`
`UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF TEXAS
`HOUSTON DIVISION
`
`
`WESTERNGECO LLC, . 4:09-CV-01827
` . HOUSTON, TEXAS
`PLAINTIFF, .
` .
` vs. .
` .
`ION GEOPHYSICAL .
`CORPORATION, FUGRO GEOTEAM, .
`INC., ET AL, .
` . VOLUME 13
`DEFENDANTS . AUGUST 9, 2012
`. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7:34 A.M.
`
`
`TRANSCRIPT OF JURY TRIAL
`BEFORE THE HONORABLE KEITH P. ELLISON
`UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGE
`
`
`
` A
`
`
`
`
`
` P P E A R A N C E S:
`
`FOR THE PLAINTIFF:
`
`Lee K. Kaplan
`SMYSER KAPLAN & VESELKA LLP
`Bank of America Center
`700 Louisiana, Suite 2300
`Houston, Texas 77002
`Gregg F. LoCascio
`KIRKLAND & ELLIS LLP
`655 Fifteenth Street Northwest
`Washington, DC 20005
`Sarah Tsou
`Timothy K. Gilman
`KIRKLAND & ELLIS LLP
`Citigroup Center
`153 East 53rd Street
`New York, New York 10022
`
`
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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` 4092
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
`
`P R O C E E D I N G S
`
`(Jury present)
`THE COURT: You may resume.
`KENNETH WILLIAMSON, DULY SWORN, FURTHER TESTIFIED:
`DIRECT EXAMINATION CONTINUED
`BY MR. TORGERSON:
`Q
`Yesterday, you were discussing a number of different issues
`identifying market resistance to Q-Marine. Q-Marine had been
`publicly offered prior to your joinder to the then-merged
`WesternGeco entity. And you gave us some examples of market
`resistance to Q-Marine that you personally witnessed in
`connection with your role as sales manager and as vice
`president of marketing through 2003.
`One of these -- would you agree with me that one
`of the issues of market resistance to Q-Marine was its high
`price?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`And remind us again how different the original pricing of
`Q-Marine was over the rest of conventional seismic.
`A
`The intended -- by the time it came to be rationalized, it
`was about three or four times the price of conventional, was
`the initial projected target.
`Q
`And that went down over time?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`And we will talk about some other examples of that.
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`mayramalone@comcast.net
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` 4093
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
`
`Another area of market resistance to Q-Marine was
`WesternGeco's refusal to release the single sensor data. Is
`that fair?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`Another area that you had mentioned yesterday, I believe,
`was some early teething problems, as you described them, or
`technical issues associated with the performance of Q-Marine,
`just like any other new technology?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`You gave us a story about an episode in Mauritania. Were
`there other technical issues that you had heard about up
`through the end of 2003 associated with the performance of the
`Q-Fin?
`A
`It was the propeller effect.
`Q
`What is that?
`A
`It was an issue where the fin would have parallel wing
`angles and it would act like an impeller, and after it went in
`the water, it would just keep rotating. And that caused some
`problems with lots of noise. And eventually we would have to
`stop and go and retrieve that malfunctioning device from the
`streamers.
`Q
`And in addition to that, we talked briefly yesterday about
`solid streamers or the fact that WesternGeco didn't offer solid
`streamers with its Q-Marine system while you were there.
`What was the importance of that, again?
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`mayramalone@comcast.net
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` 4094
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
`
`There were several. One was that for places where we were
`A
`arguing about single sensor for the noise reduction, some of
`the competitors with solid streamer were effectively combating
`similar arguments with the performance of the solid streamer,
`because that was also quite robust for eliminating weather-
`related noise. So we just lost that argument against solid
`streamer. So it was like a competitive type of situation.
`Q
`So in the market, you had different manufacturers and
`different contractors utilizing solid streamers, essentially
`pitching to the oil companies that their technology was better
`for noise reduction, and on the other hand, WesternGeco was
`touting its ability to attenuate noise through the Q-Marine
`single sensor network?
`A
`That's correct, yeah.
`Q
`All right. As a result of these issues that led to market
`resistance to Q-Marine, how did that impact the utilization of
`the Q-Marine fleet?
`A
`Utilization was low. In fact, we had -- one of the issues
`was the stance on price, and market acceptance caused a
`utilization issue with the Q-Marine fleet. So it was low.
