Teleconference - October 27, 2016
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`
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`UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
` ______________________________
`BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
` ______________________________
` ELEKTA, INC.,
` Petitioner,
` v.
` VARIAN MEDICAL SYSTEMS INTERNATIONAL AG,
` Patent Owner.
` ______________________________
` Case IPR2016-00842 Patent 7,906,770 B2
` Case IPR2016-00843 Patent 8,696,538 B2
` Case IPR2016-00844 Patent 7,880,154 B2
` Case IPR2016-00845 Patent 7,906,770 B2
` ______________________________
` TELECONFERENCE
` BEFORE ADMINISTRATIVE PATENT JUDGES
` GARTH D. BAER
` PATRICK M. BOUCHER
` BRIAN J. McNAMARA
`
`202-220-4158
`
`Henderson Legal Services, Inc.
`www.hendersonlegalservices.com
`
`Page 1 of 11
`
`Elekta Exhibit 1056
`Elekta v. Varian Medical
`IPR2016-00844
`
`

`
`Teleconference - October 27, 2016
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`2 (Pages 2 to 5)
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` MR. RAY: We do, Your Honor.
` JUDGE BAER: Okay. We understand
` that, petitioner, that you requested this
` call for authorization to file a motion to
` submit supplemental information.
` So counsel for petitioner, would you
` please go ahead and briefly explain what
` it is you'd like to file.
` MR. MAY: Thank you, Your Honor.
` The three Otto patents involved in
` these four IPR proceedings are at issue in
` a pending ITC investigation.
` The hearing in that ITC
` investigation occurred at the end of June
` of this year, June 23rd through 29th, to
` be exact, which was after Elekta's IPR
` petitions were filed last April.
` As indicated in our request, we
` would like to introduce into evidence in
` these IPR proceedings the ITC hearing
` testimony of two of patent owner's
` witnesses.
` First, we would like to introduce
` the hearing transcript of the testimony by
` Dr. Lynn Verhey, who was patent owner's
`
`5
`
` technical expert on validity, and who thus
` testified on the same prior art at issue
` in these IPRs.
` Second, we would like to introduce
` the hearing transcript of the testimony by
` Dr. Carl Otto, the sole listed inventor on
` the three patents involved in these IPRs.
` I can summarize that the testimony
` by the inventor and the patent owner's
` technical expert on validity is relevant
` to the same claims and prior art at issue
` in these IPRs. For example, both of these
` witnesses testified on the Otto '530
` publications that is at issue in IPRs
` 2016-00842 and 00843. And both of these
` witnesses also gave testimony on whether
` the -- relevant to whether the Earl
` article references enabling which is at
` issue in IPRs 00844 and 00845.
` If you wish, Your Honor, I can go
` into more detail. I will, though, say
` that during our call with counsel for
` patent owner, patent owner's counsel
` indicated that they would not oppose our
` filing of a motion to add these
`
`A P P E A R A N C E S :
`
`APPEARING ON BEHALF OF PETITIONER:
` FINNEGAN, HENDERSON, FARABOW, GARRETT &
` DUNNER, LLP
` 901 New York Avenue, N.W.
` Washington, D.C. 20001-4413
` 202.408.4000
`BY: TIMOTHY J. MAY, ESQ.
` timothy.may@finnegan.com
` JOSHUA L. GOLDBERG, ESQ.
` joshua.goldberg@finnegan.com
`
`APPEARING ON BEHALF OF PATENT OWNER:
` STERNE, KESSLER, GOLDSTEIN & FOX
` 1100 New York Avenue, N.W.
` Suite 600
` Washington, D.C. 20005
` 202.371.2600
`BY: MICHAEL B. RAY, ESQ.
` mray@skgf.com
` NIRAV N. DESAI, ESQ.
` ndesai@skgf.com
`
`3
`
` (Whereupon, on the record 4:00 p.m.)
` JUDGE BAER: Good afternoon,
` everybody.
` This is Judge Baer from the Patent
` Trial and Appeal Board, and with me on the
` line are Judges McNamara and Boucher.
` We're here for a conference call in
` IPR2016-842, 843, 844 and 845, which is
` Elekta, Inc. versus Varian Medical Systems
` International AG.
` Would counsel for petitioner please
` state your appearance.
` MR. MAY: Yes. This is Tim May of
` Finnegan Henderson. Also with me is Josh
` Goldberg of Finnegan Henderson as well.
` JUDGE BAER: Thank you, counsel.
` And counsel for patent owner, would
` you go ahead and state your appearance,
` please.
