`
` CONFERENCE CALL
`
` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
` _____________
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
` _____________
` ZTE USA, Inc.,
` Petitioner,
`
` v.
`
` Parthenon Unified Memory Architecture LLC,
` Patent Owner
` _____________
`
` Case IPR2016-00664
` Patent 5,812,789
` _____________
`
` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
` _____________
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
` _____________
`
` ZTE USA INC.,
` Petitioner,
` v.
` PARTHENON UNIFIED MEMORY ARCHITECTURE LLC,
` Patent Owner.
` _____________
` Case IPR2016-00665
` Patent 5,960,464
` _____________
`
`Job No. 107284
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
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`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 1
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` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
` _____________
`
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
` _____________
` HTC CORPORATION, HTC AMERICA, INC. and LG
` ELECTRONICS, INC.,
` Petitioner,
` v.
` PARTHENON UNIFIED MEMORY ARCHITECTURE LLC,
` Patent owner
` _____________
` Case IPR2016-00847
` Patent 5,812,789
` _____________
`UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
` _____________
`
` BEFORE THE PATENT AND TRIAL APPEAL BOARD
` HTC CORPORATION, HTC AMERICA, INC. and LG
` ELECTRONICS, INC.,
` Petitioner,
` v.
` PARTHENON UNIFIED MEMORY ARCHITECTURE LLC,
` Patent owner
` _____________
` Case IPR2016-00848
` Patent 5,960,464
` _____________
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 2
`
`
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` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
` _____________
` BEFORE THE PATENT AND TRIAL APPEAL BOARD
` _____________
` Apple INC.
` Petitioner,
` v.
` PARTHENON UNIFIED MEMORY ARCHITECTURE LLC,
` Patent owner
` _____________
` Case IPR2016-00923
` Patent 5,812,789
` _____________
` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
` _____________
` BEFORE THE PATENT AND TRIAL APPEAL BOARD
` _____________
` Apple INC.
` Petitioner,
` v.
` PARTHENON UNIFIED MEMORY ARCHITECTURE LLC,
` Patent owner
` _____________
` Case IPR2016-00924
` Patent 5,960,464
` Conference Call Before the Panel
` Wednesday, May 4th, 2016
`Reported by:
`JENNIFER DE LEON
`JOB NO. 107284
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 3
`
`
`
`Page 4
`
` May 4, 2016
`
` Conference Call Before the Panel, via
`telephonically, pursuant to Agreement, before
`Jennifer De Leon, a Notary Public of the State
`of New York.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
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`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 4
`
`
`
`Page 5
`
`APPEARANCES:
`
` For the Petitioner HTC:
` JOSEPH MICALLEF, ESQ. (Via Telephone)
` SIDLEY AUSTIN
` 1501 K Street NW
` Washington, D.C. 20005
`
` For the Petitioner ZTE:
` LIONEL LAVENUE, ESQ. (Via Telephone)
` FINNEGAN HENDERSON FARABOW GARRETT
` & DUNNER
` Two Freedom Square
` 1195 Freedom Drive
` Reston, VA 20190
`
` For the Petitioner LG:
` RAJEEV GUPTA, ESQ. (Via Telephone)
` FINNEGAN HENDERSON FARABOW GARRETT
` & DUNNER
` 901 New York Avenue NW
` Washington, D.C. 20001
`
` For the Petitioner Apple:
` DAVID W. O'BRIEN, ESQ. (Via Telephone)
` CROWELL & MORING
` 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue NW
` Washington, D.C. 20004
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
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`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 5
`
`
`
`Page 6
`
`APPEARANCES: (Continued)
`
` For the Patent Owner Puma/Parthenon:
` MASOOD ANJOM, ESQ. (Via Telephone)
` AHMAD ZAVITSANOS ANAIPAKOS ALAVI MENSING
` 1221 McKinney Street
` Houston, TX 77010
`
` For Samsung
` ALLAN SOOBERT (Via Telephone)
` PAUL HASTINGS
` 875 15th Street NW
` Washington, D.C. 20005
`
`Administrative Patent Judges:
`Judge Zecher (Via Telephone)
`Judge Arpin (Via Telephone)
`Judge Clements (Via Telephone)
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
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`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 6
`
`
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`Page 7
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` CONFERENCE CALL
` P R O C E E D I N G S
` JUDGE ZECHER: Good afternoon. This is
`Judge Zecher. I have with me my two colleagues
`Judge Arpin and Judge Clements. This is a
`conference call for a number of IPRs. I believe
`the involved IPRs are, IPR2015-00901944,
`IPR2015-01946. We have IPR2016-00664, 665, 847,
`848, 923, 924.