`Q
`Yesterday, you had told us about a pricing tier that you
`had put in place, not unlike a car wash. And could you give
`some brief background on how that came about?
`Was there any interaction with senior management
`or leadership within WesternGeco and Schlumberger to get that
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`mayramalone@comcast.net
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` 4095
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
`
`pricing tier established?
`A
`Yes. Initially, under the presidency of Gary Jones, we
`were trying to roll Q out and have this pricing discussion in
`the marketplace. We clearly weren't getting the traction, but
`there was sort of a predetermined mandate about pricing that
`"We are not going to back down on pricing. We will shut the
`vessels down." And I could see that it was clear it wasn't
`going to work. We were going to struggle with very low
`utilization for a long time.
`And when Dalton Boutte came in as president, we
`had more fingers into the mother ship of the Schlumberger
`company to get the audience compliant to maybe change their
`stance a little bit. And ultimately there was a meeting he
`organized with Andrew Gould present, who was the chairman at
`the time. And I think it was a three-hour slot that I had in
`that meeting agenda, with lots of technical support showing
`some of the market resistance to utilization and showing that
`with a lower price, we could probably get a much higher
`utilization.
`
`I remember showing a chart in that meeting which
`showed that we were around 10 percent utilization based on the
`current pricing and looking at we could probably achieve a
`lower pricing and much higher utilization, but overall a higher
`profitability than we were getting.
`And part of the market feedback -- and I think
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`mayramalone@comcast.net
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` 4096
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
`
`the emails and market pulse that we polled the market on I
`discussed yesterday -- that was part of the evidence we used to
`support this is what the market is expecting for pricing, so we
`need to change our strategy.
`Q
`You were successful in making that approach to management,
`and you were permitted to go forward with this tiered pricing?
`A
`Yes. That was the outcome of that meeting, yes.
`Q
`As I recall from yesterday, the tiered pricing related to
`the granularity or the fidelity of the data based on these
`spacings.
`A
`Right.
`Q
`Now, there were times, I believe you said yesterday, where
`a premium or some part of a premium was obtained. When you
`moved over to the Russia and Caspian region as manager, did you
`see an example of that?
`A
`We did. It was a project that I was in the process of
`developing with a company called Anadarko. It was in the Black
`Sea, in the Georgian sector. This was a place I had on my
`objectives to get a Q-Marine project in my region, which was
`Russia and Caspian region. So this was in the Georgian sector
`of the Black Sea.
`And we managed to roll out a price which was
`consistent with the tiered pricing. I think it was around
`Tier 1. I think it was Tier 1 pricing. And we successfully
`won that project with the Tier 1 pricing.
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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` 4097
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
`
`What time frame are we talking about?
`Q
`This would have been about 2004.
`A
`And do you have an understanding as to how you reached that
`Q
`premium, how you arrived at that?
`A
`Well, we took the Tier 1 pricing of the day and rolled it
`out and offered that to the customer.
`Q
`What kind of situation was the customer in from your
`perspective?
`A
`Well, this was an interesting outcome in the fact that -- I
`relayed this back to Dalton, who was my boss at the time. And
`what we had was the market was clearly -- because our pricing
`was a lot higher, generally the sales cycle, the time it took
`to propose a proposal and actually close the deal, it was
`often, "Well, it's a lot higher price than normal. It will
`take me a while to get the internal approvals to go ahead with
`this."
`
`I think what we saw there with Anadarko, they
`were struggling to find a vessel. All the vessels -- the
`market had started to pick up. And so the conventional prices
`were starting to rise and rise and rise. And, of course, our
`Q-Marine pricing was certainly above conventional pricing when
`it was offered. By the time we actually closed and negotiated
`the deal, it was probably consistent or maybe slightly above
`conventional pricing, but the oil companies found themselves in
`a place where they just couldn't get a vessel. So they were
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`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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` 4098
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
`
`buying off the market the most available vessel.
`Q
`And is that market recovery part of these peaks and valleys
`that your industry often goes through?
`A
`Absolutely, yes.
`Q
`So in 2000, 2001, is it fair to say that the marine seismic
`industry was in a bit of a trough, in a valley?
`A
`Yes. Correct.
`Q
`And it had started to recover by 2004?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`You left WesternGeco and Schlumberger in 2006; is that
`right?
`A
`2006, yes.
`Q
`How was the market then?
