Page 1
`
` IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
` FOR THE DISTRICT OF MARYLAND
` BALTIMORE DIVISION
`
`PAICE, LLC and
`THE ABELL FOUNDATION, INC.,
` Plaintiffs,
` Case 1:14-cv-00492-WDQ
`vs.
`
`FORD MOTOR COMPANY,
` Defendant.
`__________________________/
`
` DEPOSITION OF JEFFREY L. STEIN, Ph.D.
` Southfield, Michigan
` March 3, 2015
`
`REPORTED BY:
`Paula S. Raskin, CSR-4757
`Ref. No. 13579
`
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`1
`
`PAICE 2104
`Ford v. Paice & Abell
`IPR2014-01415
`
`
`
` IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
` FOR THE DISTRICT OF MARYLAND
` BALTIMORE DIVISION
`
`PAICE, LLC and
`THE ABELL FOUNDATION, INC.,
` Plaintiffs,
` Case 1:14-cv-00492-WDQ
`vs.
`
`FORD MOTOR COMPANY,
` Defendant.
`__________________________/
`
` DEPOSITION OF JEFFREY L. STEIN, Ph.D.
` Southfield, Michigan
` March 3, 2015
`
`REPORTED BY:
`Paula S. Raskin, CSR-4757
`Ref. No. 13579
`
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`212-400-8845 -- depo@transperfect.com
`
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`
`PAICE 2104
`Ford v. Paice & Abell
`IPR2014-01415
`
`
`
`Page 2
`
`DEPOSITION OF JEFFREY L. STEIN, Ph.D., taken on
`March 3, 2015 by the Plaintiffs at the Law
`Offices of Brooks Kushman, 1000 Town Center,
`Floor 22, Southfield, Michigan, before Paula S.
`Raskin, Certified Shorthand Reporter and Notary
`Public in and for the State of Michigan, County
`of Oakland.
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` A P P E A R A N C E S:
`
`FOR THE PLAINTIFFS:
`
` FISH & RICHARDSON
` BY: LINDA LIU KORDZIEL
` 1425 K Street NW, 11th Floor
` Washington, DC 20005
` (202) 783-5070
` kordziel@fr.com
`
`FOR THE DEFENDANT:
`
` BROOKS KUSHMAN, PC
` BY: FRANK A. ANGILERI
` ANDREW B. TURNER
` SANGEETA G. SHAH
` 1000 Town Center, Floor 22
` Southfield, Michigan 48075
` (248) 358-4400
` fangileri@brookskushman.com
` aturner@brookskushman.com
` sshah@brookskushman.com
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` APPEARANCES, CONTINUED:
`
`FOR THE DEFENDANT:
`
` LATHAM & WATKINS, LLP
` BY: THOMAS W. YEH
` 555 11th Street NW, Suite 1000
` Washington, DC 20004
` (202) 637-1039
` thomas.yeh@lw.com
`
`ALSO PRESENT:
` Frances M. Keenan, PAICE LLC
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` INDEX TO EXAMINATIONS
`
`Page 5
`
`Witness Page
`JEFFREY L. STEIN, Ph.D.
`EXAMINATION BY MS. KORDZIEL: 6
`EXAMINATION BY MR. ANGILERI: 185
`
` INDEX TO EXHIBITS
`
`Exhibit Page
`(Exhibits attached to transcript.)
`
`EXHIBIT 1 - Declaration of Dr. Jeffrey L. Stein 15
` in Support of Petition for Inter
` Partes Review - Patent No. 7,559,388
`EXHIBIT 2 - Supplement to Declaration 18
`EXHIBIT 3 - Severinsky Patent 7,559,388 B2 21
`EXHIBIT 4 - Ehsani Patent 5,586,613 22
`EXHIBIT 5 - Kawakatsu Patent 4,335,429 22
`EXHIBIT 6 - "12th International Electric Vehicle 22
` Symposium"
`EXHIBIT 7 - "Hybrid Power Unit Development for 23
` Fiat Multipla Vehicle" - Caraceni
`EXHIBIT 8 - Fjallstrom Patent 5,120,282 23
`EXHIBIT 9 - Yamaguchi Patent 5,865,263 23
`
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`Page 6
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` P R O C E E D I N G S
` Southfield, Michigan
` March 3, 2015
` 8:33 a.m.
