Page 1
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` IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`
` FOR THE DISTRICT OF MARYLAND
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` BALTIMORE DIVISION
`
`PAICE LLC and
`
`THE ABELL FOUNDATION, INC.,
`
` Plaintiffs,
`
` Case: 1:14cv00492-WDQ
`
`vs.
`
`FORD MOTOR COMPANY,
`
` Defendant.
`
`______________________________/
`
` DEPOSITION OF JEFFREY L. STEIN
`
` Southfield, Michigan
`
` January 12, 2015
`
`Reported by:
`
`Anne E. Vosburgh, CSR, RPR, CRR
`
`Job no: 13175
`
`TransPerfect Legal Solutions
`212-400-8845 - Depo@TransPerfect.com
`
`1
`
`PAICE 2106
`Ford v. Paice & Abell
`IPR2014-01415
`
`
`
` IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`
` FOR THE DISTRICT OF MARYLAND
`
` BALTIMORE DIVISION
`
`PAICE LLC and
`
`THE ABELL FOUNDATION, INC.,
`
` Plaintiffs,
`
` Case: 1:14cv00492-WDQ
`
`vs.
`
`FORD MOTOR COMPANY,
`
` Defendant.
`
`______________________________/
`
` DEPOSITION OF JEFFREY L. STEIN
`
` Southfield, Michigan
`
` January 12, 2015
`
`Reported by:
`
`Anne E. Vosburgh, CSR, RPR, CRR
`
`Job no: 13175
`
`TransPerfect Legal Solutions
`212-400-8845 - Depo@TransPerfect.com
`
`1
`
`PAICE 2106
`Ford v. Paice & Abell
`IPR2014-01415
`
`
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`Page 2
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`DEPOSITION OF JEFFREY L.STEIN, taken on January 12,
`
`2015 by the Plaintiffs, at the Law Offices of
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`Brooks Kushman, 1000 Town Center, Southfield,
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`Michigan, before Anne E. Vosburgh, Certified
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`Shorthand Reporter, Registered Professional
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`Reporter, Certified Realtime Reporter, and Notary
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`Public in and for the State of Michigan, County of
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`Oakland.
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`Page 3
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` A P P E A R A N C E S:
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`FOR THE PLAINTIFF:
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` FISH & RICHARDSON
`
` BY: RUFFIN B. CORDELL, ESQ.
`
` PETER GUARNIERI, ESQ.
`
` 1425 K Street NW, 11th Floor
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` Washington DC 20005
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` 202.783.5070
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` cordell@fr.com
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` guarnieri@fr.com
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`FOR THE DEFENDANT:
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` BROOKS KUSHMAN, PC
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` BY: FRANK A. ANGILERI, ESQ.
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` SANGEETA G. SHAH, ESQ.
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` ANDREW B. TURNER, ESQ.
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` 1000 Town Center, Floor 22
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` Southfield, Michigan 48075
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` 248.358.4400
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` fangileri@brookskushman.com
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` sshah@brookskushman.com
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` aturner@brookskushman.com
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` APPEARANCES, CONTINUED:
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`Page 4
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`FOR THE DEFENDANT:
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` LATHAM & WATKINS, LLP
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` BY: AARON PEREZ-DAPLE, ESQ.
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` 330 North Wabash Avenue
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` Suite 2800
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` Chicago, Illinois 60611
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` 312.876.7602
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` aaron.perez-daple@lw.com
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` ALSO PRESENT:
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` Frances M. Keenan, Paice LLC
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` INDEX TO EXAMINATIONS
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` WITNESS: JEFFREY L. STEIN
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`Page 5
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` EXAMINATION BY MR. CORDELL:.................. 7
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` INDEX TO EXHIBITS
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`EXHIBIT DESCRIPTION PAGE
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`Exhibit 1 Declaration of Dr. Jeffrey Stein 12
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` in Support of Petition for Inter
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` Partes Review; Appendix A, CV
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` and Appendix B, List of
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` Materials; Bates FMC 1002.