`A
`You couldn't find a vessel if you wanted one. The industry
`was building new vessels. They couldn't build them fast
`enough, and it was a very tight market.
`Q
`And how long would you say -- you continued in the market
`after joining ION, and you -- is it fair to say that you
`continued to monitor those issues as part of your job?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`All right. And in, say, 2008, 2009, how was the market?
`A
`2008 was a very good year for the whole industry. And 2009
`was a big problem. We saw a global recession. It fell through
`to the seismic industry, as well.
`Q
`And how are things doing today?
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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` 4099
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
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`They're starting to improve again.
`A
`This list, for the record, I made of market resistance to
`Q
`Q-Marine, I have marked as Williamson Demonstrative 1.
`With regard to Williamson Demonstrative 2, I want
`to do sort of a quick timeline, and see if you agree with me.
`We have the price here, and we have the years here on the
`bottom.
`
`Would you agree that the cycle of the industry
`was something along the lines of that?
`A
`Yes. I would move the peak a little bit toward the right.
`Q
`Right here?
`A
`Yeah.
`Q
`Fair enough. Something like that?
`A
`Yeah.
`Q
`All right. So by the time the market was recovering in
`about 2001, where you indicated -- excuse me -- by 2004 where
`you indicated this Black Sea example to us, was it your view
`that the premium price had dropped such that they were sort of
`meeting in the middle?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`All right. Let's shift gears a little bit and talk about,
`specifically, lateral steering requirements in the industry,
`Mr. Williamson.
`Do you recall any surveys -- let me back up. As
`part of your job, it was regular course for you to respond
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`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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` 4100
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
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`directly to tenders for different oil companies on behalf of
`WesternGeco and even previously for Western Geophysical. Is
`that fair?
`A
`Yes. Correct.
`Q
`And would it also be fair to say that you supervised the
`work of others doing the same thing?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`So you were intimately involved in the tendering process?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`Do you recall any vessels in the towed marine space that
`required lateral steering before -- well, what year did you
`first start seeing lateral steering requirements?
`A
`We started to see that in -- it wasn't ever expressed as a
`requirement, an absolute requirement. It was a preference.
`And I would say that started in probably 2002 and '3.
`Q
`What companies, in your recollection, were those that were
`expressing it as a preference?
`A
`A good example was Statoil. They had a 4D mantra inside
`the company, and they were -- they believed that the streamer
`steering for them was an important part of 4D techniques.
`Q
`Would you agree that they were sort of at the frontier or
`the pioneers supporting this technology?
`A
`Norway as a country is ahead of the game, and Statoil,
`being a Norwegian company, was very much a part of that, yes.
`Q
`Back to the issue, though, specifically as a requirement.
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 10
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
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` 4101
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
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`When was the first time that you heard about oil companies
`requiring, as a technical matter, lateral steering entering
`into the tender process?
`A
`I have never seen a requirement that you would be
`disqualified should you not be able to provide it.
`Q
`Do you recall seeing any such requirements before leaving
`WesternGeco in 2006?
`A
`No.
`Q
`WesternGeco, as you know, was the only company to offer
`lateral steering until the introduction of DigiFIN; is that
`right?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`And in connection -- and you understood that WesternGeco
`wasn't selling that to other companies?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`Was there any discussion while you were there at
`WesternGeco about potentially selling or licensing that
`technology to other companies?
`A
`No.
`Q
`Is that a strong policy?
`A
`It's vertical integration, that's a Schlumberger thing,
`keep it inside the family.
`Q
`And as part of your marketing efforts and maybe even the
`efforts that preceded and followed you, were there attempts by
`WesternGeco to influence the purchasing decisions of oil
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`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 11
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
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` 4102
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
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`companies about lateral steering?
`A
`Absolutely, yes.
`Q
`Tell us about that.
`A
`So there were -- in the 4D application, we actually have a
`lot of technical marketing to try and demonstrate the value of
`repeating source and receiver locations as part of the
`repeatability aspects of 4D acquisition time lapse. And some
`of the companies -- there were several industry attempts to
`provide 4D solutions.
`The WesternGeco one was a demonstration that
`the -- the ability to go and place the receivers and the
`streamers in the same places they were on on the previous
`survey was important. And Statoil was an example of a company
`that did that.
`So not wanting to rule out other competition and
`saying, you know, here is a definite requirement for streamer
`steering, they would place some preferences in there or some
`specifications which would probably only be able to be
`delivered if you had lateral steering.
