
` alleging that the '635 patent has a priority date
` dating back to a 1981 patent application that was
` filed by PMC, correct?
` A That is my understanding.
` Q Okay, and so I'm going to ask you some
` questions about kind of what a person of skill in
` the art knew in the 1981 time frame.
` Is that okay?
` A Sure.
` Q Now, did you consider yourself a person
` of skill in the art of the technology of the '635
` patent in 1981?
` A Yes.
` Q And what do you consider to be the
` technology of the, of the '635 patent?
` A I have a description of that in my
`
`3 (Pages 6 to 9)
`
`TransPerfect Legal Solutions
`212-400-8845 - Depo@TransPerfect.com
`
`APPLE EXHIBIT 1051
`APPLE v. PMC
`IPR2016-01520
`Page 3
`
`

`

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` report. Why don't I just --
` Q And just so we'll -- and I, I understand
` and we can note for the record, in front of you
` you have a marked-up copy of your declaration,
` which I believe is PMC Exhibit 2023, that it
` contains some, some of your notes; is that
` correct?
` A That's right.
` Q Okay. I'm also going to hand you a
` clean copy of PMC Exhibit 2023. I may -- I'm
` going to refer to that, but certainly if you need
` to refer to your notes, you can go ahead and do
` so, so I'll hand you that.
` A Okay.
` Q So you've said that you -- you
` referenced, I believe, Exhibit 2023, your
` declaration, as describing the general technology
` of the '635 patent?
` A Yes. I do that in section 5.
` Q Okay, and I'm looking now. Is that
` starting at paragraph 37 of Exhibit 2023?
` A That is correct.
` Q If we look at paragraph 38, next page,
` which is page 21 of Exhibit 2023, you talk about
` the '635 patent "describes a novel
`
`Page 11
`
` signal-processing system having multiple layers of
` transmitter station devices that are able to
` control addressable receiver devices in large
` networks."
` Do you see that?
` A I do. That's the first sentence.
` Q Okay, and then the next sentence says,
` "For example, the '635 patent specification
` discloses, among other things, an end-to-end
` networked system that can distribute digital
` information over an analog or digital information
` transmission system from transmitter stations to
` receiver stations."
` Do you see that?
` A I do.
` Q And then you say that a receiver station
` is sometimes interchangeably referred to in your
` declaration as a "subscriber station," correct?
` A Correct.
` Q So essentially receiver stations and
` subscriber stations are referring to the same
` thing?
` A The -- there are, there are also -- just
` to be clear, there are also intermediate receiver
` stations, but an example of a receiver station is
`
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` the subscriber station, or it's also called an
` "end-user station."
` Q In that sentence I just read, it refers
` to an "analog or digital information transmission
` system."
` Do you see that?
` A I do.
` Q What would be a digital information
` transmission system?
` A Digital information can be transmitted
` over analog or digital transmission media, so I
` give some examples later on of, of how that's
` accomplished.
` Q And can you provide one example for me?
` A Sure. So analog information could be
` transmitted -- sorry. You asked about digital
` information.
` Q Yep.
` A Digital information could be transmitted
` over an analog medium, and just as one example, by
` modulating a carrier wave, digital information can
` be transmitted over digital media. An example --
` one example would be laser technology or telephone
` technology, and there are others that are
` specifically described later on.
`
`Page 13
`
` Q So you said "laser technology." What,
` what are you referring to?
` A So one of the examples in the '635 is a
` laserdisc communication system which can both
` record and play, and so the information stored on
` a laserdisc system in the embodiments in the '635
` is digital information, and so it's a digital path
` in between the videodisc player and, and an
` intermediate transmitter station or receiver
` station.
` Q Okay. So in your opinion, the laserdisc
` communication system that's mentioned in the '635
` patent would be a digital information transmission
` system?
` A Yes, that's right.
` Q You also mentioned telephone. Is that
` another example of a digital information
` transmission system?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` THE WITNESS: Yes. It's one
` example.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q And just so I understand, in the
` sentence you say that digital information can be
` transmitted either over an analog information
`
`4 (Pages 10 to 13)
`
`TransPerfect Legal Solutions
`212-400-8845 - Depo@TransPerfect.com
`
`APPLE EXHIBIT 1051
`APPLE v. PMC
`IPR2016-01520
`Page 4
`
`