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`Exhibit 2 US Patent 5,343,970 Filed 154
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` September 6, 1994, Severinsky
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`Exhibit 3 SAE Paper 950493, The Effects of 174
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` APU Characteristics, by
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` Catherine Anderson and Erin
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` Pettit; Bates FMC 1006, 9 pages
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`Exhibit 4 US Patent 4,707,984, November 251
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` 24, 1987 Katsuno; Bates FMC 1008
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` (Exhibits attached.)
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` P R O C E E D I N G S
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` Southfield, Michigan
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` January 12, 2015
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`9:25 a.m.
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` MR. CORDELL: Ruffin Cordell and 09:25:45
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` Pete Guarnieri from Fish & Richardson on 09:25:46
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` behalf of Paice. 09:25:49
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` MR. ANGILERI: Frank Angileri, 09:25:52
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` Brooks Kushman, for Ford. 09:25:53
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` MS. SHAH: Sangeeta Shah for Ford. 09:25:57
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` MR. TURNER: Andrew Turner for 09:26:01
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` Ford. 09:26:05
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` MR. PEREZ-DAPLE: Aaron 09:26:06
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` Perez-Daple, Latham & Watkins, for Ford. 09:26:06
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` MR. ANGILERI: And just for the 09:26:11
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` record, Mr. Perez has not entered an 09:26:11
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` appearance but he is present, obviously. 09:26:14
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` 09:26:16
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` J E F F R E Y S T E I N,
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` Having taken an oath to testify
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` truthfully, was examined and
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` testified as follows.
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`Page 7
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` EXAMINATION 09:26:16
`
` BY MR. CORDELL: 09:26:16
`
` Q Good morning, Dr. Stein. 09:26:17
`
` A Good morning. 09:26:19
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` Q Thank you for joining us on a chilly 09:26:21
`
` morning. 09:26:24
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` Can you give us your full name and 09:26:24
`
` address for the record. 09:26:26
`
` A Certainly. Jeffrey L. Stein, 3055 09:26:27
`
` Whisperwood Drive, Ann Arbor, Michigan 48105. 09:26:30
`
` Q And you understand that you're under 09:26:35
`
` oath? 09:26:36
`
` A Yes. 09:26:42
`
` Q And you're testifying as if you were 09:26:42
`
` in a court of law? 09:26:43
`
` A Yes. 09:26:45
`
` Q Or before the patent office? 09:26:45
`
` A Yes. 09:26:47
`
` Q And have you been deposed before? 09:26:48
`
` A Yes. 09:26:51
`
` Q How many times? 09:26:53
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` A I don't know exactly, but several 09:26:53
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` times. 09:26:54
`
` Q You understand the rules pretty well? 09:26:55
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` A If you think it's wise to repeat 09:26:58
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` them, I'm certainly willing to listen. 09:27:00
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` Q Sure. 09:27:03
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` Let me give you a little bit of a 09:27:03
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` refresher. If I ask you a question and you 09:27:06
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` give me an answer, I'm going to assume you 09:27:08
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` understood my question. So if you don't, 09:27:11
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` please tell me. 09:27:11
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` If you need to take a break, wave 09:27:12
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` your hand, say something, talk to Mr. Angileri, 09:27:14
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` something. This is not an endurance test by 09:27:21
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` any stretch. 09:27:26
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` A Okay. Thank you. 09:27:26
`
` MR. ANGILERI: Objection, form. 09:27:27
`
` BY MR. CORDELL: 09:27:29
`
` Q So with that understanding, is there 09:27:29
`
` any reason today why you can't testify fully 09:27:30
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` and truthfully? 09:27:32
`
` A None that I can think of. 09:27:33
`
` Q You're a professor at the University 09:27:40
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` of Michigan, correct? 09:27:41
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` A Yes. 09:27:43
`
` Q What do you teach? 09:27:44
`
` A Mechanical engineering is the 09:27:46
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` department in which I teach. 09:27:48
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` Q What kinds of courses do you teach? 09:27:49
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` A I teach courses in mechanical design, 09:27:52
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` mechatronics, systems and controls, dynamics, 09:27:57
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` machine control. 09:28:01
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` Q So dynamics sounds like an undergrad 09:28:10
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` class; is that correct? 09:28:12
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` A Well, we have both undergraduate and 09:28:14
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` graduate courses in almost all of those topics. 09:28:17
