Transcript of STEPHEN GRAY
`
`Date: June 25, 2014
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`Case: GOOGLE, INC. v. B.E. TECHNOLOGY, L.L.C.
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`Planet Depos
`Phone: 888-433-3767
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`Internet: www.planetdepos.com
`
`Court Reporting | Videography | Videoconferencing | Interpretation | Transcription
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 1
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`
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`Date: June 25, 2014
`
`Case: GOOGLE, INC. v. B.E. TECHNOLOGY, L.L.C.
`
`Planet Depos
`Phone: 888-433-3767
`Fax: 888-503-3767
`Email: transcripts@planetdepos.com
`Internet: www.planetdepos.com
`
`Court Reporting | Videography | Videoconferencing | Interpretation | Transcription
`
`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 1
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`1
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` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
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` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
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`------------------------x
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`GOOGLE INC. :
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` Petitioner : Case No.: IPR2014-00031
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` v. : IPR2014-00033
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`B.E. TECHNOLOGY, L.L.C. : IPR2014-00038
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` Patent Owner : Patent 6,771,290
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`------------------------x 6,628,314
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` Deposition of STEPHEN GRAY
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` Palo Alto, California
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` Wednesday, June 25, 2014
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` 10:09 a.m.
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`
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`Job No.: 61024
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`Pages: 1 - 225
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`Reported by: Rebecca L. Romano, RPR, CSR No. 12546
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 2
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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` Deposition of STEPHEN GRAY, held at the
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`offices of:
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`2
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` MAYER BROWN, LLP
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` Two Palo Alto Square
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` Suite 300
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` Palo Alto, California 94306
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` (650) 331-2000
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` Pursuant to Notice, before Rebecca L. Romano,
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`Registered Professional Reporter and Certified
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`Shorthand Reporter in and for the state of California.
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 3
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`3
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` A P P E A R A N C E S
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` ON BEHALF OF PETITIONER:
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` BRIAN A. ROSENTHAL, ESQUIER
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` JOHN X. ZHU, ESQUIRE
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` MAYER BROWN, LLP
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` 1999 K Street, NW
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` Washington, DC 20006
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` (202) 263-3446
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` ON BEHALF OF PATENT OWNER:
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` ROBERT E. FREITAS, ESQUIRE
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` JESSICA N. LEAL, ESQUIRE
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` FREITAS ANGELL & WEINBERG LLP
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` 350 Marina Parkway, Suite 200
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` Redwood Shores, California 94065
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` (650) 730-5527
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` ALSO PRESENT:
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` Victor Hsue, Google In-house Counsel
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 4
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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` C O N T E N T S
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`EXAMINATION OF STEPHEN GRAY PAGE
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` By Mr. Freitas 6
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`4
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` E X H I B I T S
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` (Attached to transcript)
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`PREVIOUSLY MARKED GRAY DEPOSITION EXHIBIT PAGE
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`Exhibit 9 Paper 185
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`Exhibit 1001 Google 145
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`Exhibit 1002 Google 106
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`Exhibit 1004 Google 21
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`Exhibit 1013 Google 8
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 5
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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` Palo Alto, California, Wednesday, June 25, 2014
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`5
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` 10:09 a.m.
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` ---o0o---
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` STEPHEN GRAY,
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`having been administered an oath, was examined and
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`testified as follows:
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` CROSS-EXAMINATION
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`BY MR. FREITAS:
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` Q. Good morning, Mr. Gray.
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` A. Good morning.
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` Q. Mr. Gray, you have been retained as an expert
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`by Google in three inter partes reviews, right?
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` A. That's correct.
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` Q. And those inter partes reviews involve the
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`B.E. Technology '314 and '290 patents, correct?
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` A. That's correct, as well.
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` Q. And in IPR2014-0038, trial has been
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`instituted regarding the '314 patent, based on a
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`contention that U.S. Patent 5,721,827, issued to Logan
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`and others, anticipates certain claims of the
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`'314 patent, and a claim 15 of the '314 patent would
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`have been obvious?
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` Based on Logan and a patent issued to
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`Robinson, right?
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` A. I believe all that's correct, yes.
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 6
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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` Q. Okay. And there's two other IPRs. One of
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`them involves the '314 patent and a contention
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`6
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`regarding Foley that's number 0033?
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` MR. ROSENTHAL: You misspoke.