`

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` transmission system or a digital information
` transmission system, correct?
` A That's correct.
` Q So the transmission system is not
` defined by what it's necessarily carrying. A
` digital information transmission system can carry
` analog information, it can carry digital
` information, or it can carry some of both; is that
` fair?
` MR. SCHREINER: Object to the form.
` Vague and ambiguous.
` THE WITNESS: An analog medium can
` carry analog information, or, if that analog
` information has been digitized, can carry
` digital information. Digital media can carry
` digital information, or if, if analog
` information has been digitized, it can carry
` digital information.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Now, in 1981, transmission of television
` signals would have been pursuant to an analog
` information transmission system, correct?
` MR. SCHREINER: Object to the form.
` Foundation.
` THE WITNESS: That is one example.
`Page 15
`
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Would you agree that in 1981, the
` conventional way of transmitting television
` signals would have been pursuant to an analog
` information transmission system, correct?
` A In the, in the particular example of
` NTSC, broadcast television, that would be true.
` However, digital television was known and could be
` transmitted over either analog or digital
` carrier media.
` Q You said "NTSC." What is that?
` A That was the broadcast standard in
` America for broadcast TV.
` Q In 1981?
` A In 1981.
` Q And any television signal that was
` transmitted consistent with the NTSC standard in
` 1981 would have contained analog information and
` would have been an analog information
` transmission, correct?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` Compound.
` THE WITNESS: NTSC allows for the
` transmission of either analog or digital
` information over an analog medium.
`
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` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Any television signal that was
` transmitted consistent with the NTSC standard in
` 1981 would have been an analog information
` transmission, correct?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` THE WITNESS: If, if, as you say,
` we restrict the conversation to NTSC-
` compliant broadcast transmissions, then yes,
` that's true. That is an analog transmission
` standard.
` BY MR. KLINE:
` Q And to comply with the NTSC standard in
` 1981, the transmission would have to include
` things like analog synchronization signals,
` correct?
` A NTSC does require some analog
` synchronization signals as part of the standard.
` Q Now, you understand that some of the
` claims in the '635 patent that we're talking about
` here today include a limitation that requires a
` digital information transmission unaccompanied by
` any non-digital information transmission, correct?
` A Yes. Four of the claims do have that
` limitation.
`
`Page 17
`
` Q You would agree that any transmission
` conducted pursuant to the NTSC standard would not
` meet that requirement of the '635 patent claims
` that the transmission would be unaccompanied by
` any non-digital information transmission, correct?
` A No.
` Q You disagree with my statement?
` A I disagree with your statement.
` Q And can you explain that disagreement?
` A Mm-hmm, because the information that is
` carried over NTSC is allowed to be digital.
` Q Right, but we already agreed that any
` communication transmitted pursuant to the NTSC
` standard in 1981 would have contained analog
` synchronization signals, correct?
` A The analog synchronization signals are
` not part of the information. They're part of the
` media, the delivery system.
` Q Dr. Weaver, you recall submitting a
` prior declaration in an earlier IPR proceeding
` where you've taken a position that the presence of
` analog synchronization signals in a transmission
` means that that transmission contains non-digital
` information, correct?
` A I'm -- I don't recall that specifically.
`
`5 (Pages 14 to 17)
`
`TransPerfect Legal Solutions
`212-400-8845 - Depo@TransPerfect.com
`
`APPLE EXHIBIT 1051
`APPLE v. PMC
`IPR2016-01520
`Page 5
`
`