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` Q Tell me how many of your courses that 09:28:19
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` you're currently teaching are undergrad 09:28:20
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` classes? 09:28:23
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` A I teach approximately even numbers of 09:28:24
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` undergraduate and graduate classes. 09:28:26
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` Q So four? 09:28:30
`
` A This past term I taught two 09:28:31
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` undergraduate classes and one graduate class. 09:28:34
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` Q And what are you teaching -- are you 09:28:37
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` between terms right now? 09:28:40
`
` A Our new term just started last week. 09:28:41
`
` Q And what are you teaching this 09:28:45
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` semester, or term? 09:28:48
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` A I don't have any formal classroom 09:28:50
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` teaching this term. 09:28:51
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` Q Are you supervising any grad 09:28:55
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` students? 09:28:57
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` A Yes. 09:29:00
`
` Q Generally, how many grad students do 09:29:01
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` you supervise in any particular term? 09:29:03
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` A Well, that number does fluctuate. 09:29:20
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` Approximately six at the moment. Maybe as high 09:29:21
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` as a dozen. 09:29:25
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` Q Can you describe the process for your 09:29:28
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` supervision of a grad student attending the 09:29:31
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` University of Michigan? What generally do you 09:29:34
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` do? 09:29:37
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` A Could you repeat the question, 09:29:44
`
` please? 09:29:45
`
` Q What does it mean to supervise a grad 09:29:45
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` student? 09:29:47
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` A There are different roles as a mentor 09:29:50
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` for different types of graduate students. So 09:29:56
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` that's why I'm hesitating a bit on your 09:29:59
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` question. I'm not sure which graduate student 09:30:00
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` in which role are you -- 09:30:03
`
` Q Well, a graduate student that's 09:30:05
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` pursuing a master's, what kinds of things do 09:30:07
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` you do with that person? 09:30:10
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` A So that person would tend to require 09:30:16
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` some counseling about course choices, some 09:30:18
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` discussion about research options that they 09:30:28
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` might consider, some options -- or discussion 09:30:30
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` about companies they might work with in 09:30:37
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` different kinds of industries, different kinds 09:30:39
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` of areas that -- the courses that they're doing 09:30:41
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` work in might lead to. 09:30:45
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` And there are also those master's 09:30:54
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` students who I actually specifically end up 09:30:58
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` engaged in a research project with, which -- 09:31:00
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` and then, of course, there's considerable 09:31:03
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` discussion about the content of the research 09:31:06
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` that we're doing together. 09:31:09
`
` Q Do you write papers with your 09:31:14
`
` students? 09:31:15
`
` A Yes. 09:31:16
`
` Q How often? 09:31:18
`
` A Well, we have my CV. There's 09:31:19
`
` hundreds of publications there. So divide the 09:31:21
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` number of years by the number of publications, 09:31:24
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` vice versa, you'll get a number. 09:31:28
`
` Q Somewhere around eight to ten a year, 09:31:30
`
` if my math is right? 09:31:33
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` A Some number like that. 09:31:34
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` MR. CORDELL: Let me go ahead and 09:31:36
`
` mark as Exhibit 1 your declaration in 09:31:37
`
` this case. 09:31:39
`
` The declaration that I have in 09:31:48
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` front of me for United States Patent 09:31:48
`
` 88,214,097, IPR Case No. IPR2014-00570. 09:31:49
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` In this case it's marked as FMC-1002. 09:31:56
`
` (Marked Deposition Exhibit 1; 09:32:13
`
` Declaration of Dr. Jeffrey L. Stein 09:32:13
`
` in Support of Petition for Inter 09:32:13
`
` Partes Review; Appendix A, CV; and 09:32:13
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` Appendix B, List of Materials 09:32:13
`
` Considered. Bates FMC 1002.) 09:32:13
`
` BY MR. CORDELL: 09:32:15
`
` Q Mr. Stein, let me hand you your, and 09:32:15
`
` attached to the back is your CV, correct? 09:32:17
`
` A Yes. I found it. 09:32:51
`
` Q And you have hundreds of papers 09:32:53
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` listed here, right? 09:32:58
`