`Q
`What would be an example of such a specification -- a
`technical specification that you would think could only be met
`with lateral steering?
`A
`An example would be, you know, you shall tow the streamers
`and the separation will be within a certain tolerance. So that
`implied some level of control or either good fortune that they
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`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 12
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
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` 4103
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
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`would stay that way, yeah, without -- without control.
`Q
`Let me ask you this, Mr. Williamson. When you talked about
`repeatability, does that mean repeating the positions of the
`receivers and the array, or does it mean something in addition
`to that to you?
`A
`Yeah, repeatability is one of those things in the industry
`which is misused. In a time lapse survey, the idea is to
`measure and monitor the differences in the response of the
`earth that is caused by production size. You take oil out of
`the ground. Where the oil is being removed, there is a change
`in the response of that reservoir, the idea being that where
`there is no change in geology or signal, when you do another
`survey, you want to see exactly the same thing.
`So having good repeatability is a place where you
`know there has been no change in the reservoir is to say you
`are recording the same signal. So that's what we call it,
`geophysical repeatability. So that is an important part of any
`4D or time-lapse method.
`Q
`Well, aside from lateral steering being able to help you
`with this repeatability function in a 4D application, what
`other solutions were out there in the market that you were
`aware of?
`A
`At the time, PGS were marketing what they call HD 3D
`technique, which is a high density 3D technique where they
`would have lots and lots of streamers all placed very close
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`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 13
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
`IPR2014-01475
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` 4104
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
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`together. So they would over-sample, overmeasure, if you like,
`the area. So they were relying on lots of measurements to
`overcome the same thing.
`Q
`Did PGS back in this time frame have lateral steering
`capability?
`A
`No, they did not.
`Q
`How were they keeping their streamers from tangling?
`A
`They just relied on a much higher density sampling of
`streamers, and they would tow behind the vessel in a normal
`manner.
`Q
`What was the spacing you knew about with regard to PGS?
`A
`They were a much narrower spacing. There were typically
`50 meters between streamers.
`Q
`To your knowledge, were their arrays any shorter than
`WesternGeco's, the length of the streamers?
`A
`No.
`Q
`Now, this oversampling or overmeasuring, as you described
`it, are you familiar with some new techniques using the same
`type of approach that are now offered by WesternGeco?
`A
`The new technology, which has just been released, it is
`generating virtual streamers. So it is simulating streamers
`which are not there. So it is like a modeling of streamers
`that are in between the ones that are being towed.
`Q
`What is this product called?
`A
`IsoMetrix.
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 14
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
`IPR2014-01475
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` 4105
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` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
`
`Was it, to your knowledge, rolled out at the June 2012
`Q
`EAGE?
`A
`Yes, it was.
`Q
`Did you attend WesternGeco presentations on that subject?
`A
`I saw the booth presentations, yes.
`Q
`All right. And as a result or from those presentations,
`what was your understanding of what this approach would look
`like?
`A
`It certainly -- it was proposing fewer streamers but with
`much more clever measurements in each streamer and with those
`measurements being then able to interpolate mathematically the
`presence of streamers or other measurements that were lying
`between the streamers that were being towed.
`Q
`Did WesternGeco convey to the public, and therefore to you,
`Mr. Williamson, that the intent was to tow fewer streamers
`farther apart?
`A
`That was one of the benefits that was implicated.
`Q
`Was there any impact on the importance of steerable
`streamers conveyed?
`A
`It seemed less. The implication was there was certainly
`less importance for that.
`Q
`What also would be a benefit from a cost standpoint
`associated with this new approach?
`A
`Obviously there is much -- we think there would be a lower
`capex. If you looked at the vessel's design compared to the
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
`
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 15
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
`IPR2014-01475
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`
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`07:55
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` 4106
`
` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
`
`competitors', they were certainly designed narrower, for less
`streamers, much less equipment in the water. So it seemed like
`a lower risk, lower capex-type investment.
`Q
`Was there an understanding of the data that was going to be
`obtained? Was there a shift in policy that you detected?
`A
`I didn't get that directly, but from talking with oil
`companies who had seen and had conversations, it sounded like
`they were going to make available all the interpolated data
`available on a shot-by-shot basis. So it seemed to be a more
`open access policy for the underlying data.