` I understand there's a number of
`Petitioners on the line and I'm assuming for Patent
`Owners also. Before we get started, I want to
`clarify a few things. I think we only want to hear
`from one Petitioner to speak for all the
`Petitioners on the line so we don't have too much
`dialogue going back and forth.
` So let me designate or figure out who
`that is to begin with. I believe the email was
`sent from Mr. Joe Micallef. I wasn't sure if he
`would be designated to speak, or have you guys
`figured out someone else to speak?
` MR. MICALLEF: Your Honor, this is Joe
`Micallef, Sidley Austin. I did send the email and
`I would be happy to speak. We actually have not
`talked about that solely because I was unavailable,
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 7
`
`
`
`Page 8
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` CONFERENCE CALL
`but I would be happy to speak.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. I think just for
`efficiency purposes that would make the most sense.
`And then to the extent that somebody may want to
`chime in later after we've got through most of the
`substantive discussion, we'll allow that.
` Let me just verify the Patent Owners on
`the line. Who's representing Patent Owner?
` MR. ANJOM: Yes, your Honor. This is
`Masood Anjom from AZA for the Patent Owner.
` JUDGE ZECHER: I got on a little early
`and understood the number of people on the line and
`the court reporter got their names. I won't go
`through the roll call again.
` But just to make sure, Mr. Micallef, did
`you arrange for the court reporter?
` MR. MICALLEF: I did, your Honor.
` JUDGE ZECHER: And you guys agreed to
`file a transcript of this call in each of the cases
`identified?
` MR. MICALLEF: I will be happy to do
`that.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. Please do that
`separately as an exhibit. All right. So I'm going
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 8
`
`
`
`Page 9
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` CONFERENCE CALL
`to turn the floor over to you.
` MR. MICALLEF: Thank you, your Honor.
`And again for the record this is Joe Micallef for
`HTC. The reason for the call, your Honor, is, in
`fact, because of all the pending petitions. The
`situation is this: Samsung filed petitions last
`year on two patents, related patents by the Patent
`Owner. Those petitions resulted in an institution
`decision, I guess, in March, a number of what I
`would call copycat petitions were filed. And by
`that, I mean petitions by other parties having
`including the same evidence and arguments and
`ground were filed.
` ZTE, for example, filed a couple in
`February with a motion for joinder. A motion for
`joinder, I know that was not opposed by the Patent
`Owner. HTC and LG filed petitions, copycat
`petitions, in early April with a motion for
`joinder. And Apple filed its own copycat petitions
`in late April, again with a motion for joiner.
` And on the HTC and Apple one, the time
`for filing an opposition for joinder motion has not
`yet passed. And the realm of the matter really
`comes down to the fact that Apple filed. These
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 9
`
`
`
`Page 10
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`patents are involved in some parallel litigation
`and these parties are involved in parallel
`litigation with the Patent Owner. And ZTE, and
`HTC, and LG, filed these copycat petitions as, I
`think you can imagine with joinder motions because
`there's a 315(b) issue for those parties. But
`Apple does not have a 13 -- a 315(b) issue; they're
`not going to be barred.
` And so recently a week or two ago, I
`think Samsung and the Patent Owner filed a paper in
`the parallel district court proceeding indicating
`that they were moving toward the settlement. My
`understanding is -- and I don't really know, but my
`understanding is that settlement is not finalized
`yet. And there has, in fact, not been any motion
`to terminate file.
` But the reason for the call is that if
`that settlement occurs and if a termination motion
`is filed, obviously, the question will be whether
`the joinder motion could be resolved for the
`termination, and in the worst case scenario, they
`would not be. But here's the rub. Since Apple is
`not barred the board would have to proceed and at
`some point deal with the merits of Apple's copycat
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 10
`
`
`
`Page 11
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`petition; the exact same arguments in evidence that
`the board has already analyzed and instituted a
`trial. And so if that were to occur -- if that
`worst case scenario would occur, we would -- ZTE,
`HTC, LG, as you can imagine, we can probably just
`file the same exact copycat petitions again with
`motions for joinder to Apple's proceeding and then
`this whole dispute, and all of the issues in it
`would rumble along, but it would be six months
`later and we think that is wasteful.
` I think it's wasteful to avoid the time
`because that institution again has already done it.
`We think it's wasteful for us because we're going
`to have to just draft new papers and file new
`papers and pay filing fees and it does seem to be
`against the just speedy resolution of these issues.