`

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` MR. SCHREINER: I want to caution
` Mr. Weaver to refer, refer to your report
` when he's asking you these detailed
` questions.
` And thank you for indulging me.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Okay. I'm going to hand you a prior
` declaration that you have submitted. This is from
` the case number IPR2016-00754 case, and it's
` Exhibit 2001. You'll see at the back it's a
` declaration signed by you, dated June 24, 2016.
` MR. SCHREINER: Do you have a copy
` of that?
` MR. SERNEL: Oh, sorry.
` MR. SCHREINER: Thank you.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Dr. Weaver, can you confirm that this is
` a declaration that you submitted in this prior
` proceeding with your signature on the last page,
` dated June 24, 2016?
` A Yes, that's correct.
` Q And do you recall formulating opinions
` regarding the '635 patent claims and indeed some
` of the same claims that are at issue in the
` current proceeding in this prior proceeding, the
`Page 19
`
` '754 proceeding?
` A Yes, I do.
` Q And if we can turn, for example, to page
` 114 -- I'm sorry. I'm going to use the page
` pagination in the bottom right, just to make it
` easier. So it's page 120, actually, of the --
` with that pagination.
` So page 120 of PMC Exhibit 2001 in the
` '754 proceeding, and you can see -- just to make
` sure we're all on the same page here, the title or
` the section heading at the top is "D, Claim 18."
` Are you there?
` A I'm there.
` Q Okay, and you can see here -- and feel
` free to read through this if you'd like, but you
` were taking or providing opinions with respect to
` why certain prior art did not meet the
` requirements of claim 18, and specifically in this
` section you were talking about the Aminetzah and
` Bitzer prior art references.
` Do you recall that?
` A Yes, I do.
` Q And do you recall presenting the opinion
` that because the, these prior art references
` needed to comply with basic NTSC or FCC standards
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` regarding television transmissions, they would
` have to have analog synchronization signals, and
` because they had analog synchronization signals,
` they would not meet this requirement of claim 18
` that the information transmission is unaccompanied
` by any non-digital information transmission?
` A Let me read what I wrote.
` Q Okay. Why don't you read it, let me
` know when you're finished, and then I'll ask
` another question just so we have a clean record.
` A Okay. I'll do that.
` (Witness peruses document.)
` THE WITNESS: Okay. I've read this
` section.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Would you agree with me in the '754
` proceeding, you took the position that an NTSC or
` FCC-compliant television transmission that
` contained analog synchronization signals could not
` meet the requirement of claim 18 of a digital
` information transmission unaccompanied by any
` non-digital information transmission?
` A Yes, I took that position.
` Q And do you recall that this position was
` actually successful in convincing the PTAB not to
`Page 21
`
` institute the '754 IPR proceeding with respect to
` these claims?
` A Yes, that's correct.
` Q So you would agree with me that an NTSC
` or FCC-compliant television transmission sent in
` 1981 would not meet the requirement of the '635
` patent claims that require a digital information
` transmission unaccompanied by any non-digital
` information transmission?
` (Witness peruses document.)
` THE WITNESS: Okay. To keep our
` record straight, would you just repeat the
` question, please?
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Would you agree with me that an NTSC or
` FCC-compliant television transmission sent in 1981
` would not meet the requirement of the '635 patent
` claims for a digital information transmission
` unaccompanied by any non-digital information
` transmission?
` A Given that your, your question
` specifically specified NTSC-compliant
` transmission, that is true. As I elaborated in my
` section B in my report, page -- paragraphs 72, 73,
` 74, I agree with my former report, but also -- but
`
`6 (Pages 18 to 21)
`
`TransPerfect Legal Solutions
`212-400-8845 - Depo@TransPerfect.com
`
`APPLE EXHIBIT 1051
`APPLE v. PMC
`IPR2016-01520
`Page 6
`
`