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` MR. FREITAS: Sorry.
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` THE DEPONENT: I don't think it's 314.
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` MR. FREITAS: Oh, I am sorry. '290.
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` THE DEPONENT: I lost the question.
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` Q. (By Mr. Freitas) Okay. The No. 33 involves
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`the '290 patent and --
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` A. Okay.
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` Q. -- and Foley?
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` A. The two -- yeah, I think Foley has been
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`identified as a -- as a reference regarding the '290
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`patent.
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` Q. All right. And then the last one,
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`No. 312014-0031 involves the '290 patent and a
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`contention regarding the Kikinis reference, right?
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` A. That's correct, as well.
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` Q. And you are an expert for Google in all three
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`of those proceedings?
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` A. I have been retained by Google in all three
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`of those proceedings, yes, that's correct.
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` Q. Okay. The way we are going to do things
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`today is I will address the 0038 Logan and Robinson,
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 7
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`and Ms. Leal will take care of the rest.
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` A. Okay.
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` Q. Mr. Gray, you graduated from California State
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`Polytechnic University with a bachelor's degree in
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`economics in 1973, right?
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` A. That's correct.
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` Q. And which Cal-Poly?
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` A. San Luis Obispo.
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` Q. Do you hold any other degrees?
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` A. I do not.
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` Q. Have you undertaken any other formal course
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`of study at a university?
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` A. No, I have not.
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` Q. You do not have a degree in computer science
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`or computer engineering or electrical engineering,
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`right?
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` A. That's correct.
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` Q. And you don't have a degree in advertising or
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`marketing, or any other business-related degree,
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`correct?
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` A. Well, my undergraduate degree is in
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`economics. I don't know if that's a business-related
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`degree or not.
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` Q. Okay.
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` A. I'm not quite sure what meaning you are
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 8
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`giving to business-related --
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` Q. All right. You don't have a marketing degree
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`or an advertising degree?
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` A. I don't have a degree in either marketing or
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`advertising.
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` Q. All right. Let's -- let's take a look at
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`what has been marked in the 0038 proceeding as
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`Exhibit 1013, which is a copy of your CV.
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` MR. FREITAS: It's already marked.
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` MR. ROSENTHAL: It's got a designation from
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`the submission.
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` THE DEPONENT: This designation here from the
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`submission. Got it.
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` Q. (By Mr. Freitas) Mr. Gray, your CV indicates
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`that you have been associated with Gray & Yorg since
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`1984, right?
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` A. That's correct. Yeah, the -- Gray & Yorg is
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`the name of the firm now. But in 1984, it was named
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`Stephen L. Gray Corporation. But it moved from that to
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`Gray & Yorg sometime around 1990.
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` Q. Okay. That's the -- that's your consulting
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`business, right?
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` A. That's correct.
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` Q. During those years; that is, the years from
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`1984 to the present, you have also been employed by a
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 9
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`few companies, right?
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` A. I have.
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` Q. And has your consulting work, on behalf of
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`Gray & Yorg been continuous since -- Gray & Yorg, with
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`all of its different names, has it been continuous
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`since 1984?
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` A. I'm not exactly sure what you mean by
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`"continuous." I -- it -- I mean, I have always --
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`Gray & Yorg has never been, as a corporate entity,
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`suspended or closed or shut down, or any of those
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`things.
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` It is not clear to me that since 1984 I have
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`always had a project that was necessarily active that
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`would be a Gray & Yorg related project. But throughout
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`that period, since 1984 till present, Gray & Yorg and
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`its predecessors have always been active corporations
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`and I -- and then for the vast majority of that time I
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`would have had active projects.
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` Q. Okay. Look on page 3 of Exhibit 1013,
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`please. It is indicated there that in 2001 and 2002
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`you worked at Networld Exchange, Incorporated. And in
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`2000 and 2001, you worked at NTN Communications, right?
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` A. That's correct.
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` Q. During the time that you were employed at
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`those companies, were you engaging in consulting
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 10
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`10
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`through Gray & Yorg?
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` A. In both -- in -- while I was employed an as
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`employee of Networld Exchange, Incorporated, and
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`NTN Communications, my best recollection is that I was
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`also active in Gray & Yorg during those -- during that
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`time.
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` Q. Okay. How many people work at Gray & Yorg?
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` A. Two, at the moment.
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` Q. Gray & Yorg?