` So what we hoped to get is an earlier
`resolution of the joinder motions that are already
`pending and with that and moving up the Patent
`Owner's preliminary response in these later filed
`petitions to somewhere around, say, May 20th, which
`is a little over two weeks from now.
` We think that if that occurs even if
`there is a settlement and even if a motion to
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 11
`
`
`
`Page 12
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`terminate is filed, the board can deal with the
`joinder motions and the other petitions before any
`termination. And the schedule that has been
`ordered and the Samsung proceedings can continue
`with, at most, you know, if necessary minor
`modifications, and that would really make this
`whole dispute move forward in a very just speedy
`more efficient way. And also note it'd also should
`not prejudice, I think, anybody.
` And I -- and you know, the Patent Owner
`in particular have already filed a preliminary
`response in Samsung's petition obviously, but --
`and I understand the rules have changed somewhat
`since that time of preliminary responses, but it's
`been on notice that it's going to have its
`opportunity to file another preliminary response at
`least since February.
` And under this proposal it would have
`more than two weeks from now to do so. So if it
`has some additional evidence or arguments, you can
`certainly, you know, make -- put that in for the
`board's consideration.
` So what I'm saying is the situation has
`arisen where there's an opportunity for just
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 12
`
`
`
`Page 13
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`meticulous waste here and repetitive filings. And
`we can get around that or we could simply move up
`the preliminary response dates from -- I think it's
`from early June to May 20th, which is pretty
`limited, and deal with joinder motions before any
`possible terminations of the Samsung proceeding,
`and that's our request.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. This is Judge
`Zecher. So I'm clear, you're asking for us to
`change the schedule for the 664, 665, 847, 848,
`923, and 924, and move up the preliminary responses
`that Patent Owner, may or may not file until
`May 20th?
` MR. MICALLEF: That's exactly right,
`your Honor.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. I'm assuming
`you've had this discussion prior to this call,
`Patent Owners. So let me hear from Patent Owners
`about this.
` MR. ANJOM: This is Masood Anjom from
`AZA for Patent Owner, your Honor. We actually have
`not had a discussion regarding these details and
`the May 20th dates. As a general principle, the
`Patent Owner is fine with the board addressing the
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 13
`
`
`
`Page 14
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`joinder motion before any termination. In fact,
`that's within the board's discretion to do that
`anyway. So we weren't really sure what the purpose
`of this call was, but we're expecting the May 20th
`date, that particular day, I'm not sure if that's
`going to work with our calendar because of other
`arrangements.
` So to the extent the board is
`considering moving the date, we ask that it be
`moved, you know, to May 26th or so. But as a
`general principle, we're fine with the board making
`a decision on the joinder for any termination to
`the extent the motion for termination is filed.
` JUDGE ZECHER: This is Judge Zecher.
`Well, two things. We can't really decide the
`motion for joinder absent a preliminary response.
`Now if you agree to waive the preliminary response,
`that's a different story. And we can decide those.
` But the -- and the first -- I guess a
`couple questions. It appears that the time period
`for opposing the motions for joinder and the 664
`and the 665 cases have expired, so you did not
`timely oppose those.
` Now, do you plan to oppose the motions
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 14
`
`
`
`Page 15
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`for joinder in the 847, 848, 923, and the 924?
` MR. ANJOM: Your Honor, pending a final
`approval from our client, we are not planning on
`opposing those joinders.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. Second question:
`Do you plan on filing a preliminary response in all
`six proceedings? The six proceedings being the
`664, 665, 847, 848, 923, and 924. Or are you
`contemplating electing not filing a preliminary
`response?
` MR. ANJOM: We are contemplating not
`filing a response, your Honor, but we haven't
`reached a final decision on that.
` JUDGE ZECHER: And from what you told me
`earlier, you said that, maybe you will have a
`better idea or you can make that decision. And we
`can set a date for these preliminary responses to
`be filed by May 26th, and you can figure all this
`out with your client by then.
` MR. ANJOM: Yes, your Honor.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. Petitioner or
`Mr. Micallef, is that date problematic for you
`guys? May 26th?
` MR. MICALLEF: I'm not aware of it being
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 15
`
`
`
`Page 16
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`problematic. It seems to be fine.
` Judge ZECHER: Okay. So it seems as if
`the parties are in somewhat of an agreement then.
`Sounds like Patent Owners kind of tentatively --
`based on the representations they've given me over
`the phone, they don't plan to file motions for
`joinder in the remaining cases, or they have the
`opportunity to file and that they can make a
`decision on whether or not to file the preliminary
`responses in each of the six proceedings before May
`26th, at which point whether or not we have them or
`not, we can act on the motions for joinder and if
`there's a preliminary response in the proceedings
`and move on from there.