`

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` I also note that there are pure digital channels
` that don't -- that are not NTSC systems.
` Q And just again, for a clean record, let
` me ask the question and just focus on my question.
` I get it. We may get into other areas.
` My question is: For an NTSC-compliant
` television transmission sent in 1981, you agree
` with me that that transmission would not satisfy
` the '635 patent claim requirement for a digital
` information transmission unaccompanied by any
` non-digital information transmission?
` A That is correct for an NTSC
` transmission.
` Q In 1981, was there any other form
` commercially available for transmission of
` television signals other than NTSC-compliant
` transmissions?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` (Witness peruses document.)
` THE WITNESS: Okay. Repeat the
` question, please.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q In the 1981 time frame, was there any
` other commercially available form for transmission
` of television signals other than NTSC-compliant
`Page 23
`
` transmissions?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` THE WITNESS: Yes.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q What were those?
` A As I discuss in my, my report beginning
` on page 95, paragraph 165, I list here some
` all-digital information transmissions, the first
` of which is digital television, and I reference a
` Popular Science magazine article in 1981 entitled
` "High-Resolution TV: Here Comes Wide-Screen
` Crystal-Clear Pictures."
` And in the next paragraph, I reference
` digital television in an IEEE journal article
` entitled "Picture Coding: A Review." This is
` about digitally encoded television signals
` transmitted over satellite channels.
` There's a, a third reference to digital
` television in paragraph 168 referencing the SMPTE
` Journal with the article titled "Quality
` Assessment of Digital Television Signals" that
` explains how "digital encoding and processing of
` the television signal is rapidly becoming of
` considerable importance to the broadcast
` industry."
`
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` And then another reference in paragraph
` 169 to the transmission of digital audio or
` digital radio that was implemented in the ALOHA
` all-digital radio broadcast system.
` Q So if we go back to digital, the digital
` TV paragraphs that you referenced here, starting
` on page 95 of Exhibit 2003, isn't it true that
` these systems, these all-digital TV systems were
` not commercially available in 1981?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` THE WITNESS: They were well-known,
` and they were becoming commercially available
` in 1981.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q The answer to my question is: You would
` agree that digital television was not commercially
` available in 1981, correct?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` THE WITNESS: Digital television
` was commercially available in 1981 through
` the use of satellite systems, so by
` "commercially available" I mean that there
` existed satellite systems that could carry
` all-digital information.
`
`Page 25
`
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Are you aware of any satellite systems
` in 1981 that carried digital television, an
` all-digital television signal?
` A I could go to these references and check
` that out.
` Q I'm asking you: Sitting here today,
` based on your review of them and prior to
` presumably citing them in your declaration, do you
` recall any discussion of any satellite system
` being available in 1981 to transmit an all-digital
` television signal?
` MR. SCHREINER: Caution the witness
` not to speculate.
` THE WITNESS: In paragraph 166, in
` reference to the high-resolution TV article,
` all-digital television transmissions were
` tested and demonstrated by CBS in 1981. So
` the Columbia Broadcast System, CBS, would be
` an example of a commercial user of
` all-digital satellite-based transmission
` systems.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Is it fair to refer to the state of
` digital television in the 1980s as being
`
`7 (Pages 22 to 25)
`
`TransPerfect Legal Solutions
`212-400-8845 - Depo@TransPerfect.com
`
`APPLE EXHIBIT 1051
`APPLE v. PMC
`IPR2016-01520
`Page 7
`
`