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` A. Gray & Yorg.
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` Q. Okay. What kind of work does Gray & Yorg do?
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` A. It's a technology consulting firm.
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`Basically, advising clients on a variety of different
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`technology-related areas.
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` Q. And your CV provides examples of the
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`consulting that Gray & Yorg has provided?
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` A. I think it's fair, yeah. This -- this CV
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`provides examples of consulting assignments that I --
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`that I have had had. This CV is -- is an optimization,
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`obviously. But, yes, it presents both examples of
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`consulting assignments that I have had, as well as
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`employment relationships that I have had over time.
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` Q. Okay. If I'm interpreting your CV correctly,
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`between 1988 and 2000, you were not employed, other
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`than at Gray & Yorg; is that correct?
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 11
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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` A. That is correct. I was not an employee of
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`any other company between 1988 and 2000. That's
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`accurate.
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` Q. So during that time, all of your professional
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`activity was consulting through Gray & Yorg, correct?
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` A. Well, all -- all of my consulting work was
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`done through Gray & Yorg. I wouldn't go so far as to
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`say all my professional activity was necessarily
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`through Gray & Yorg, but my -- the consulting work that
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`I did was through Gray & Yorg.
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` Q. What other professional activity, during
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`those years -- in what other professional activity did
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`you engage?
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` A. During that time, and before and after, I
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`have assisted small companies in forming their
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`corporations or in providing access or providing
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`management -- temporary management help to different
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`companies.
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` And that hasn't always has been through
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`Gray & Yorg. It has sometimes been on my -- on a
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`personal -- personal level, but a lot of it has also
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`been in Gray & Yorg, as well.
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` So I'm distinguishing the consulting work
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`done at Gray & Yorg from the other professional
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`activities that I have that is outside Gray & Yorg
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 12
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`during that period.
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` Q. Between 1988 and 2000, how much of your time
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`was spent on Gray & Yorg work as opposed to other work?
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` A. I would think that probably -- again, I'm
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`just -- it's an educated estimation here. I have never
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`calculated that or haven't gone back to actually do
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`that analysis, but my sense is that two-thirds of -- of
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`my professional activities during the period 1988 --
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`between 1988 and 2000, probably two-thirds to
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`three-quarters of my activity was related to
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`Gray & Yorg. The rest of it being personal work that I
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`have done outside of Gray & Yorg.
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` Q. How about since then?
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` A. Since when?
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` Q. Since 2000 -- or in and after 2000.
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` A. Well, in around 2000 is when I became an
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`employee of NTN Communications. So are you asking me
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`how much of my -- how much of my work was -- how much
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`activity in my professional work -- you ask the
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`question. I don't know exactly what you mean.
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` Q. All right. So excluding 2000, 2001 and
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`2002 --
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` A. Okay.
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` Q. -- what percentage of the work that you have
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`done between -- well, I'll just ask it differently.
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 13
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`I'll withdraw that.
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` A. Okay.
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` Q. In and after 2003, what percentage of your
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`professional activity has been through Gray & Yorg?
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` A. Upwards -- I would say almost all of my
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`consulting work has been done through Gray & Yorg since
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`2002.
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` Q. In your CV, Exhibit 1013, are there any
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`examples of the work that you have done outside of
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`Gray & Yorg?
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` And I mean during -- during the period
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`starting in 1988. Excuse me.
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` MR. ROSENTHAL: I am sorry, do you mean to
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`exclude the jobs -- you mean to exclude the employment?
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` MR. FREITAS: Okay. I will withdraw the
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`question ask a different one.
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` Q. (By Mr. Freitas) Does your CV contain any
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`examples of work, consulting work that you have
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`performed outside of Gray & Yorg since 1988?
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` And I'm not asking you about your employment
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`in 2000, 2001 and 2002.
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` A. Well, it is -- it is actually sort of
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`complicated, I suppose. Let me give you an example and
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`see if this is responsive to what you are asking me
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`about.
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 14
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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` Q. Okay.
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` A. The third bullet down on page 1 of
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`Exhibit 1013, describes an activity that is identified
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`in the CV as CSO for a business process management
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`software start-up, firm develops Web services,
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`SOA-based BPM creation, orchestration, management and
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`optimization solutions.
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` That was consulting work that I alluded to
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`earlier that was done in relation to -- to a start-up.