` * * * *
` JEFFREY L. STEIN, Ph.D.,
` having been called as a witness herein, was
` first duly sworn, examined, and testified as
` follows:
` MS. KORDZIEL: Good morning, 08:33:56
` Dr. Stein. 08:33:56
` THE WITNESS: Good morning. 08:33:56
` MS. KORDZIEL: I'm Linda Kordziel. 08:33:58
` I'm here on behalf of PAICE and the Abell 08:33:59
` Foundation, and with me is Frances Keenan, 08:34:02
` the chair of PAICE. 08:34:04
` MR. ANGILERI: And I'm Frank 08:34:07
` Angileri. With me are Thomas Yeh and Andy 08:34:10
` Turner. 08:34:14
` EXAMINATION 08:34:14
` BY MS. KORDZIEL: 08:34:14
` Q. Would you please state your full 08:34:15
` name and business address for the record. 08:34:16
` A. Certainly. My name is Jeffrey L. 08:34:18
` Stein, and my business address is the 08:34:21
`
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` University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan. 08:34:23
` Q. And you understand you've just taken 08:34:25
` an oath and that your testimony here is the 08:34:28
` same as if you were testifying in court, 08:34:31
` correct? 08:34:33
` A. Yes. 08:34:33
` Q. And is there any reason why you 08:34:34
` cannot testify fully and accurately today? 08:34:36
` A. No. 08:34:38
` Q. How many times have you been 08:34:39
` deposed? 08:34:40
` A. I don't know. I've been deposed a 08:34:40
` number of times. I'd have to go back to my 08:34:45
` records to come up with a number. 08:34:49
` Q. Like more than 20? 08:34:50
` A. Yes. 08:34:53
` Q. So it's fair to say you understand 08:34:54
` the general deposition procedures. 08:34:57
` A. I think that it might be useful to 08:35:00
` review those so we will be clear as to what the 08:35:03
` expectation is today. 08:35:07
` Q. I'll be asking you questions, and if 08:35:09
` there's anything you don't understand, you can 08:35:11
` ask me for clarification. 08:35:14
` A. Okay. 08:35:15
`
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` Q. We'll be taking breaks from time to 08:35:15
` time, but if there's for some reason that you 08:35:19
` feel like you need to take a break, you need to 08:35:21
` let me know, but I'd ask that you finish 08:35:23
` answering the question if there's a pending 08:35:25
` question. 08:35:27
` A. Okay. 08:35:27
` Q. Also from time to time your counsel 08:35:28
` may make objections for the record. However, 08:35:30
` unless he instructs you not to answer a 08:35:32
` question, you should answer the question. 08:35:34
` A. Okay. 08:35:36
` Q. So what -- so this proceeding -- you 08:35:37
` were previously deposed, the IPR proceeding 08:35:42
` 570, and so I'm going to refer to this 08:35:48
` proceeding as the 875 proceeding, just to make 08:35:50
` that clear. 08:35:53
` MR. ANGILERI: Actually, Linda, I 08:36:01
` don't want to interrupt if you want him to 08:36:03
` answer that question. If you want to 08:36:05
` finish your question, go ahead, but I've 08:36:07
` got something I want to give you. It's 08:36:09
` basically an errata sheet of sorts. 08:36:10
` MS. KORDZIEL: Oh, okay. Yeah, I 08:36:14
` wish we had seen that before this morning. 08:36:15
`
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` MR. ANGILERI: It's not that big a 08:36:17
` deal, but you can take a look at it. Do 08:36:18
` you want to see it now, I assume? 08:36:20
` MS. KORDZIEL: I'll take a look at 08:36:21
` it at a break. 08:36:23
` MR. ANGILERI: I've got like an 08:36:24
` original and four copies, so I'll give you 08:36:26
` the original and three copies. 08:36:29
` Q. Were there errors in your 08:36:35
` declaration? 08:36:37
` A. There were just a few minor 08:36:38
` typographical type mistakes in a section that I 08:36:42
` have -- that you just were handed. 08:36:46
` Q. Did your opinions change? 08:36:49
` A. No. 08:36:51
` Q. And then how did you discover these 08:36:52
` errors? 08:36:54
` A. In reviewing for the deposition. 08:36:55
` Q. Were there any other errors in your 08:36:56
` declaration other than what you've stated here 08:36:59
