`
` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
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` OWENS CORNING )
`
` )
`
` Petitioner, )
`
` )
`
` VS. ) Case IPR2015-00650
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` ) Patent 8,137,757 b2
`
` FAST FELT CORPORATION )
`
` )
`
` DEFENDANT )
`
` )
`
` )
`
` )
`
` )
`
`********************************************************
`
` ORAL DEPOSITION OF
`
` WILLIAM E. TODD
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` February 5, 2016
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` Volume 1
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`********************************************************
`
` ORAL DEPOSITION OF WILLIAM E. TODD, produced as a
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`witness at the instance of the PETITIONER, and duly
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`sworn, was taken in the above-styled and numbered cause
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`on February 5, 2016 from 9:33(cid:160)a.m. to 11:28(cid:160)a.m., before
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`Toyloria Lanay Hunter, CSR in and for the State of
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`Texas, reported by machine shorthand, at the law offices
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`of ANDREWS KURTH LLP, 600 Travis, Suite 4200, Houston,
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`Texas 77002, pursuant to the Federal Rules of Civil
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`Procedure and the provisions stated on the record or
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`attached hereto.
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 1 of 44
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`
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` A P P E A R A N C E S
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`Page 2
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`F O R T H E P E T I T I O N E R :
` N e d P e j i c
` J e n n i f e r B . W i c k
` C A L F E E , H A L T E R & G R I S W O L D L L P
` T h e C a l f e e b u i l d i n g
` 1 4 0 5 E a s t S i x t h S t r e e t
` C l e v e l a n d , O h i o 4 4 1 1 4 - 1 6 0 7
` T e l : 2 1 6 . 6 2 2 . 8 8 3 5
` E - m a i l : n p e j i c @ c a l f e e . c o m
` j w i c k @ c a l f e e . c o m
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`F O R T H E R E S P O N D E N T :
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` G r e g L . P o r t e r
` J a m e s W i l l s o n
` A N D R E W S K U R T H L L P
` 6 0 0 T r a v i s , S u i t e 4 2 0 0
` H o u s t o n , T e x a s 7 7 0 0 2
` T e l : 7 1 3 . 2 2 0 . 4 6 2 1
` F a x : 7 1 3 . 2 3 8 . 7 1 6 9
` E - m a i l : g r e g p o r t e r @ a k l l p . c o m
` j a m e s w i l s o n @ a n d r e w s k u r t h . c o m
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`- - a n d - -
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`F O R T H E R E S P O N D E N T :
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` J a m e s D . P e t r u z z i
` T H E P E T R U Z Z I L A W F I R M
` 4 9 0 0 W o o d w a y D r i v e , S u i t e 7 4 5
` H o u s t o n , T e x a s 7 7 0 5 6
` T e l : 7 1 3 . 8 4 0 . 9 9 9 3
` E - m a i l : j i m @ p e t r u z z i . c o m
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`A L S O P R E S E N T :
` S t e p h e n L . S c h a r f , O w e n s C o r n i n g
` D a v i d C o l l i n s , F a s t F e l t C o r p o r a t i o n
` B . J . W a l t e r , F a s t F e l t C o r p o r a t i o n
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`1 6
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`1 7
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`1 8
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`1 9
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`2 0
`2 1
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`2 2
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`2 3
`2 4
`2 5
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`www.veritext.com
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 2 of 44
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`Page 3
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` I N D E X
` PAGE
`Appearances............................... 2
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`Reporter's Certification.................. 31
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`WILLIAM E. TODD
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` E X A M I N A T I O N
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` By Mr. Pejic 4
` By Mr. Petruzzi 27
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` E X H I B I T S
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` Exhibit Description Page
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`Ex. 2003 DECLARATION OF WILLIAM E. TODD 5
` REGARDING U.S. PATENT NO.
` 8,137,757
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`Ex. 1001 U.S. PATENT NO. 8,137,757 16
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 3 of 44
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`Page 4
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` WILLIAM E. TODD,
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`having been first duly sworn, testified as follows:
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` EXAMINATION
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. Good morning, Mr. Todd. My name is Ned Pejic,
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`as you probably know from yesterday, counsel for Owens
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`Corning. How are you today?
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` A. Fine.
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` Q. Could you please just state your name and
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`address for the record?
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` A. Full name is William Edward Todd, T-O-D-D.
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`5198 Sandlewood, S-A-N-D-L-E-W-O-O-D, one word, Court,
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`Marietta, M-A-R-I-E-T-T-A, Georgia 30068.