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`I was compensated for that work through stock in that
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`company, as opposed to being compensated for money.
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` But -- but it -- so it's not clear to me is
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`that part of Gray & Yorg or is that outside of
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`Gray & Yorg. I guess I would include it as part of
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`Gray & Yorg. I was only working for Gray & Yorg. I
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`was not employed by the company. I suppose that falls
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`under the umbrella of Gray & Yorg. That's an example.
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` Having said that, there are probably other
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`examples in here that fall into that same category
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`where I was working for stock or some other kind of
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`compensation that wasn't necessarily being held by
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`Gray & Yorg. But the work probably was -- would fall
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`under that sort of gray area in and Gray & Yorg and
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`personal work, I suppose.
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` Q. With all that understood, are there any items
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`B.E. Technology, L.L.C. - Exhibit 2003, Page 15
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`you can identify as being consulting work as opposed to
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`employment that you provided outside of Gray & Yorg?
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` A. So the courses that I -- sorry.
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` On page 5 of Exhibit 1013, under the heading
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`"Additional Professional Experience," the work -- the
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`third bullet from the bottom says, "Developed and
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`presented numerous public and in-house courses in IBM,
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`UNIX, Internet and related networking technologies."
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` That work -- some of that work was done since
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`1988. And some of that work would not have necessarily
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`flowed through Gray & Yorg. These are the -- these are
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`courses that I taught during that period.
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` Q. Are you able to give any specific examples of
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`work that was not through Gray & Yorg?
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` A. That -- that would that -- that is what that
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`was.
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` Q. I understand. But you said "courses," you
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`said "public and in-house."
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` Can you give me any specifics?
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` A. Oh, sure.
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` Q. A client, an event, a sponsor?
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` A. Sure. Bell Labs, for example. I taught
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`courses at Bell Labs. I taught courses at Phillips
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`Petroleum. I taught courses at Exxon, Mobil. Those
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`are in-house courses.
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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` I taught courses across the United States, in
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`Europe that were professional education courses in
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`networking and -- and systems technology and
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`architecture and software-related technologies. So
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`those are examples of work that I had done.
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` I can give you specific courses, if you would
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`like, if that's what you mean, if you want to go into
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`that level of detail I can tell you.
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` Q. When was the last time you taught a course at
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`Bell Labs?
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` A. Late '80s or early '90s.
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` Q. How about Phillips Petroleum, when was the
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`last time you taught a course there?
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` A. I would say probably in that same time frame,
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`late '80s, early '90s. Maybe -- let me -- let me think
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`about this just a second here. How long did I do those
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`courses.
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` So those are in-house courses -- yeah, let me
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`broaden it a little bit. Mid-'80s to mid-'90s would be
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`the time frame for those in-house courses. The public
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`courses were a little wider than that, but the in-house
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`courses were probably '85 to '95, just in that time
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`frame. I'm not -- yeah, I don't -- I don't remember
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`exactly, but that would roughly be the time frame.
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` Q. All of what you described in your CV as
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`in-house courses on page 5, between mid-'80s and
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`mid-'90s; is that right?
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` A. I think that's accurate. I don't recall,
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`sitting here right now, a course that I taught in-house
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`that would have been after -- oh, that's not true.
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`That's not true.
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` I taught a course for -- I can't remember who
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`the in-house class is. I would say the preponderance
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`of the courses that I taught, that were in-house
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`courses, were conducted between '85 and '95.
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` Q. And how many were not? How many were not in
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`that time frame?
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` A. How many in-house courses were not taught in
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`there?
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` Q. Yes, sir.
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` A. I don't recollect vividly how many there
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`were. A few. I mean, if -- you know, less than a half
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`a dozen.
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` Q. What about the public courses that you
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`mention on page 5 of your CV, when were those -- when
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`did those courses take place?
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` A. I first started teaching professional
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`education courses that were held -- that were -- that
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`we have referred to as public courses starting in -- it
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`would have been after I left Computer Communications in
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`1982, so it would have been while I was at Xerox.
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` So sometime after 1982, after having left
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`Computer Communications, I started teaching those
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`courses is my best recollection.
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` Q. And is there a point at which you stopped?
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` A. I don't recollect teaching any courses after
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`1998, 1999. I don't think I taught any after that.
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`I'm sure I haven't taught any after that.
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` Q. At this point, Mr. Gray, what percentage of
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`your work is litigation support?