` in this new declaration? 08:37:02
` A. There are -- always when you reread 08:37:04
` your written documents, in this case, my 08:37:10
` declaration, you find sentences that could have 08:37:14
` been worded a little bit better or more 08:37:19
`
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` clearly. So there are instances of those in 08:37:22
` the declaration, and if we get to a section 08:37:26
` where I read something that or I need to point 08:37:29
` out something to you that seems a little bit 08:37:35
` like it could be improved, I'll -- I will let 08:37:38
` you know. 08:37:42
` Q. And when did you discover these 08:37:42
` errors? 08:37:46
` A. Yesterday, I think, or the night 08:37:47
` before. Something along that order. 08:37:51
` Q. So during one of the breaks, I'll 08:38:03
` take a look at this and then we can talk about 08:38:05
` this. 08:38:08
` A. Sure. 08:38:08
` Q. So I think I -- before we broke off, 08:38:10
` we were talking about this proceeding. I'll 08:38:13
` refer to it as the 875 proceeding, and that's 08:38:15
` just the number that the Patent Trademark 08:38:18
` Office gave for this IPR proceeding. 08:38:21
` A. Okay. 08:38:25
` Q. So when were you retained to work on 08:38:25
` this proceeding? 08:38:28
` A. The 875? 08:38:28
` Q. Yes. 08:38:33
` A. I don't think I can give you an 08:38:34
`
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` answer that is specific to this particular 08:38:36
` proceeding. 08:38:42
` Q. Was it the same time as when you 08:38:44
` were retained for the 570 proceeding? 08:38:47
` A. Yes. I was retained by Ford through 08:38:49
` counsel approximately December, I think, of 08:39:00
` 2013, I think it would be. 08:39:10
` Q. And then other than your work 08:39:13
` relating to the IPRs, are you doing any other 08:39:19
` consulting work or projects for Ford? 08:39:23
` A. At the -- I mean I guess we'd have 08:39:27
` to be a little bit careful about what you mean 08:39:36
` by doing work for Ford. I don't have any other 08:39:39
` consulting projects right now that involve 08:39:46
` Ford, if that's what you mean. And then at the 08:39:50
` University of Michigan, I don't have any 08:39:53
` specific research funding from Ford either. 08:39:54
` Q. Have you done any work, either 08:39:57
` consulting work or with the University of 08:39:59
` Michigan, in the past for Ford? 08:40:02
` A. Yes. 08:40:04
` Q. And then you mentioned, you know, 08:40:05
` currently, are you working on other litigations 08:40:10
` for Ford? 08:40:12
` A. No. 08:40:13
`
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` Q. And then can you explain or 08:40:13
` elaborate what you meant by you need to be 08:40:18
` careful about the other work that you're doing 08:40:20
` for Ford? 08:40:22
` A. I don't think I said that. If I 08:40:23
` did, I misspoke. I was trying to say that you 08:40:25
` didn't really define when you said work, what 08:40:36
` you meant by work, when you're working for Ford 08:40:39
` or working for someone. 08:40:42
` Q. I see. 08:40:43
` A. So that's what I was implying; it 08:40:44
` was a little bit ambiguous. I try to be clear 08:40:46
` about that by saying I don't have any 08:40:51
` consulting projects that involve Ford and that 08:40:53
` I don't have any research projects that are 08:40:58
` being funded by Ford. 08:41:01
` Q. Okay. Can you give an estimate of 08:41:03
` how many hours you've spent working on the 875 08:41:07
` proceeding? 08:41:13
` A. Could you repeat the question, 08:41:13
` please? 08:41:15
` Q. Can you give an estimate of how many 08:41:15
` hours you've spent working on this IPR 875 08:41:18
` proceeding? 08:41:22
` A. That would be difficult to do 08:41:24
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` sitting here. First of all, the declaration 08:41:30
` that I wrote for this matter, I wrote last May, 08:41:36
` April, March time frame, and so I certainly 08:41:46
` today don't remember how much time I spent 08:41:53