`

`Page 26
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`Page 28
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` "experimental"?
` A In 1981, I think that's probably
` accurate, but as I point out, digital television
` was being tested and demonstrated in 1981, as
` explained in the high-resolution TV article that I
` cite to in that paragraph.
` Q And what you're citing to in that
` paragraph is CBS's testing of a system that could
` potentially transmit all-digital television
` signals, correct?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` THE WITNESS: It would -- it was
` not only tested, it was demonstrated, and I
` note that this high-resolution TV article
` includes side-by-side comparisons of TV
` pictures actually delivered to TV displays
` where one is the NTSC analog picture and the
` other is the digital picture, and it has much
` higher resolution, and that was the
` motivation for CBS to be pursuing digital
` television.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Do you know if it was legal to transmit
` television signals in 1981 by any standard other
` than the NTSC television standard?
`
`Page 27
`
` A Experimentation is always allowed, and
` it's clear from these articles that I've
` referenced that CBS had not only experimented,
` they had documented the successful use of digital
` television.
` Q Do you know whether it was legal to
` transmit to consumers, the public, television
` signals in 1981 by any standard other than the
` NTSC television standard in this country?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` Calls for a legal conclusion that is further
` outside the scope of his declaration.
` THE WITNESS: No, I did not give an
` opinion, and so I don't know.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Now, these 1980s experimental digital
` video systems that you're referencing here
` involved taking analog video signals and then
` converting them to digital information; is that
` correct?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection to form,
` foundation, and mischaracterizes prior
` testimony.
` THE WITNESS: So your question
` phrased -- was phrased as "experimental"
`
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` systems, and what I have been talking about
` are tested and documented systems that were
` working in 1981 and had been demonstrated to
` the public and the press.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Now, these -- this all-digital
` television transmission system, again you
` acknowledge it wasn't publicly available or being
` used to broadcast television to the public in
` 1981, correct?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` Vague and ambiguous. Could you clarify which
` all-digital transmissions you're referring
` to?
` MR. SERNEL: The ones that he's
` mentioning in his expert declaration.
` THE WITNESS: The all-digital
` television transmissions that I describe in
` this section of my report were tested and
` demonstrated by a commercial company, CBS, in
` 1981, and documented with both press
` publications like Popular Science and in IEEE
` journals. So, so digital television
` transmission was known, was tested, and was
` demonstrated and documented even before 1981,
`Page 29
`
` but certainly by 1981.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q And my question is: Was that, those
` systems -- were those systems ever used to
` transmit television to the public by 1981?
` A I don't know.
` Q Would you agree that the -- strike that.
` Would you agree that the evolution of
` digital television advanced from the 1981 time
` frame to the 1987 time frame?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
` Outside the scope of his declaration.
` THE WITNESS: I gave the opinion
` that digital television goes back as far as
` 1956 in journal articles and as far as 1974
` in patents, but I did not have an opinion
` about further evolution, as you asked your
` question.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Now, you would agree that the -- strike
` that.
` I'm going to show you what is marked in
` the proceeding as Apple Exhibit 1004. This is the
` '490 patent.
` Would you agree with me, Dr. Weaver,
`
`8 (Pages 26 to 29)
`
`TransPerfect Legal Solutions
`212-400-8845 - Depo@TransPerfect.com
`
`APPLE EXHIBIT 1051
`APPLE v. PMC
`IPR2016-01520
`Page 8
`
`

`

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` that there is no express disclosure of any
` satellite TV transmission systems in the '490
` patent?
` (Witness peruses document.)
` THE WITNESS: Okay. Would you
` kindly repeat the question?
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q Would you agree that there is no
` disclosure in the '490 patent of any of these
` all-digital satellite TV transmissions that you
` referenced?
` A The '490 patent explains in column 10
` that, at line 31, transmissions may be received
` from satellites by satellite antenna, 50, low
` noise amplifiers, 51 and 52, and TV receivers, 53,
` 54, 55 and 56," and that is a reference to Figure
` 3A which shows the satellite earth receiver as box
` 50 in Figure 3A, feeding information into the TV
` receiver 53.
` Q So there is disclosure of satellites.
` My question is: Is there any disclosure
` in the '490 patent of transmission according to
` the all-digital television transmission systems in
` the '490 patent?
` MR. SCHREINER: Objection. Form.
`Page 31
`
` THE WITNESS: Well, if, if your
` question is does the '490 patent explicitly
` say that these satellite transmissions are
` digital, it doesn't say that in the one
` excerpt that I identified, but I'd have to
` read the whole patent again to have a full
` answer to your question.
` BY MR. SERNEL:
` Q In 1981, anyone using satellite to
` transmit a television signal in the United States
`