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` Q. Thank you.
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` And are you here to testify in connection
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`with matter IPR 2015-00650?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. How much time did you spend preparing for this
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`deposition?
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` A. Time by myself or in consultation with legal?
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` Q. Let's start total time.
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` A. Probably 30ish hours.
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` Q. And how much of that time was with counsel?
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` A. More or less 50 percent.
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` Q. During that preparation time, did you review
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 4 of 44
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`Page 5
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`any documents?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. Which documents?
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` A. They're listed on the appendix of my
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`declaration.
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` Q. All of those documents?
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` A. Yes. Do you mean are they all listed, or did
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`I study all of them?
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` Q. Did you study all of them through the 30 hours
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`total --
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` A. I have reviewed them, scanned them.
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` Q. Are there any documents that don't appear on
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`that list that you looked at?
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` A. The owner's statement, which was done after
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`the declaration.
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` Q. Did you submit an expert declaration in this
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`matter?
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` A. I did.
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` Q. I'd like to hand to you now Exhibit 2003.
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` (Exhibit 2003 identified.)
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. Is that your expert declaration?
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` A. (Reading.) It appears to be.
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` Q. You sat in on Dr. Bohan's deposition
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`yesterday, correct?
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 5 of 44
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. Did you take any notes during Dr. Bohan's
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`deposition?
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` A. No.
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` Q. Did you discuss Dr. Bohan's deposition
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`testimony with anybody?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. Who?
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` A. Our legal.
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` Q. Do you believe your declaration, Exhibit 2003,
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`to be accurate?
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` A. I do.
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` Q. Have you read any other expert declarations in
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`connection with this matter?
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` A. I read Dr. Harvey Levenson's.
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` Q. Anyone else's?
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` A. Dr. Bohan.
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` Q. Anyone else's?
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` A. No.
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` Q. Other than your legal team, did you consult
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`with -- who other than your legal team did you consult
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`with in relation to this matter?
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` A. Dr. Bohan.
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` Q. Did you consult with Mr. David Collins?
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` A. Yes. I considered him part of our legal
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`www.veritext.com
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`888-391-3376
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
`
`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 6 of 44
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`Page 7
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`group, but yes.
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` Q. What did you discuss with Dr. -- Mr. Collins?
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` A. The -- primarily, the Collins' patent, '757.
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` Q. How did you come to know Mr. Collins?
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` A. Several years ago -- and I don't know
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`specifically when -- Mr. Collins presented his product
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`to the company that I was working for.
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` Q. What product was that?
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` A. It was the Fast Felt material.
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` Q. What was the Fast Felt -- Fast Felt material?
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` A. It was a heavily saturated asphalt -- asphalt
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`felt that had nail tabs adhered to it.
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` Q. Why did Mr. Collins present that product to
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`your company?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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` A. I wouldn't know his motivation.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. How did you become aware that Mr. Collins
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`presented that product to your company?
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` A. He contacted me initially to make the contact
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`with the company.
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` Q. Did you consult with Dr. Mark Bohan in
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`preparing your declaration?
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` A. We had some discussions, yes.
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` Q. How many discussions, approximately?
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 7 of 44
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`Page 8
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` A. Three prior to this -- prior to this day,
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`yesterday.
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` Q. And what were those discussions about?
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` A. Specifically, that's a pretty broad question.
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`Do you have a specific area that you're interested?
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` Q. Just start anywhere you want.
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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` A. The primary discussion was surrounding the
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`Collins '757 patent.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. Anything else other than the '757 patent?
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` A. We discussed the roof covering manufacturing,
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`the basics.
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` Q. Why did you discuss roof covering
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`manufacturing basics?
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` A. That's my area of expertise, and he was
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`wanting to know more information about that subject.
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` Q. Did Dr. Bohan provide you with any documents?
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` A. No.
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` Q. Turning to your declaration, Exhibit 2003, did
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`your attorneys help you write any part of that
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`declaration?
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` A. They helped with the legalese and the -- the
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`format and the general organization of it.
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` Q. When you say "legalese," what do you mean by
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 8 of 44
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`Page 9
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`legalese?
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` A. The terminology. I'm not a legal person.
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` Q. Did they also help you with the law?
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` A. They did explain that.
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` Q. And when you say "they did explain that,"
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`you're referring to the law, correct?
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` A. Which specific?
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` Q. Well, let me direct you to your declaration
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`page 11. There's a section that starts Roman
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`Numeral II, "Patentability" on page 11. And I guess it
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`goes to page 22.