` preparing that. And then -- so I can't answer 08:41:58
` your question. 08:42:03
` Q. Is it more than a hundred hours, you 08:42:04
` would say? 08:42:06
` A. I can't answer the question. 08:42:06
` Q. How about in total for all the IPRs 08:42:08
` that you're involved with with Ford, can you 08:42:13
` provide an estimate of how many hours you've 08:42:16
` worked on? 08:42:17
` A. I couldn't do it off the top of my 08:42:19
` head. 08:42:22
` Q. Is it more than a hundred hours? 08:42:22
` A. Again, I'd have to check. I think 08:42:25
` it's important to be accurate about this. I'd 08:42:28
` have to check my records. 08:42:30
` Q. And how much have you gotten paid by 08:42:33
` Ford so far? 08:42:36
` A. I don't know the answer to that 08:42:40
` either. I again would have to check my 08:42:44
` records. 08:42:49
` Q. What did you do, if anything, in 08:42:50
`
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` preparation for your deposition today? 08:42:58
` A. Well, I would consider all the work 08:43:01
` that I've done in preparing this declaration 08:43:10
` and in reviewing the declaration more recently 08:43:18
` and the references that are cited in the 08:43:24
` declaration as the basic things that I've 08:43:31
` looked at to get ready for today's deposition. 08:43:36
` Q. And who did you -- did you talk to 08:43:42
` anybody in preparing for your deposition? 08:43:44
` A. Yes. 08:43:46
` Q. Who did you talk to? 08:43:47
` A. I talked with the Brooks Kushman 08:43:48
` counsel that's I presume counsel of record. 08:43:56
` Q. Did you talk to Dr. Davis at all? 08:44:01
` A. No. 08:44:04
` Q. Have you reviewed any of his 08:44:04
` declarations or deposition transcripts? 08:44:07
` A. No. 08:44:09
` Q. In preparing your declarations, did 08:44:13
` you talk or confer with Dr. Davis? 08:44:19
` A. Could you repeat that, please? 08:44:21
` Q. When you were preparing your 08:44:22
` declarations either for this proceeding or the 08:44:24
` other proceedings, did you talk or confer with 08:44:26
` Dr. Davis? 08:44:29
`
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` A. I have not talked to Dr. Davis about 08:44:29
` these things. 08:44:31
` MS. KORDZIEL: So I'd like to mark 08:44:37
` this document as Exhibit 1. It's Ford 08:44:38
` Exhibit Number 1002. 08:44:43
` (DEPOSITION EXHIBIT 1 MARKED 08:44:45
` FOR IDENTIFICATION at 8:44 a.m.) 08:44:45
` Q. Can you identify what we've marked 08:45:03
` as Exhibit 1? 08:45:07
` A. Declaration of Dr. Jeffrey L. Stein 08:45:07
` in support of petition for inter partes review 08:45:11
` under a whole bunch of codes, numbers, 08:45:17
` et cetera. Then skipping over that, Claims 1 08:45:21
` through 4, 6, 12 and 19 of US Patent Number 08:45:23
` 7,559,388. 08:45:29
` Q. And on Page 197, is that your 08:45:33
` signature? 08:45:37
` A. Yes. 08:45:54
` Q. And then Appendix B contains a list 08:45:55
` of materials that you considered. Is this all 08:46:02
` the materials that you considered? 08:46:05
` A. I mean I have -- and these are the 08:46:08
` materials that I directly felt were important 08:46:24
` to cite or provide as part of my declaration. 08:46:29
` I, of course, you know, reviewed 08:46:37
`
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` textbooks and materials in the hybrid area and 08:46:40
` in engineering more generally for years that 08:46:45
` helped form my understanding of these matters, 08:46:50
` and they're not listed here, of course. 08:46:52
` Q. Do you believe that your declaration 08:46:54
` contains all the bases of your opinions with 08:46:56
` respect to the prior art references that are 08:46:59
` analyzed there? 08:47:02
` A. I think the declaration provides a 08:47:05
` summary of my opinions about the 388 with 08:47:08
` respect to the claims that are described on the 08:47:15
` front page, and I think that's probably a fair 08:47:17
` statement. 08:47:26
` Q. Other than the supplemental 08:47:26
` declaration that I received this morning, is 08:47:30