` MR. RAY: Yes. For patent owner,
` this is Michael Ray, R-a-y. And also with
` me is Nirav Desai.
` JUDGE BAER: Great. And do I
` understand we have a court reporter as
` well.
`
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`202-220-4158
`
`Henderson Legal Services, Inc.
`www.hendersonlegalservices.com
`
`Page 2 of 11
`
`

`
`Teleconference - October 27, 2016
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`3 (Pages 6 to 9)
`8
` JUDGE BAER: According to the rule,
` the request for authorization has to come
` within a month. But, you know, I'm not
` aware of any due date restriction. At
` some point, obviously, you would need to
` explain any delay on that, but. So, you
` know, if it's going to be too long, then
` you run the risk of the other side of
` raising that as an issue. But, you know,
` absent some rule or requirement requiring
` something else, I don't feel there's on
` that. I mean, the further out you go, the
` more difficult it will be.
` MR. MAY: I understand, Your Honor.
` We're going to act expeditiously on this,
` so I think we'll be in a good position.
` Thank you.
` MR. GOLDBERG: Your Honor, this is
` Joshua Goldberg for petitioner. One other
` just quick question.
` When we file the transcript of this
` call, would you like us to do that as a
` petitioner's exhibit or would you like us
` to ask the clerks at the court to make
` that a board exhibit?
`
`6
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` transcripts for these two witnesses.
` JUDGE BAER: Okay. Let's check in
` with the patent owner.
` Counsel, do you have anything to add
` to that or do you have any objection to
` the request to file a motion?
` MR. RAY: Your Honor, this is Mike
` Ray speaking.
` Petitioner's counsel is correct.
` We're not opposing their request to file a
` motion. Should the board choose to grant
` that request, we may ultimately file an
` opposition to the motion, depending on
` what the motion says, once we have a
` chance to review it.
` JUDGE BAER: Understood.
` Okay. The board is going to mute
` for just a minute and we'll confer,
` unless, petitioner, do you have anything
` to add?
` MR. MAY: No, Your Honor.
` JUDGE BAER: Okay. Let me mute the
` line for a minute and confer. Stay on the
` line for us and we'll be back shortly.
` Thanks.
`
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` (Whereupon, off the record.)
` (Whereupon, resumed.)
` JUDGE BAER: Okay. We're back.
` Thanks for your patience.
` We're going to authorize the motion,
` so the authorization is granted.
` Petitioner, if you would, please
` indicate in the motion that we've
` authorized it during this call. Please
` keep the motion and any response to five
` pages or less. And if you would also,
` petitioner, please file a transcript for
` this call as well.
` I believe it's the petitioner that
` has the court reporter; is that correct?
` MR. GOLDBERG: That's correct, Your
` Honor, and we will do that.
` JUDGE BAER: Okay. Counsel for
` petitioner, do you have any questions or
` anything new that you'd like to add?
` Counsel for petitioner, do you have
` anything you want to add or any questions?
` MR. MAY: Just one question, Your
` Honor. What would be the due date for our
` motion?
`
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` JUDGE BAER: You can just make it a
` petitioner's exhibit, that's fine.
` MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Thank you.
` JUDGE BAER: And, patent owner, any
` requests or questions, anything you'd like
` to add?
` MR. RAY: Yes, Your Honor. Mike Ray
` speaking.
` I understand that in some cases
` petitioners have actually filed the
` information that they're requesting, that
` they're requesting authorization today to
` file a motion to submit supplemental
` information, and in some cases petitioners
` have attached supplemental information as
` exhibits to their motion as a way of
` getting them into the record, even before
` the motion is granted. I would like the
` board to give us some guidance as to
` whether that is permissible. I guess it's
` my position that petitioners should not
` submit the supplemental information with
` their motion.
` JUDGE BAER: All right. Petitioner,
` do you have anything you want to say in
`
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`202-220-4158
`
`Henderson Legal Services, Inc.
`www.hendersonlegalservices.com
`
`Page 3 of 11
`
`

`
`Teleconference - October 27, 2016
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`4 (Pages 10 to 13)
`12
`
`10
`
` petitioner, you should include the
` materials in the motion. If we end up not
` granting the motion and, patent owner, you
` want to file a motion to have that
` expunged, you can certainly do that. But
` we would like to have the information to
` make the decision on the motion. Okay?
` MR. MAY: Thank you, Your Honor.
` JUDGE BAER: Okay. Counsel for
` petitioner, any other questions? Anything
` you'd like to add?
` MR. MAY: No, Your Honor, we're all
` set. Thank you.