` A Yes. 09:33:01
`
` Q I actually counted them up in your 09:33:19
`
` declaration. In paragraph 10, you said you've 09:33:23
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` authored over 65 journal articles, 13 of which 09:33:27
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` are related to hybrid electric vehicles; is 09:33:31
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` that right? 09:33:39
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` A Yes. I see that paragraph. 09:33:59
`
` Q Is that accurate? 09:34:00
`
` A I've authored 65 journal articles -- 09:34:02
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` over 65 journal articles, including at least 13 09:34:03
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` articles that are related to hybrid electric 09:34:08
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` vehicles. 09:34:12
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` And I've also contributed over 115 09:34:13
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` referee conference papers, including at least 09:34:14
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` 18 papers that are related to hybrid electric 09:34:16
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` vehicles. 09:34:20
`
` Q So not quite 200, but almost; is that 09:34:21
`
` right? 09:34:24
`
` A That would be fair. In the CV that's 09:34:35
`
` attached, there are a few more that are not 09:34:38
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` included. 09:34:41
`
` Q Let's go back to the CV and Appendix 09:34:41
`
` A. And just picking the first few, you have 09:34:44
`
` articles directed to things like "Influence of 09:34:48
`
` Fifth Wheel Location on Truck Ride Quality," 09:34:52
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` and "Stance Phase Control of Above-Knee 09:34:54
`
` Prosthesis: Knee Control Versus SACH Foot 09:34:58
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` Design," and "Evaluation of DC Servo Machine 09:34:58
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` Tool Feed Drives as Force Sensors." 09:35:01
`
` How do you select topics for these 09:35:07
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` papers? 09:35:10
`
` A That's an interesting question, a 09:35:32
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` complicated question, I think. 09:35:36
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` But just generally speaking, papers 09:35:37
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` are generated as a result of -- of results you 09:35:39
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` get from your research work. You decide where 09:35:43
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` the new contributions are and you write a paper 09:35:47
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` on the contribution. 09:35:50
`
` Q So maybe my question should be 09:35:52
`
` different then. 09:35:54
`
` How do you decide the direction or 09:35:55
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` focus of your research work? 09:35:58
`
` A That's also an interesting question, 09:36:09
`
` a complicated question. It's a question that 09:36:11
`
` all faculty members have to think long and hard 09:36:14
`
` about. 09:36:20
`
` But you -- it's a combination of a 09:36:27
`
` number of factors, things that you have some 09:36:32
`
` inherent interest in; things that are important 09:36:37
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` to local industry and the country and the 09:36:40
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` world, in terms of problems that need to be 09:36:44
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` solved. 09:36:48
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` There are also issues that are 09:36:49
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` related to what the national funding agencies 09:37:00
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` are thinking are important topics. They 09:37:04
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` release call for proposals in particular areas, 09:37:07
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` so that also drives it. 09:37:12
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` There are many, many things that 09:37:16
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` drive the different kinds of decisions that are 09:37:18
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` made by faculty members to work in different 09:37:20
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` areas and different topics. 09:37:26
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` Q So sometimes do your students suggest 09:37:29
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` areas of interests that you then pursue as a 09:37:31
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` topic of research? 09:37:35
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` A Certainly all students bring to the 09:37:47
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` table their own personal interests, both 09:37:49
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` intellectually and in terms of industry that 09:37:52
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` they're interested in working in, and 09:37:54
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` applications they're interested in working on. 09:37:56
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` That ends up blending in with the 09:37:59
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` needs of the research lab, my lab in this case; 09:38:03
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` or if I'm working with other faculty members, 09:38:06
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` then these might be group efforts that 09:38:10
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` represent a confluence of interest in a 09:38:16
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` confluence of funding agencies. 09:38:20
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` Q When it comes time to write a paper, 09:38:23
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` do you generally try to write up the new 09:38:26
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` developments as a particular traunch of 09:38:31
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` research? 09:38:35