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` Is that the section you're referring to
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`when you say that they -- your legal team helped you
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`with the law?
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` A. (Reading.) Appears to me that there are way
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`more subjects discussed in those pages than just the
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`law.
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` Q. Okay. But I guess where the law is discussed,
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`that is where the legal team provided help; is that
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`correct?
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` A. Specifically, yes.
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` Q. Thank you. Did you send any drafts of your
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`declaration to your lawyers?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. How many drafts?
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 9 of 44
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`Page 10
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` A. If I recall correctly, four.
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` Q. Did you discuss the content of your
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`declaration after you finalized it?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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` A. Would you clarify that, please?
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. Did you discuss the content of your
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`declaration with anyone after you submitted it in final
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`form?
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` A. Our legal team.
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` Q. Approximately how much time total did you
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`spend writing your declaration?
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` A. I couldn't give an accurate estimate on that.
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`I did over the course of a few days, but not working
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`solid, a few hours. Whatever a few is.
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` Q. More than ten hours?
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` A. No.
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` Q. You wrote your entire declaration in less than
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`ten hours?
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` A. I would guess that.
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` Q. And that would include the revisions?
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` A. Revisions were typically minor.
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` Q. Did you write your declaration from scratch?
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`Do you know what that means?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 10 of 44
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` A. I had read Dr. Levenson's. And I used that as
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`his sort of overall format. But the information that
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`Page 11
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`went in it was mine.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. In what area do you consider yourself to be an
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`expert?
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` A. I have a very full understanding of the way
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`asphalt roofing materials are manufactured.
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` Q. Why do you consider yourself an expert in that
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`area?
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` A. I have been involved from the management level
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`and contribution level within the plants of the company
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`I used to work for for 27-and-a-half years.
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` Q. Can you tell me a little bit more about what
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`you mean when you say "contribution level"?
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` A. Offering new product ideas, assisting in
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`problem solving and production.
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` Q. Do you consider yourself an expert in the
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`field of printing?
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` A. No.
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` Q. Have you ever been an expert in a previous
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`legal matter?
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` A. No.
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` Q. Have you ever been an expert in a previous
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`patent-related matter?
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`www.veritext.com
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 11 of 44
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`Page 12
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` A. No.
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` Q. Your declaration concludes that Claims 1, 2,
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`4, 6 and 7 of the '757 patent, Exhibit 1001, are valid,
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`correct?
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` A. Yes, they're obvious.
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` Q. Previous to this matter, have you analyzed the
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`patent claims for validity before?
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` A. My name is on two patents. And those are the
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`only ones I've ever studied for validity.
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` Q. How familiar are you with the legal test for
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`obviousness relative to patents?
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` A. From a layperson's point of view, I have a
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`general understanding.
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` Q. In your declaration, one of the reasons why
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`you conclude the claims of the '757 patent are valid is
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`based on asphalt saturated substrates, correct?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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` A. Specifically, how does the substrate fit into
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`that question? Rephrase it, please.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. Is an asphalt saturated substrate one of the
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`bases for your conclusion of validity in your
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`declaration?
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` A. The asphalt saturated substrate -- the asphalt
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`saturated substrate originates with the Lassiter patent.
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 12 of 44
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`Page 13
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` Q. So is an asphalt saturated substrate one of
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`the bases upon which you conclude the claims are valid
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`in your declaration?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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` A. I need to refer to my declaration. Wherein
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`within that declaration are you referring?
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. So just for clarity, you can't answer that
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`question without referring to your declaration?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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` A. I -- just for the sake of expediency.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. And that's why you want to refer to your
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`declaration?
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` A. Please.
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` Q. I refer you to Paragraph 55 of your
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`declaration.
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` A. (Reading.)
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` Q. In Paragraph 55 you state, "In my opinion, the
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`broadest reasonable interpretation consistent with the
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`specification of the '757 patent Claims 1, 2, 4, 6, and
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`7 said the roofing or building cover material is a
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`heavily coated material, likely heavily coated with
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`asphalt or asphalt-based substance," correct?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Object to form.
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`Veritext Legal Solutions
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 13 of 44
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`Page 14
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` A. (Reading.) That's the way it reads.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. Is that still your opinion today?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. So I'll ask you the question earlier.
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` Is an asphalt saturated substrate one of
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`the bases upon which you conclude that the '757 patent
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`claims are valid?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
`
` A. I'm not sure what you mean by "bases."