` JUDGE BAER: Counsel for patent
` owner, any questions or anything you'd
` like to add?
` MR. RAY: One last question. You
` said five pages for petitioner, Your
` Honor, is it also five pages if patent
` owner files an opposition?
` JUDGE BAER: Yes, five pages as
` well.
` MR. RAY: Thank you, Your Honor.
` That's all for patent owner.
` JUDGE BAER: Okay. Thanks everyone
`
`13
`
` for participating and the call is
` adjourned.
` MR. MAY: Thank you.
` MR. RAY: Thank you.
` (Whereupon, off the record.)
` (Whereupon, teleconference adjourned
` 4:13 p.m.)
`
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` response?
` MR. MAY: Well, if we were not able
` to attach the transcripts said as
` exhibits, I guess we're questioning
` whether we might be able to do it within
` five pages. If we can -- you attach these
` transcripts as an exhibit, we can be then
` much more brief in our motion.
` JUDGE BAER: As I understand it,
` patent owner is not raising the issue
` about the length, they're just wondering
` whether you can file the actual
` information along with the motion or
` whether the motion needs to be granted
` first.
` Do I have that correct, patent
` owner?
` MR. RAY: Yes, Your Honor. Yes,
` Your Honor.
` MR. GOLDBERG: Your Honor, for
` petitioner. I'm not sure I fully
` understand patent owner's concern, but let
` me just lay out a possibility that might
` address it.
` We think that if Your Honors were
`
`11
` going to have the transcripts, it would be
` easier for you to decide whether you want
` to let them into the proceedings or not.
` And should Your Honors decide that they
` did not want to let them into the
` proceedings, I suppose they could always
` be expunged from the record later if
` patent owner's only concern is that we end
` up with these transcripts in the record
` and they stay in the record regardless of
` your ruling.
` JUDGE BAER: Okay. We're going to
` mute the line again and confer for just a
` minute. Stay on the line. We'll be back
` to you shortly.
` (Whereupon, off the record.)
` (Whereupon, resumed.)
` JUDGE BAER: Okay. The panel's
` back. Thank you for your patience.
` Petitioner, do you think you can
` have this motion filed in the next two
` weeks?
` MR. MAY: Yes, we can.
` JUDGE BAER: Okay. We're going to
` again authorize the motion and,
`
`202-220-4158
`
`Henderson Legal Services, Inc.
`www.hendersonlegalservices.com
`
`Page 4 of 11
`
`

`
`Teleconference - October 27, 2016
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`5 (Pages 14 to 15)
`
`14
`
` CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER
`
` I, Josephine H. Fassett, NCRA Registered
`Professional Reporter and New Jersey Certified
`Court Reporter, and the officer before whom the
`teleconference proceedings were taken, do hereby
`certify that the foregoing transcript is a true
`and accurate record of these proceedings; that
`said proceedings were taken in stenotype notes by
`me on the 27th day of October 2016, commencing at
`4:00 p.m. and ending at 4:13 p.m., and was
`thereafter reduced to typewritten form.
`
` I further certify that present on behalf of
`Petitioner, Elekta, Inc., were Timothy J. May,
`Esq. and Joshua L. Goldberg, Esq. of Finnegan,
`Henderson, Farabow, Garrett & Dunner, LLP; and
`present on behalf of Patent Owner, Varian Medical
`Systems International AG, were Michael B. Ray and
`Nirav N. Desai of Sterne, Kessler, Goldstein &
`Fox.
`
` I further certify that I am not related to,
`nor associated with any of the parties or their
`attorneys, nor do I have any disqualifying
`
`15
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`interest, personal or financial in the actions
`within.
`
` Dated this 28th day of October 2016 at
`Middlesex County, New Jersey.
`
` _______________________________
` JOSEPHINE H. FASSETT, CCR, RPR
` NCRA LICENSE NO 32418
` CCR LICENSE NO. 30XI00098400
`
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`202-220-4158
`
`Henderson Legal Services, Inc.
`www.hendersonlegalservices.com
`
`Page 5 of 11
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`

`
`
`Teleconference - October 27, 2016Teleconference - October 27, 2016
`
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`1
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`A
`able 10:2,5
`absent 8:10
`accurate 14:8
`act 8:15
`actions 15:1
`actual 10:12
`add 5:25 6:4
`6:20 7:20,22
`9:6 12:11,16
`address 10:24
`adjourned
`13:2,6
`ADMINISTR...