` Am I missing anything?
` MR. MICALLEF: This is Joe Micallef,
`your Honor. I think you've got it right.
` MR. ANJOM: This is Masood Anjom, your
`Honor. And I think you've got it right also.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. Let me just -- I'm
`going to put you on hold real quick and briefly
`deliberate with my colleagues. And I'll be back on
`line.
` (Off the record 3:24 to 3:32.)
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 16
`
`
`
`Page 17
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` JUDGE ZECHER: All right. This is Judge
`Zecher. I'm back on with my colleagues, Judge
`Arpin and Judge Clements. I just want to make sure
`we still have everybody on line. Is the court
`reporter still there?
` THE REPORTER: Yes, I'm here, your
`Honor.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Thanks. Mr. Micallef?
` MR. MICALLEF: I am here, your Honor.
` JUDGE ZECHER: And then Mr. Anjom?
` MR. ANJOM: Yes, I'm here, your Honor.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. So I think we're
`okay with the parties' agreement. We're going to
`go ahead and set the filing of preliminary
`response, or alternatively if you don't decide not
`to file a preliminary response, please file a
`notice that you're electing not to file it by
`May 26th. At that point, we can then act on the
`motions for joinder and the pending petition.
` The panel did have a few minor
`questions though. Is counsel for Samsung on the
`line?
` MR. SOOBERT: Yes, your Honor. This is
`Allan Soobert for Samsung.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 17
`
`
`
`Page 18
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` CONFERENCE CALL
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. I guess Patent
`Owner can probably give me this information also,
`but we just wanted to see where the status of your
`settlement agreement, you know where you stood with
`regards to that.
` MR. SOOBERT: Yes. The status remains
`unchanged. You know, we've agreed in principle to
`settle the matter. We're in the process of
`finalizing the settlement papers and expect to do
`that shortly. But I don't have a time frame for
`that.
` JUDGE ZECHER: So do you expect it to be
`done by May 26th?
` MR. SOOBERT: Not clear.
` MR. ZECHER: Okay. And then just
`something for the remaining Petitioners to think
`about that after May 26th, if we were to join,
`obviously we're going to have to designate a lead
`Petitioner and work from there especially if
`Samsung is going to settle out.
` So this is just food for thought and
`something that maybe Petitioners can get together
`and discuss at some later point in time. But we're
`going to have some sort of structure as to how the
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 18
`
`
`
`Page 19
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` CONFERENCE CALL
`arguments are presented by the group of
`Petitioners. And I think by designating a lead
`Petitioner will probably be the most appropriate
`way to do that.
` So if there's not any other questions
`from the other parties on the line, or
`Mr. Micallef, or Patent Owner, doesn't have any
`other questions, we'll go ahead and adjourn this
`call and issue an order. But to make sure, are
`there any other questions from parties?
` MR. MICALLEF: This is Joe Micallef,
`your Honor. Not for me.
` MR. ANJOM: This is Masood Anjom, your
`Honor. No further questions from the Patent Owner.
` MR. O'BRIEN: Not from Petitioner Apple.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. And Petitioner
`ZTE?
` MR. LAVENUE: Nothing from ZTE, your
`Honor. Thank you.
` JUDGE ZECHER: Okay. All right. And
`I've already heard from Samsung. We'll issue a
`short order in these proceedings. I think we're
`going to leave the order out of the Samsung case
`for now because it's just not pertinent to that
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
`
`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 19
`
`
`
`Page 20
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` CONFERENCE CALL
`case at the moment.
` So you'll see a short order come out in
`664, 665, 847, 848, 923, 924, shortly. And thank
`you for getting on line on such short notice. We
`appreciate it. Thank you.
`
` (Hearing adjourned 3:35 p.m.)
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide 877-702-9580
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`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 20
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`
`
` CONFERENCE CALL
` C E R T I F I C A T E
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`Page 21
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`STATE OF NEW YORK )
` ) ss.:
`COUNTY OF NEW YORK )
`
` I hereby certify that the foregoing is
` true and correct transcript from the record of
` proceedings in the above-entitled matter.
` This, the 16th day of May, 2016.
`
` -------------------------
` JENNIFER DE LEON
`
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`IPR2016-00847 and IPR2016-00848
`HTC and LG v. Parthenon
`Petitioners HTC and LG, Exhibit 1041, p. 21