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. Okay. Let me ask you, what -- can you explain
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`to me the basis of your claim for validity in the '757
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`patent?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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` A. The primary invention in the '757 is the
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`lamination of materials to a heavily saturated asphalt
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`under laminate or web sheet.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. And that's the basis upon which you concluded
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`the validity of the claims?
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` A. (Reading.) The lamination of nail tabs to the
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`heavily saturated or coated asphalt substrate is the
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`basis for my opinion that those claims are valid.
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` Q. Did you consider a validity analysis where the
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 14 of 44
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`substrate was not saturated with asphalt?
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` A. What type of substrate?
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` Q. Well, your answer said a heavily saturated or
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`coated asphalt substrate. That's the one I'm referring
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`to.
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` A. I did no analysis on other substrates.
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` Q. In your declaration, you assert that paper is
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`not a building or roofing cover material, correct?
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` A. What paragraph is that?
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` Q. Let's turn to page 34. There's a section
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`capital A that states, "Paper is not a roofing or
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`building cover material."
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` A. (Reading.)
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` Q. So my question was, in your declaration, you
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`assert that paper is not a building or roofing cover
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`material, correct?
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` A. I'm saying that untreated paper is not a
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`building or roofing cover material.
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` Q. Have you ever heard of the phrase, "building
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`paper"?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. Have you ever heard of the phrase, "roofing
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`paper"?
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` A. Not that phrase. Not as applied to roofing.
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` Q. Have you ever heard of the phrase, "felt
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 15 of 44
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`Page 16
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`paper"?
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` A. I have heard that phrase misused. It should
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`be saturated felt paper, in the industry.
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` Q. Have you heard of the phrase, "tar paper"?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. I'd like to direct your attention now to
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`Claim 7 of the '757 patent, Exhibit 1001.
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` (Exhibit 1001 identified.)
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
`
` Q. Do you have that patent, Exhibit 1001?
`
` A. Yes.
`
` Q. Earlier you testified that a heavily saturated
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`asphalt substrate was one of your bases for validity.
`
` Can you please look at the text of Claim 7
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`and indicate where that text uses the phrase, "asphalt
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`saturated"?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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` A. (Reading.) Claim 7 is about depositing a nail
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`tab material and the pressure adhering it.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
`
` Q. Does that mean you don't see the phrase,
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`"asphalt saturated" in Claim 7?
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` A. That phrase does not appear there.
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` Q. I'd like to direct your attention now to
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`Claims 1, 2, 4 and 6.
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 16 of 44
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`Page 17
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` If you can take a moment and let me know
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`if you see the phrase, "asphalt saturated" in those
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`claims.
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` A. (Reading.) Claim No. 1 addresses laminating
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`nail tabs with a laminate roll. But it does not have
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`that phrase. (Reading.) And, I'm sorry, the exact
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`phrase again?
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` Q. Asphalt saturated.
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` A. It does not appear in Claim 2. It does not
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`appear in Claim 4. Claim 6 addresses a lamination roll.
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`It does not appear in that.
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` Q. I'd like to refer you now to Paragraph 36 of
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`your declaration. Paragraph 36 you refer to Owens
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`Corning's eight other IPR petitions, correct?
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` A. To read my statement, "I believe it's
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`important to note that the petition Owens Corning has
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`employed an expert in the other IPR petitions against a
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`single roofing participant." I see that.
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` Q. How are those eight other petitions relevant
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`to this matter?
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` A. I scanned through those to get a feel for the
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`overall process of the patent system to see what the
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`procedural -- what the procedures would consist of.
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` Q. And you say, "I scanned through those." What
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`are you specifically referring to?
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 17 of 44
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` A. Those eight other IPR petitions listed in that
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`Paragraph 36 of my declaration.
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` Q. Does that mean the entire petitions?
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` A. No. I did not go through the whole petition.
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` Q. Did you go through the patents that were being
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`petitioned?
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` A. I scanned those, but I did not make a study of
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`them.
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` Q. I'd like to refer you now to Paragraph 53 of
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`your declaration.
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` In Paragraph 53 of your declaration you
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`state, "The '757 patent discloses making nail tabs in a
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`variety of ways and claims laminating those tabs to
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`roofing or building cover material," correct?
`
` A. Yes, that's what it says.
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` Q. I'd like to now direct your attention to
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`Claim 7 of the '757 patent.
`
` Does the word "laminating" appear in
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`Claim 7?