`1:17
`afternoon 3:2
`AG 1:8 3:10
`14:19
`ahead 3:18 4:7
`Appeal 1:3 3:5
`appearance
`3:12,18
`APPEARING
`2:3,14
`April 4:17
`art 5:2,11
`article 5:18
`associated
`14:24
`attach 10:3,6
`attached 9:15
`attorneys
`14:25
`authorization
`4:4 7:6 8:2
`9:12
`authorize 7:5
`11:25
`authorized 7:9
`Avenue 2:6,16
`aware 8:4
`B
`
`B 2:20 14:19
`B2 1:11,12,13
`1:14
`back 6:24 7:3
`11:14,19
`Baer 1:18 3:2
`3:4,16,23 4:2
`6:2,16,22 7:3
`7:18 8:1 9:1
`9:4,24 10:9
`11:12,18,24
`12:9,14,21
`12:25
`behalf 2:3,14
`14:14,18
`believe 7:14
`board 1:3 3:5
`6:11,17 8:25
`9:19
`Boucher 1:19
`3:6
`BRIAN 1:20
`brief 10:8
`briefly 4:7
`C
`
`C 2:1
`call 3:7 4:4
`5:22 7:9,13
`8:22 13:1
`Carl 5:6
`Case 1:11,12
`1:13,14
`cases 9:9,14
`CCR 15:9,11
`certainly 12:5
`CERTIFICATE
`14:1
`Certified 14:4
`certify 14:7,14
`14:23
`chance 6:15
`check 6:2
`choose 6:11
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`claims 5:11
`clerks 8:24
`come 8:2
`commencing
`14:10
`concern 10:22
`11:8
`confer 6:18,23
`11:13
`conference
`3:7
`correct 6:9
`7:15,16
`10:16
`counsel 3:11
`3:16,17 4:6
`5:22,23 6:4,9
`7:18,21 12:9
`12:14
`County 15:5
`court 3:24
`7:15 8:24
`14:5
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`D 1:18
`D.C 2:7,18
`date 7:24 8:4
`Dated 15:4
`day 14:10 15:4
`decide 11:2,4
`decision 12:7
`delay 8:6
`depending
`6:13
`Desai 2:22
`3:22 14:20
`detail 5:21
`difficult 8:13
`disqualifying
`14:25
`Dr 4:25 5:6
`due 7:24 8:4
`Dunner 2:5
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`14:17
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`E 2:1,1
`Earl 5:17
`easier 11:2
`Elekta 1:5 3:9
`14:15
`Elekta's 4:16
`enabling 5:18
`Esq 2:9,11,20
`2:22 14:16
`14:16
`everybody 3:3
`evidence 4:19
`exact 4:16
`example 5:12
`exhibit 8:23,25
`9:2 10:7
`exhibits 9:16
`10:4
`expeditiously
`8:15
`expert 5:1,10
`explain 4:7 8:6
`expunged
`11:7 12:5
`F
`Farabow 2:4
`14:17
`Fassett 14:3
`15:9
`feel 8:11
`file 4:4,8 6:6
`6:10,12 7:12
`8:21 9:13
`10:12 12:4
`filed 4:17 9:10
`11:21
`files 12:20
`filing 5:25
`financial 15:1
`fine 9:2
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`Finnegan 2:4
`3:14,15
`14:16
`first 4:23 10:15
`five 7:10 10:6
`12:18,19,21
`foregoing 14:7
`form 14:12
`four 4:11
`Fox 2:15 14:21
`fully 10:21
`further 8:12
`14:14,23
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`Garrett 2:4
`14:17
`GARTH 1:18
`getting 9:17
`give 9:19
`go 3:18 4:7
`5:20 8:12
`going 6:17 7:5
`8:7,15 11:1
`11:12,24
`Goldberg 2:11
`3:15 7:16
`8:18,19 9:3
`10:20 14:16
`Goldstein 2:15
`14:20
`good 3:2 8:16
`grant 6:11
`granted 7:6
`9:18 10:14
`granting 12:3
`Great 3:23
`guess 9:20
`10:4
`guidance 9:19
`H
`H 14:3 15:9
`hearing 4:13
`
`
`
`202-220-4158202-220-4158
`
`
`Henderson Legal Services, Inc.Henderson Legal Services, Inc.