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` A Can you rephrase that question? 09:38:36
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` Q I'll try again. 09:38:39
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` So you mentioned a few minutes ago 09:38:39
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` that when you write a paper, you try to present 09:38:42
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` whatever new developments you've come up with. 09:38:44
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` And I would like you to try to describe that 09:38:48
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` for me a little bit. 09:38:50
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` MR. ANGILERI: Objection, 09:38:52
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` foundation. 09:38:53
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` BY MR. CORDELL: 09:38:54
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` Q Let me try it this way, Dr. Stein: 09:38:54
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` Why do you write a paper? 09:38:56
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` A As part of the scientific process, 09:39:11
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` the idea is to inform the rest of your 09:39:13
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` colleagues in particular, but the world more 09:39:17
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` generally, of new discoveries that you have 09:39:20
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` made so that everybody can benefit from the 09:39:25
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` knowledge. 09:39:27
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` It helps inform other researchers. 09:39:27
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` It helps industry be able to, you know, utilize 09:39:30
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` in discoveries in what they are doing. 09:39:34
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` It is to everybody's benefit to take 09:39:41
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` the research results, the new results that you 09:39:47
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` have, and to explain it and provide it in a 09:39:49
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` form that's available to everybody. 09:39:55
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` Q And when you say "to take the new 09:39:57
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` research results that you have," I take it the 09:40:00
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` point of the paper is not to repeat what you've 09:40:01
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` said before? 09:40:04
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` MR. ANGILERI: Objection, form. 09:40:06
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` THE WITNESS: So I guess I would 09:40:15
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` ask you to rephrase that question, 09:40:15
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` please. 09:40:20
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` BY MR. CORDELL: 09:40:21
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` Q Why? 09:40:21
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` A Because it's unclear to me. 09:40:22
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` Q What's unclear? 09:40:23
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` A Well, if I had a clear understanding 09:40:24
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` of what was confusing me, I wouldn't have to 09:40:26
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` ask you. 09:40:28
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` Q Well, unfortunately, though, that's 09:40:28
`
` the only way I know how to clean it up is -- 09:40:30
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` A Well, just take a random stab at it 09:40:33
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` and I'll tell you the next time it comes back. 09:40:36
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` Q I don't know. Maybe with this we can 09:40:39
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` try, but ... 09:40:43
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` Do you ever write, publish, a 09:40:45
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` research paper to repeat the results that you 09:40:51
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` had previously published just for that purpose? 09:40:54
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` A So in -- I guess one of the things I 09:41:14
`
` have to ask you to clear up is there are 09:41:16
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` different venues for publication. And there 09:41:20
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` are different rules around publishing things in 09:41:23
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` different venues, slightly different venues. 09:41:27
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` So it's hard to give you a completely blanket 09:41:29
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` answer to your question. 09:41:37
`
` Q So sometimes you take something 09:41:38
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` that's published in a non-referee journal and 09:41:40
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` you might take it to a referee journal and have 09:41:43
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` it published there; is that fair? 09:41:45
`
` A Well, that's one possible scenario, 09:41:48
`
` although I don't have any publications listed 09:41:51
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` here except for a few reports at the very, very 09:41:55
`
` end that are quite old, actually. All of the 09:41:58
`
` papers here have been refereed. 09:41:59
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` Q Let me ask it this way: Dr. Stein, 09:42:07
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` do you ever -- I mean, it would be wrong for a 09:42:07
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` new graduate student to come on board and claim 09:42:13
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` as his or her own work something that a prior 09:42:16
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` graduate student had done, fair? 09:42:19