`Q
`And that would be in contrast to your experience with
`WesternGeco's hard line stance to refuse to release that data
`using Q-Marine?
`A
`It would appear to be, yes.
`Q
`Let's go back to our timeline, if we can. The recession, I
`believe, started, what, in the late fall of 2008?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`And oil prices dropped like a rock?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`And what was the reaction of the various contractors out
`there, WesternGeco, PGS, CGGV? What did they do?
`A
`One of the things I monitor on a regular basis is the
`average price for 2D vessels and 3D vessels, both low-, mid-,
`and high-capacity 3D vessels. We saw through the various
`reports that we get that the prices came down quite
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
`
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 16
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
`IPR2014-01475
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`
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`07:56
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`07:56
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`07:58
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` 4107
`
` Torgerson Direct Continued of Kenneth Williamson
`
`significantly.
`Q
`Everybody's prices came down?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`What about the capacity of the fleet? What did they do
`with their boats?
`A
`Some of them were being tied up.
`Q
`Now, regardless of that, in connection, if we go from, say,
`2008, 2009, 2010, did you have an understanding about
`WesternGeco's capacity, or their utilization?
`A
`No. I mean, just the market in general.
`Q
`Okay. During this time frame, around 2008 or so, had
`WesternGeco -- before the recession, had WesternGeco acquired a
`company that would bring in a number of boats?
`A
`Yes, they had.
`Q
`Tell us about that briefly.
`A
`It was a company called Eastern Echo. They had built or
`they had orders for, I think, four vessels, with options for
`two more. And as part of the ramp-up and access capacity, the
`industry in general was trying to get more boats on the market.
`Schlumberger had been an aggressive buyer of
`Eastern Echo by buying up the debt. And that became a way to
`get four vessels that were already in the pipeline. So it was
`a way to accelerate new vessels on to the market.
`Q
`Mr. Williamson, as a result of your personal experiences
`within WesternGeco and your time spent monitoring the market
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 17
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
`IPR2014-01475
`
`
`
`07:58
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`07:58
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` 4108
`
` Tsou Cross of Kenneth Williamson
`
`since then, including weathering the storm of this recession,
`do you believe that WesternGeco's problems with Q-Marine have
`anything to do with the introduction of DigiFIN?
`A
`No, I don't.
`MR. TORGERSON: Pass the witness.
`THE COURT: Any questions?
`MR. ARNOLD: Not from us, Your Honor.
`THE COURT: Ms. Tsou?
`MS. TSOU: Thank you, Your Honor.
`THE COURT: You may require.
`CROSS-EXAMINATION
`
`BY MS. TSOU:
`Q
`We heard a lot about your real-world experiences with
`WesternGeco yesterday and today; is that correct?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`You work for ION now; isn't that true?
`A
`That's correct.
`Q
`You work in the multiclient business?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`You don't work in the seismic acquisition business?
`A
`No.
`Q
`You have been at ION for six years; is that correct?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`You left WesternGeco almost seven years ago, right?
`A
`Yes.
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 18
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
`IPR2014-01475
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`
`
`07:58
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`08:00
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` 4109
`
` Tsou Cross of Kenneth Williamson
`
`And that's before DigiFIN even launched?
`Q
`Yes.
`A
`You have no ability to discuss any details of WesternGeco's
`Q
`marine seismic work after 2005, true?
`A
`Other than the publicly available information that a lot of
`industry understands.
`Q
`Since 2005, you have no personal knowledge about
`WesternGeco's marine seismic work, right?
`A
`I have no proprietary knowledge of their seismic work.
`Q
`We just heard a little bit about IsoMetrix. That is one
`example of something you have no personal knowledge to talk
`about, correct?
`A
`No proprietary knowledge to talk about.
`Q
`You are saying "proprietary." Is that personal?
`A
`There is available information on the market which is
`available to the industry, like the launch information at
`Copenhagen.
`Q
`Other than the publicly available knowledge, you have
`nothing to say about IsoMetrix.
`A
`No.
`Q
`You don't know how important lateral steering is to
`IsoMetrix on a personal level?
`A
`No.
`Q
`I'd like to talk about lateral steering. Before lateral
`steering came along, you would agree that people in the
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 19
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
`IPR2014-01475
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`
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`08:00
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` 4110
`
` Tsou Cross of Kenneth Williamson
`
`industry wanted it for a long time, wouldn't you?