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` A. (Reading.) The wording pressure adhering said
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`nail tab material into nail tabs on said roofing or
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`building cover material where the pressure roll is
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`present. But the word "laminating" is not.
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` Q. I'd like to refer you now to page 37 of your
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`declaration.
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 18 of 44
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`Page 19
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` A. Page 37?
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` Q. Correct. At the top of page 37, there's a
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`section titled capital B, "Noncontact Deposition to
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`Contact Lamination," correct?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. What are you referring to when you state,
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`"contact lamination"?
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` A. Contact would be between two solid objects.
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` Q. Was that your answer?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. So the word "lamination" doesn't mean anything
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`in that phrase?
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` A. My understanding, you asked what contact
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`meant.
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` Q. Oh, I'm sorry. The question was when you were
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`referring to -- what are you referring to when you state
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`"contact lamination."
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` And your answer was, "Contact would be
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`between two solids." And I was waiting for you to -- I
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`thought you were going to answer what does the word
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`"lamination" mean. And you said you were done with your
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`answer. That's why I asked.
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` A. Contact lamination would be the act of joining
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`and pressing two objects together.
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` Q. Thank you.
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 19 of 44
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`Page 20
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` I'd like to direct your attention back to
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`Claim 7 of the '757 patent.
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` Does the phrase, "contact lamination"
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`appear anywhere in Claim 7?
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` A. (Reading.) The words subject -- subsequently
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`pressure adhering said nail tab --
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` THE REPORTER: I'm sorry. Would you read
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`that again?
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` A. The wording, "Subsequently pressure adhering
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`said nail tab material into nail tabs on said roofing or
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`building cover material with a pressure roll," do appear
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`in Claim 7. But "contact lamination" words do not
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`appear.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
`
` Q. I'd like to direct your attention to
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`Paragraph 67 of your declaration.
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` A. Okay.
`
` Q. In the second line of Paragraph 67, you use
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`the phrase, "pressure lamination." Do you see that?
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` A. (Reading.) Yes, I see the sentence. It says,
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`"To move from a Lassiter 409 patent, noncontact --"
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`there's a typo there.
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` "Noncontact '757 contact and pressure
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`lamination goes against the teaching of the Lassiter 409
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`patent." That's the complete sentence.
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 20 of 44
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`Page 21
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` Q. So what are you referring to when you use the
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`phrase, "pressure lamination"?
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` A. It's a conjunction with the word previously
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`contact and pressure lamination. Means there's a
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`lamination roll applying pressure to the combination of
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`the nail tab around the substrate.
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` Q. Is contact lamination different from contact
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`and pressure lamination?
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` A. In the context of Paragraph 67, it would be
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`the same.
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` Q. I'd like to turn your attention back to
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`Claim 7 of the '757 patent.
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` Does the phrase "pressure lamination"
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`appear anywhere in Claim 7?
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` A. (Reading.) The words, "Subsequently pressure
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`adhering said nail tab material into nail tabs on said
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`roofing or building cover material with a pressure
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`roll," does occur.
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` Emphasizing the word "pressure." Pressure
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`laminating does not appear there.
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` Q. I'd like to refer you now to Paragraph 87 of
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`your declaration. And particularly to the portion
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`appearing on page 48 where you use the phrases,
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`"pressure bonding" and "pressure adhering."
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` Do you see where those phrases are used?
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 21 of 44
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`Page 22
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` A. I see that written.
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` Q. And where that's written, you indicate the
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`sentences, "Hefele Roll 9 is disclosed as providing a
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`slight pressure in order to heat adhere and does not
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`provide any pressure bonding or pressure adhering as in
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`the '757 patent lamination claims."
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` A. Is that a question?
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` Q. The question is, to what are you referring to
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`when you say "lamination claims"?
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` A. That reference is to Claim 1 on '757 and
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`Claim 7 on '757.
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` Q. Turning to Claim 1 of the '757 patent, can you
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`please indicate where the phrase, "pressure bonding"
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`appears?
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` A. (Reading.) The terminology of Claim 1
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`includes, "Said tab material bonding to the surface of
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`said roofing or building cover material by pressure
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`between said roll and said surface."
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` But those exact words of "pressure
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`bonding" aren't used together.
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` Q. Still referring to Claim 1 of the '757 patent,
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`can you please indicate where the phrase, "pressure
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`adhering" appears?
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` A. Claim 1 includes, "Said tab material bonding
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`to the surface of said roofing or building cover
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 22 of 44
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`Page 23
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`material by pressure between said roll and said
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`surface," appears. That phrase does not.