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` A So I'm not sure exactly what you're 09:42:36
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` trying to drive at here. The purpose of each 09:42:39
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` paper, in general, is to archive -- amongst 09:42:45
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` other things is to archive new findings, new 09:42:53
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` results. 09:42:57
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` That doesn't mean there isn't some 09:42:59
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` material that's common from that paper A with 09:43:00
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` some paper B that may be in the same area. 09:43:05
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` So there may be some similar 09:43:08
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` material. 09:43:10
`
` Q Well, there's foundational material, 09:43:13
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` fair? 09:43:16
`
` A Background material. There could be 09:43:17
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` a considerable overlap. But there should be 09:43:25
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` some new material, some new results, some new 09:43:29
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` perspective, some new findings in the paper 09:43:32
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` that you've -- that you're writing. 09:43:36
`
` Q There's a level of filtering that 09:43:41
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` goes on in the sense that you don't -- you 09:43:45
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` don't publish every nuance that you discovered, 09:43:47
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` correct? 09:43:53
`
` MR. ANGILERI: Objection, 09:43:54
`
` foundation. 09:43:55
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` THE WITNESS: I mean, you publish 09:43:59
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` new information, new results that you 09:44:01
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` have. I don't know what you mean by 09:44:05
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` "nuance." 09:44:10
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` BY MR. CORDELL: 09:44:11
`
` Q Well, you can't publish a new paper 09:44:11
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` every week, right? 09:44:14
`
` A There's nothing that prevents one 09:44:16
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` from doing that. 09:44:17
`
` Q Well, physically you can't, right? 09:44:18
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` You have to teach; you have to live and do 09:44:21
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` other things. 09:44:24
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` A It certainly takes a finite amount of 09:44:26
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` effort to produce a paper, and it takes a 09:44:29
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` finite amount of time. 09:44:31
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` Q Let me just ask you, within your 09:44:32
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` work, how do you make a decision about whether 09:44:36
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` a particular discovery is significant enough to 09:44:39
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` merit a new paper? 09:44:42
`
` A I mean, that's a -- an important 09:44:55
`
` question that you're asking that is also a 09:45:01
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` complicated question that I don't think there's 09:45:03
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` just one answer for, but I'll try to answer 09:45:06
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` your question, generally speaking. 09:45:09
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` It's one that my colleagues and I 09:45:14
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` talk about. And it's actually what the referee 09:45:16
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` process is also about, is to decide whether 09:45:18
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` there's something new in the paper that is 09:45:23
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` being -- that somebody provides to a journal, 09:45:27
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` like -- the journal editor or associate editor 09:45:35
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` passes the paper out to reviewers who review 09:45:39
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` the paper. 09:45:41
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` There's this process for trying to 09:45:42
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` determine whether there is significant new 09:45:44
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` content in the paper, amongst other things. 09:45:46
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` Q But that's one of the criteria you 09:45:49
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` use to decide whether to publish a new paper, 09:45:51
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` significant new content? 09:45:54
`
` A It's certainly one of the 09:46:19
`
` requirements for scientific papers, the 09:46:22
`
` journals that I publish in, is that the paper 09:46:27
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` has to have new -- has to have new results. 09:46:31
`
` It's not the only thing. 09:46:35
`
` Q So let's took at an example of one of 09:46:41
`
` these -- I'll try to pick one that's a little 09:46:43
`
` more recent. 09:46:45
`
` It looks like entry 57 on Appendix A 09:46:46
`
` of your CV deals with "Optimal Control of Film 09:46:51
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` JEFFREY STEIN
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` Growth in Lithium Ion Battery Packs via" -- 09:47:00
`
` A Which page are you on, please? 09:47:10
`
` Q It's page 203 of the document, 1125 09:47:11
`
` of your CV. 09:47:13
`
` A Okay. And which publication number? 09:47:19
`
` Q 57. 09:47:23
`
` A 57. Okay. I see that particular 09:47:24
`
` citation, yes.
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