` there anything else that you wanted to add or 08:47:32
` change to your declaration? 08:47:33
` A. Well, as I mentioned at the 08:47:35
` beginning of our -- at the beginning of the 08:47:38
` deposition this morning, there are paragraphs, 08:47:42
` sentences that, upon review, I think could be 08:47:49
` in some cases clearer, and so there are some 08:47:53
` things about my declaration that I think could 08:47:59
` be helped through some small modifications for 08:48:06
` clarity's sake. 08:48:12
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` Q. Other than what's presented in the 08:48:15
` supplemental declaration, is there anything 08:48:32
` else that's incorrect in your declaration? 08:48:34
` MR. ANGILERI: I'm going to object 08:48:36
` to the form on "supplemental declaration." 08:48:37
` A. Yeah, I didn't say that -- could you 08:48:41
` repeat the question, please? 08:48:47
` Q. Other than the declaration that I 08:48:49
` was handed this morning, is there anything else 08:48:50
` you want to correct in your original 08:48:52
` declaration? 08:48:54
` MR. ANGILERI: Object to the form. 08:49:04
` Just to be clear in case you don't mark it 08:49:05
` in the record, what I handed you was what I 08:49:08
` called an errata sheet. It has the cover 08:49:10
` sheet, Page 1 from his declaration, and 08:49:13
` then Pages 114 through 125 with a couple of 08:49:15
` handwritten markings. So if that's what 08:49:20
` you're referring to as the supplemental 08:49:22
` declaration, I don't really agree with the 08:49:24
` characterization, but we can move on. 08:49:26
` MS. KORDZIEL: Yeah, I haven't had a 08:49:28
` chance to read it yet, but that's what I'm 08:49:30
` referring to. 08:49:33
` A. Yeah, that was confusing me, and 08:49:34
`
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` that -- it literally has just a few hand 08:49:36
` markings in -- on just a couple of the pages 08:49:41
` that are on there. 08:49:46
` Q. So the text hasn't changed. It's 08:49:48
` just that you have some hand markings on these 08:49:51
` pages? 08:49:54
` A. I think it would be best to go 08:49:54
` through and be very specific about the changes. 08:49:56
` It would be easier than just one little 08:49:58
` sentence to characterize them. 08:50:01
` MS. KORDZIEL: Okay. We can mark 08:50:03
` this as Exhibit Number 2. 08:50:04
` (DEPOSITION EXHIBIT 2 MARKED 08:50:05
` FOR IDENTIFICATION at 8:50 a.m.) 08:50:05
` Q. Can you identify what we've marked 08:50:35
` as Exhibit Number 2? 08:50:36
` A. This is a document that I prepared 08:50:38
` yesterday, which is the title page, Page 1, of 08:50:42
` my declaration, Pages 114 through Page 125 of 08:50:48
` the declaration. And these are identical 08:50:58
` copies of the declaration that was submitted 08:51:07
` with the addition of a few handwritten markings 08:51:11
` on some of the pages. 08:51:15
` Q. I see. So the printed text is the 08:51:17
` same as the text that's in your original 08:51:19
`
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`Page 19
` declaration? 08:51:22
` A. Yes. 08:51:22
` Q. Okay. 08:51:23
` A. And looking through, I believe the 08:51:28
` first hand markings are on Page 119. 08:51:32
` Q. Okay. 08:51:47
` A. There's a table on Page 119, 08:51:48
` "Table A - Analysis of Caraceni's 'threshold 08:51:51
` value' (Torque gradient in percent per 08:51:54
` revolution)." 08:52:01
` And Columns F and G, the first six 08:52:04
` rows in Columns F and G, the formatting that 08:52:10
` was used to print out those numbers in the 08:52:14
` table was not set correctly and so they printed 08:52:17
` out as zero when in fact the numbers are not 08:52:22
` zero. They're -- because they only printed 08:52:26
` three significant digits, and so I went back to 08:52:31
` my original source and handwrote the numbers 08:52:35
` that should have been in that -- in those 08:52:40
` cells. 08:52:46
` So, for example, the first one was 08:52:47