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` Q. I'd like to direct your attention now to
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`Claim 7 of the '757 patent.
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` Can you please indicate where the phrase
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`"pressure bonding" appears?
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` A. (Reading.) Part of Claim 7 includes, "Said
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`nail tab material is substantially made of a polymeric
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`material, subsequently pressure adhering said tab --"
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` "-- said nail tab material." And the nail
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`tabs on said roofing or building cover material with a
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`pressure roll. "Pressure bonding" does not occur, those
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`words together.
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` Q. Is there a difference between pressure
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`adhering and pressure bonding?
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` A. Depends on the context it's used in.
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` Q. Can you explain that to me?
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` A. Give me an example of a situation.
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` Q. Okay. Can you give me an example?
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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` A. I can't work off of conjecture. I need
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`something specific to address.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. So given your expertise, you can't explain to
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`me the difference between pressure adhering and pressure
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 23 of 44
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`bonding, correct?
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` A. In what situation?
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` Q. Given your expertise.
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` MR. PETRUZZI: Objection; form.
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` A. I need a specific question so I can answer it.
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
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` Q. The question was, can you explain to me the
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`difference between pressure adhering and pressure
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`bonding?
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` A. Not without knowing the specific circumstances
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`we're addressing.
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` MR. PEJIC: Let's take a ten-minute
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`break, please.
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` (A break was taken from 10:33(cid:160)a.m. to
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` 10:57(cid:160)a.m.)
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`BY MR. PEJIC:
`
` Q. Mr. Todd, did you discuss your testimony today
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`with anyone during the break?
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` A. No.
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` Q. Earlier you testified that you first met
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`Mr. Collins when he approached your former employer with
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`the Fast Felt product, correct?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. Can you identify for me who was your employer
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`at the time?
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 24 of 44
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`Page 25
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` A. That was Atlas Roofing Corporation.
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` Q. Do you recall if Atlas Roofing Corporation
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`purchased the Fast Felt product?
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` A. They did not.
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` Q. Are you being compensated as an expert in this
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`matter?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. Who are you being compensated by?
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` A. The check comes from the legal firm.
`
` Q. Which legal firms?
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` A. Andrews Kurth.
`
` Q. Thank you.
`
` Who first asked you to become involved in
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`this matter?
`
` A. Mr. Collins.
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` Q. Turning back to the '757 patent and Claims 1,
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`2, 4, 6 and 7, you've read those claims numerous times,
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`correct?
`
` A. I have read them.
`
` Q. I'd like to direct your attention to Claim 7
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`of the '757 patent. Does the phrase, "tear resistance"
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`appear?
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` A. (Reading.) You mean appears in Claim 7?
`
` Q. Claim 7.
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` A. (Reading.) It does not.
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 25 of 44
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`
`
`Page 26
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` Q. Does the phrase "tear resistance" appear in
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`Claims 1, 2, 4 or 6?
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` A. (Reading.) It does not occur in 1, 2, 4, or
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`6.
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` Q. I direct your attention back to Claim 7.
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` Does the phrase "burst strength" appear
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`anywhere in Claim 7?
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` A. It does not.
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` Q. Does the phrase "burst strength" appear
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`anywhere in Claims 1, 2, 4, or 6?
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` A. It does not.
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` Q. I direct your attention back to Claim 7.
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` Does the phrase "rupture strength" appear
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`anywhere in Claim 7?
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` A. (Reading.) It does not.
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` Q. Does the phrase "rupture strength" appear
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`anywhere in Claims 1, 2, 4 or 6?
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` A. (Reading.) It does not.
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` Q. Prior to your engagement in this matter, have
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`you heard of the law of obviousness directed to teaching
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`away?
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` A. Not previous to this process.
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` Q. When you said Mr. Collins approached Atlas
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`Roofing, do you recall how long ago that was?
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` A. More than five years. I couldn't guess closer
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`Petitioner - Owens Corning
`Ex. 1022, Page 26 of 44
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`Page 27
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`than that.
`
` MR. PEJIC: One short break.
`
` (A break was taken from 11:05(cid:160)a.m. to
`
` 11:10(cid:160)a.m.)
`
`BY MR. PEJIC:
`
` Q. Mr. Todd, did you discuss your testimony today
`
`with anyone during the break?
`
` A. No.
`
` MR. PEJIC: No further questions at this
`
`time. I'd like to go off the record and take another
`
`short break.
`
`