`
` A. I know this isn't exactly the question you
`
`asked, but I may answer it this way and see if it's
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`responsive.
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` Of the consulting work that I do today,
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`70 percent, roughly, over the last five years has been
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`related to -- maybe 60 to 70 percent is related to
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`intellectual property litigation support.
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` Q. So there's about 30 percent of your work in
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`the last five years that is not litigation related; is
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`that what you are saying?
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` A. Right. The -- the -- let me say it -- yeah,
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`the 30 to 40 percent of my income from consulting over
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`the last five years probably comes from sources other
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`than intellectual property litigation support.
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` Q. If you answered by reference to the amount of
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`time you spent rather than the income you get, would
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`the answer be the same?
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` A. Yeah. Yeah, I think so. I think so.
`
` Q. On the first page of Exhibit 1013, there's a
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`19
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`heading "Expertise."
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` Do you see that?
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` A. I do.
`
` Q. That's where you list the fields in which you
`
`believe you have expert level knowledge as of today,
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`right?
`
` MR. ROSENTHAL: Objection. Lacks foundation.
`
` THE DEPONENT: So I don't know that I would
`
`necessarily say that. I don't know that I would use
`
`that term, per se. So, no, I don't think so.
`
` Q. (By Mr. Freitas) What -- what are you
`
`listing there under the heading "Expertise"?
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` MR. ROSENTHAL: Objection. Lacks foundation.
`
` THE DEPONENT: So I think -- maybe what I
`
`should do is explain.
`
` This particular CV, which was attached to my
`
`declaration -- declarations is produced by a company --
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`was produced by a company, Silicon Valley Expert
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`Witness Group, Inc. And it is the consultant's CV that
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`they produced, in which I -- so that's this CV.
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` That's not necessarily the CV that I would
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`20
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`offer if you asked me outside of Silicon Valley Expert
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`Witness Group what CV -- for my CV. It might be a
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`different CV. So this is a CV that they have produced.
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` Q. (By Mr. Freitas) Well --
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` A. So with respect to the -- the entry in the
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`expertise section of 1013, those are the areas that, in
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`consultation with me, they have identified as -- as
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`expertise that they would like to identify on my CV.
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` Q. Well, you reviewed the CV before they
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`provided it to others, right?
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` A. Yes.
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` Q. And you approved it?
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` A. I -- there's nothing in the CV that I object
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`to or that is incorrect, as best I -- the intention is
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`for everything in Exhibit 1013 to be accurate and
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`truthful and complete.
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` I -- if I looked at it again, I might find a
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`typo or something that was in error. But, no, I --
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`everything that is in here is something that I agree
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`with and concur. I don't -- there's nothing that I
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`know about that I would say is wrong or incorrect, or
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`misleading or anything.
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` Q. All right. Is it complete?
`
` A. Well, in what sense do you mean "complete"?
`
` Q. In fairly presenting your professional
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
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`background and experience and qualifications?
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` A. I think it is -- for the purposes -- the
`
`purposes for which Silicon Valley Expert Witness Group
`
`prepared this CV, I think it is accurate and -- and
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`complete with respect to what they intended to -- to
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`produce, yes.
`
` Q. Mr. Gray, I'm handing you a copy of
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`Exhibit 1004 from the 003 proceeding. And I previously
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`said that the CV that we were looking at was
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`Exhibit 1013 from the 38, and I believe I was wrong.
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`It's Exhibit 1019 in the 38.
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` Could you take a look at paragraph 9 of
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`Exhibit 1004?
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` MR. ROSENTHAL: Sorry. Can I just make the
`
`record clear? I wasn't exactly clear on what you said.
`
` You are saying that Exhibit -- the exhibit
`
`that is marked that the witness was testifying on
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`that's marked Google Exhibit 1013 is actually
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`Exhibit number --
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` MR. FREITAS: 1019.
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` MR. ROSENTHAL: 1019, 38.
`
` MR. FREITAS: And I say that based on
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`paragraph 9 of his declaration.
`
` MR. ROSENTHAL: Okay. Just to be the clear,
`
`the document the witness was looking at bears
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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`Google Exhibit 1013. If we want to be clear, I would
`
`suggest you put a sticker on it so we all know what we
`
`are talking about, but that's up to you.
`
` MR. FREITAS: I don't think that's necessary.