`
`www.hendersonlegalservices.comwww.hendersonlegalservices.com
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`Page 6 of 11
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`

`
`Teleconference - October 27, 2016
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`2
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`14:17
`Honor 4:1,9
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`10:18,19,20
`12:8,12,19
`12:23
`Honors 10:25
`11:4
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`I
`include 12:1
`indicate 7:8
`indicated 4:18
`5:24
`information
`4:5 9:11,14
`9:15,22
`10:13 12:6
`interest 15:1
`International
`1:8 3:10
`14:19
`introduce 4:19
`4:23 5:4
`inventor 5:6,9
`investigation
`4:12,14
`involved 4:10
`5:7
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`3:8
`IPRs 5:3,7,12
`5:14,19
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`15:5
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`pages 7:11
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`13:1
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`patent 1:1,3,9
`1:11,12,13
`1:14,17 2:14
`3:4,17,20
`4:21,25 5:9
`5:23,23 6:3
`9:4 10:10,16
`10:22 11:8
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`12:24 14:18
`patents 4:10
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`PATRICK 1:19
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`9:20
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`petitioners
`9:10,14,21
`petitions 4:17
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`point 8:5
`position 8:16
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`Teleconference - October 27, 2016
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`3
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`witnesses
`4:22 5:13,16
`6:1
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`10:11
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`year 4:15
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`00845 5:19
`1
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`20001-4413
`2:7
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`15:4
`2016-00842
`5:15
`202.371.2600
`2:19
`202.408.4000
`2:8
`23rd 4:15
`27th 14:10
`28th 15:4
`29th 4:15
`3
`30XI00098400
`15:11
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`4
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`stenotype 14:9
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`14:20
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`4:5 9:13,15
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`1:1
`
`transcript 4:24
`5:5 7:12 8:21
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`ultimately 6:12
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`2:7,18
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`
`Registered
`14:3
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`7:15 14:1,4,5
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`6:6,10,12 8:2
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`9:11,12
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`8:10
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`response 7:10
`10:1
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`11:17
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`right 9:24
`risk 8:8
`RPR 15:9
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`ruling 11:11
`run 8:8
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`
`S 2:1
`says 6:14
`Second 5:4
`set 12:13
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`11:15
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`stay 6:23
`11:10,14
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`9:21
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`10:23
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`prior 5:2,11
`proceedings
`4:11,20 11:3
`11:6 14:6,8,9
`Professional
`14:4
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`5:14
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`Q
`question 7:23
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`questioning
`10:4
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`7:19,22 9:5
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`R 2:1
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`3:21 4:1 6:7
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`9:17 11:7,9
`11:10,16
`13:5 14:8
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`references
`5:18
`regardless
`11:10
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`202-220-4158
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`Teleconference - October 27, 2016
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`4
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`4:00 3:1 14:11
`4:13 13:7
`14:11
`5
`530 5:13
`6
`600 2:17
`7
`7,880,154 1:13
`7,906,770 1:11
`1:14
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`8
`8,696,538 1:12
`843 3:8
`844 3:8
`845 3:8
`9
`901 2:6
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`3i sEI
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`E iEE Il I2 i
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`iE
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`E 3
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`Teleconference - October 27, 2016
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`
`CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER
`
`I, Josephine H. Fassett, NCRA Registered
`
`Professional Reporter and New Jersey Certified
`
`Court Reporter, and the officer before whom the
`
`teleconference proceedings were taken, do hereby
`
`certify that the foregoing transcript is a true
`
`and accurate record of these proceedings;
`
`that
`
`said proceedings were taken in stenotype notes by
`
`me on the 27th day of October 2016, commencing at
`
`4:00 p.m. and ending at 4:13 p.m., and was
`
`thereafter reduced to typewritten form.
`
`I further certify that present on behalf of
`
`Petitioner, Elekta, Inc., were Timothy J. May,
`
`Esq. and Joshua L. Goldberg, Esq. of Finnegan,
`
`Henderson, Farabow, Garrett & Dunner, LLP; and
`
`present on behalf of Patent Owner, Varian Medical
`
`Systems International AG, were Michael B. Ray and
`
`Nirav N. Desai of Sterne, Kessler, Goldstein &
`
`Fox.
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`I further certify that I am not related to,
`
`nor associated with any of the parties or their
`
`attorneys, nor do I have any disqualifying
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`202-220-4158
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`Teleconference — October 27, 2016
`Case IPR2016-00842; IPR2016-00843; IPR2016-00844; IPR2016-00845
`
`interest, personal or financial in the actions
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`within.
`
`Dated this 28th day of October 2016 at
`
`Middlesex County, New Jersey.
`
`OSEPHI E H.
`
`S ETT, CCR, RPR
`
`NCRA LICENSE NO 32418
`
`CCR LICENSE NO. 3OXIOOO984OO
`
`202-220-41 58
`Page 1 1 of 1 1
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`Page 11 of 11