` .001, but to four significant figures, it's 08:52:51
` .0006. 08:52:58
` Q. I think I understand that. So 08:53:02
` what's the next correction? 08:53:03
`
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` A. On Page 121, in the third to last 08:53:06
` line, the units on the torque gradients that 08:53:18
` I -- that Caraceni talks about in some of his 08:53:31
` figures, in particular Figures 12 through 6, 08:53:36
` had the wrong units on them. 08:53:40
` So it says in the third lesson, 08:53:41
` "Caraceni's selected torque gradients of 1 08:53:45
` decanewton meters per second -- 08:53:48
` THE WITNESS: And that's DA capital 08:53:52
` N small M slash S, decanewton meters per 08:53:53
` second. 08:54:02
` A. So it says 1 decanewton meter per 08:54:03
` second. 08:54:03
` And then the second number in that 08:54:08
` sequence is 2, and it says decanewton meters 08:54:11
` per second, but it should have just read 08:54:15
` 2 newton meters per second, so eliminating the 08:54:19
` prefix DA. 08:54:23
` And the third entry in that sequence 08:54:24
` is 9 decanewton meters per second, and that 08:54:28
` should have been 9 newton meters per second, 08:54:33
` again eliminating the deca prefix. 08:54:36
` Q. So I think I understand what you 08:54:42
` were doing here. I'll take a -- during the 08:54:45
` break, I'll review it, and then we can turn 08:54:48
`
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`Page 21
` back and then ask you some more questions about 08:54:50
` the supplemental. 08:54:53
` A. Okay. 08:54:55
` Q. I mean the errata or however you 08:54:56
` want to refer to it. 08:54:59
` So other than this errata, when you 08:55:07
` were reviewing your original declaration, was 08:55:10
` there anything else you wanted to correct? 08:55:11
` A. Well, I didn't provide any 08:55:16
` additional corrections, but I -- as I stated 08:55:19
` before, there are sentences that could be 08:55:24
` clarified or reworded slightly, and I thought 08:55:27
` that if and when we end up discussing that part 08:55:32
` of my declaration, should we get there, that I 08:55:35
` could clarify those at the time, if needed. 08:55:39
` Q. I think we can go ahead and mark the 08:56:05
` references just so that you have these in front 08:56:07
` of you as well. 08:56:10
` A. Sure. 08:56:11
` MS. KORDZIEL: We can mark this as 08:56:22
` Exhibit Number 3, and this is the 08:56:24
` United States Patent 7,559,388. 08:56:27
` (DEPOSITION EXHIBIT 3 MARKED 08:56:42
` FOR IDENTIFICATION at 8:56 a.m.) 08:56:44
` MS. KORDZIEL: And we can mark this 08:56:44
`
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`Page 22
` Exhibit Number 4, and it's Ford Exhibit 08:56:50
` Number 1003, and it's US Patent Number 08:56:55
` 5,586,613 to Ehsani. 08:56:59
` (DEPOSITION EXHIBIT 4 MARKED 08:57:24
` FOR IDENTIFICATION at 8:57 a.m.) 08:57:27
` MS. KORDZIEL: And then we can mark 08:57:27
` this as Exhibit Number 5. This is US 08:57:29
` Patent Number 4,335,429 to Kawakatsu and 08:57:32
` it's Ford Exhibit Number 1004. 08:57:37
` (DEPOSITION EXHIBIT 5 MARKED 08:57:37
` FOR IDENTIFICATION at 8:57 a.m.) 08:57:42
` A. You gave me three copies of Exhibit 08:57:42
` Number 4. 08:57:45
` Q. One should be for your counsel 08:57:47
` there. 08:57:49
` A. I'm sorry. 08:57:49
` MS. KORDZIEL: Then I want to mark 08:58:05
` this as Exhibit Number 6, which is Ford 08:58:08
` Exhibit Number 1005. I'll refer to as 08:58:11
` Vittone. 08:58:20
` (DEPOSITION EXHIBIT 6 MARKED 08:58:37
` FOR IDENTIFICATION at 8:58 a.m.) 08:58:38
` MS. KORDZIEL: And if you can mark 08:58:38
` this as Exhibit Number 7, and it's Ford 08:58:40
` Exhibit Number 1006, Caraceni. 08:58:43
`
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` (DEPOSITION EXHIBIT 7 MARKED 08:58:48
` FOR IDENTIFICATION at 8:58 a.m.) 08:59:04
` MS. KORDZIEL: And then if you can 08:59:04
` mark this as Exhibit Number 8, it's Ford 08:59:05
` Exhibit Number 1007. It's US Patent Number
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