`
` MR. ROSENTHAL: Fine with me.
`
` THE DEPONENT: I think you asked me to turn
`
`to paragraph 9.
`
` Q. (By Mr. Freitas) Paragraph 9 on page 3,
`
`please.
`
` A. On page 6?
`
` Q. On page 3.
`
` A. Sorry. Page 3 of the declaration.
`
` Q. Typed page 3, exhibit page 6.
`
` A. Exactly. Fair enough.
`
` Q. There you say, "I have attached to this
`
`declaration a copy of my current curriculum vitae which
`
`details my education and experience, and a list of all
`
`other cases in which, during the previous four years, I
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`testified as an expert at trial or by definition."
`
` So in your declaration, you describe the CV
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`as your current CV, right?
`
` A. I -- the CV that I refer to here, I have
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`attached to this declaration a copy of my current
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`curriculum vitae, which details my education and
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`experience, yes.
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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` Q. You didn't qualify it by reference to having
`
`it be prepared by somebody else, or being done for any
`
`specific purpose.
`
` You just called it your current CV, right?
`
` A. I could have called it my only CV. I don't
`
`have -- I don't have another CV that I -- that I refer
`
`to. If you asked me to prepare a CV -- what I was
`
`trying to allude to earlier.
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` If you asked me to prepare a CV outside of
`
`Silicon Valley Expert Witness Group's CV, it might be
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`different. It might have different information on it.
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` This is the only -- Exhibit 1019, as well as
`
`Exhibit 1013, is the only CV that -- that I use --
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`well, is that true. Yes, it is.
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` It's the only CV that I use, except for the
`
`fact that occasionally the header is taken off. But
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`other than that, the CV -- the content of the CV, this
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`is the only one -- this is only one I use.
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` By the way, it's the only one that I use as
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`of the date that was printed here, which is 9/16/13.
`
` Q. Okay. When you say the "header," do you mean
`
`the box that says "Expertise" and has a series of
`
`bullets?
`
` A. No. Let me be clear. I --
`
` Q. The Silicon Expert Witness Group, Inc.,
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`Consulted Curriculum Vitae, is that the header?
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` A. That's the header that I'm referring to that
`
`heads the page, yeah. In some matters, the attorneys
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`would prefer that it not necessarily identify
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`Silicon Valley on that -- on that line. So I would
`
`remove that, but that would be -- it would be the same
`
`content. It just would not have Silicon Valley Expert
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`Witness Group as a header on there.
`
` Q. You participated in the preparation of the
`
`list -- the bulleted list that appears in the
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`"Expertise" box on the first page of your CV, didn't
`
`you?
`
` A. It was done so long ago, I don't remember
`
`vividly.
`
` My recollection is that the box identified as
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`"Expertise" was created by Silicon Valley Expert
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`Witness Group based upon a then -- it was originally
`
`produced by Silicon Valley Expert Witness Group, based
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`upon a then current CV of my own making that I had
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`given to them for the purposes of their -- of their
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`use.
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` So what they had -- my best recollection is
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`they took that and created the expertise themselves
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`derived from another CV that I used many, many years
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`ago.
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
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` Q. Okay. Did they submit this for your review,
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`this list -- this bulleted list of subject matter
`
`expertise?
`
` A. Well, I don't remember specifically whether
`
`or not they submitted this -- this one or not. But
`
`their general practice would be for any modifications
`
`that they make to the CV, independent of me, for me
`
`to -- they would ask me to take a look at it. But I
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`don't remember specifically whether they asked me to
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`look at it or not.
`
` Q. Okay. You didn't list advertising or
`
`Internet advertising or online advertising in the
`
`expertise, the bulleted list of subject matter
`
`expertise in your CV, did you, Mr. Gray?
`
` A. Well, again back to the point. I didn't list
`
`any of those things directly. So maybe you want to ask
`
`me a slightly different question.
`
` Q. Nobody listed advertising or Internet
`
`advertising or online advertising, right?
`
` A. So give me the list again.
`
` Q. You are looking at it.
`
` MR. ROSENTHAL: No, the list that you said.
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` THE DEPONENT: No, the list you just said you
`
`wanted me to compare to.
`
` Q. (By Mr. Freitas) Advertising, Internet
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`
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`DEPOSITION OF STEPHEN GRAY
`CONDUCTED ON WEDNESDAY, JUNE 25, 2014
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