`A
`There has been a general need for it, yes.
`Q
`In fact, from your first trip on a seismic vessel around
`1987, there were common discussions about the potential
`benefits of lateral steering, right?
`A
`Absolutely, yes.
`Q
`And you believed there was a need for lateral steering well
`before 1999?
`A
`There has always been an operational efficiency need for
`lateral steering.
`Q
`Your first knowledge of any practicability to actually
`implement a method of performing lateral steering was Geco's
`work on Q-Technology?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`You were at Western Geophysical between 1997 and 2008,
`right?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`And nobody was doing lateral steering during that time
`period at Western, correct?
`A
`That's correct, yes.
`Q
`Your first awareness of the development of lateral steering
`was when Western and Geco merged in 2000?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`Now, you discussed the importance of single sensors to
`WesternGeco. And again, this is based on your experiences
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 20
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
`IPR2014-01475
`
`
`
`08:01
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` 4111
`
` Tsou Cross of Kenneth Williamson
`
`prior to 2005, right?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`First of all, it's not really true for all surveys, is it?
`A
`The importance of single sensor data?
`Q
`Yes.
`A
`Also they have different -- there are features of Q-Marine
`which are valuable for different customers and different
`applications.
`Q
`You would agree with me that single sensor wasn't the most
`important driver of prices of 4D surveys?
`A
`It depends on the customer and the application.
`Q
`Would you agree that lateral steering is the most important
`driver of prices for 4D surveys?
`A
`I would agree for companies that believe that repeating
`source and receiver coordinates is an important factor for
`them.
`
`There are two schools of thought out there. One
`is you blanket-survey with measurements, and others, that you
`try and reposition the streamers in the same place. So
`different companies had different philosophies as to which one
`was the best method.
`Q
`Sir, would you agree that for 4D surveys, lateral steering
`is the most important driver for prices?
`A
`No.
`Q
`You were deposed in this case, right?
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
`
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 21
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
`IPR2014-01475
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`
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`08:02
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`07:58
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`08:03
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` 4112
`
` Tsou Cross of Kenneth Williamson
`
`A
`Q
`A
`
`Yes.
`I was the one who deposed you?
`Right.
`MS. TSOU: Let's pull up page 174, 6 through 11.
`BY MS. TSOU:
`Q
`During your deposition, under oath, were you asked this
`question and did you give this answer to me?
`(Videotape playing)
`"Question: What applications would you include
`in the category where you would agree lateral steering is the
`most important driver for prices?
`"Answer: That's it.
`"Question: 4D surveys?
`"Answer: Yeah. 4D surveys, yes."
`(Video stopped)
`BY MS. TSOU:
`Q
`Sir, did you give that answer?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`Now, isn't it true that lateral steering is also the most
`important driver of prices for 3D surveys where 4D surveys were
`later contemplated?
`A
`Could you ask the question again? Sorry.
`Q
`Wouldn't you agree that lateral steering is also the most
`important driver of prices for 3D surveys where a 4D survey is
`later contemplated?
`
`Mayra Malone, CSR, RMR, CRR
`mayramalone@comcast.net
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`WESTERNGECO Exhibit 2125, pg. 22
`PGS v. WESTERNGECO
`IPR2014-01475
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`
`
`08:03
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` 4113
`
` Tsou Cross of Kenneth Williamson
`
`If you are a company that wants to repeat the source and
`A
`receiver location, so -- if you want to repeat the same
`positions as you had in the first survey, in the second survey,
`then, yes, it's an important -- it's an important capability.
`Q
`Your opinion on the importance of single sensor prices,
`that is your personal view, right?
`A
`Yes.
`Q
`It's not WesternGeco's official stance on the matter prior
`to 2005, by any means, is it?
`A
`Correct.
`Q
`And others valued steering differently than you did; isn't
`that true?
`A
`Inside WesternGeco?
`Q
`Yes.
`A
`I'm sure -- all the features of Q-Marine were valued in
`different ways. Some people thought that single sensor had a
`lot more applications for some companies than others. Others
`believed that streamer steering was more important. So I
`believe there was a spread of opinion on that.
`Q
`And that's the same for customers. Some customers believe
`that steering was the most important feature of Q-Marine?
`A
`Yes. Yes.
`Q
`Some oil companies, while you were at WesternGeco, would
`have attributed the highest value to