In re: UNITED STATES PATENT
`AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
`YAMAHA CORPORATION OF AMERICA
`v.
`BLACK HILLS MEDIA, LLC
` ___________________________________________________
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR.
`May 30, 2014
`
` ___________________________________________________
`
`
`AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
`
`YAMAHA CORPORATION OF AMERICA
`v.
`BLACK HILLS MEDIA, LLC
` ___________________________________________________
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR.
`May 30, 2014
`
` ___________________________________________________
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 1
`
` UNITED STATES PATENT AND TRADEMARK OFFICE
` -------
` BEFORE THE PATENT TRIAL AND APPEAL BOARD
` -------
` YAMAHA CORPORATION OF AMERICA
` Petitioner
`
` vs.
` BLACK HILLS MEDIA, LLC
` Patent Owner
`
` -------
` Case No. IPR2013-00593
` US Patent 8,045,952
` Case No. IPR2013-00594
` US Patent 8,050,652
`
` VIDEO DEPOSITION OF
` V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR.
` BOSTON, MASSACHUSETTS
` FRIDAY, MAY 30, 2014
`
`REPORTED BY:
`DENISE D. HARPER-FORDE
`Certified Shorthand Reporter (CSR)
`Certified Real-Time Reporter (CRR)
`Registered Professional Reporter (RPR)
`Notary Public (CT, MA, RI)
`CSR No. 000133
`JOB NO.: 0124-249162
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 2
`
` May 30, 2014
`
` Video Deposition of V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR.,
`taken on behalf of the Patent Holder, at
`the law offices of PEPPER HAMILTON, LLP,
`125 High Street, Boston, Massachusetts, at
`10:00 A.M., Friday, May 30, 2014. Before
`Denise D. Harper-Forde, Certified Shorthand
`Reporter, Registered Professional Reporter,
`Certified Real-Time Reporter, and Notary
`Public of the State of Massachusetts.
`
`1 2 3 4 5 6
`
`7 8
`
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 3
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` A P P E A R A N C E S
`ON BEHALF OF THE PETITIONER:
` MORRISON & FOERSTER, LLP
` BY: ALEX S. YAP, ESQ.
` DAVID L. FEHRMAN, ESQ.
` 707 Wilshire Boulevard
` Los Angeles, California 90017-3543
` (213) 892-5683
` E-MAIL: ayap@mofo.com
` dfehrman@mofo.com
`
`
` ON BEHALF OF THE PATENT OWNER:
` PEPPER HAMILTON, LLP
` BY: THOMAS J. ENGELLENNER, ESQ.
` LANA A. GLADSTEIN, ESQ.
` ANDREW W. SCHULTZ, ESQ.
` 125 High Street
` 19th Floor, High Street Tower
` Boston, Massachusetts 02110-2736
` (617) 204-5189
` (800) 682-1447 (Fax)
` E-MAIL: engellennert@pepperlaw.com
` gladsteinl@pepperlaw.com
` schultza@pepperlaw.com
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 4
`
` I N D E X
`
` WITNESS: V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR.
`
` EXAMINATION PAGE
` By Mr. Engellenner 9, 175
` By Mr. Fehrman 151
`
` EXHIBITS
` NUMBER DESCRIPTION PAGE
`
` Exhibit 1 -- Deposition Notice 10
` Exhibit 2 -- '593 Declaration of
` Dr. Bove 11
` Exhibit 3 -- '593 Patent 11
` Exhibit 4 -- Initial '593 Decision 12
` Exhibit 5 -- '952 Patent 12
` Exhibit 6 -- Deposition Notice 12
` Exhibit 7 -- '594 Declaration 13
` Exhibit 8 -- '594 Decision 13
` Exhibit 9 -- '594 Patent 13
` Exhibit 10 -- '652 Patent 14
` Exhibit 11 -- '986 Patent 14
` Exhibit 12 -- '194 Patent 15
` Exhibit 13 -- '353 Patent 15
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 5
`
` I N D E X (CONT'D)
`
` WITNESS: V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR.
`
` EXHIBITS
` NUMBER DESCRIPTION PAGE
`
` Exhibit 14 -- Qureshey PCT
` Application 15
` Exhibit 15 -- '947 Patent 16
` Exhibit 16 -- '127 Patent 16
`
` * * * * * *
` VIDEOGRAPHER: Gayle Ashton
` ALSO PRESENT: Alicia Palladino
` (Summer Associate)
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 6
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` * * * * * *
` Boston, Massachusetts
` Friday, May 30, 2014
` 10:07 AM
` * * * * * *
` VIDEOGRAPHER: This is the video
` operator speaking, Gayle Ashton with
` Merrill Legal Solutions. Today's date is
` May 30th, 2014, and the time is 10:07 AM.
` We are here at the offices of
` Pepper Hamilton, located at 125 High
` Street, Boston, Massachusetts, to take the
` videotaped deposition of V. Michael Bove,
` Jr.
` This is a proceeding in the United
` States Patent and Trademark Office before
` The Patent Trial and Appeal Board. Yamaha
` Corporation of America, Petitioner versus
` Black Hills Media, LLC, patent owner. Case
` number IPR2013-00593, US Patent 8,045,952.
` And Case No. IPR2013-00594, US Patent
` 8,050,652.
` Will counsel please state their
` appearances.
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Tom Engellenner,
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 7
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` Pepper Hamilton, attorney for the Black
` Hills Media, patent owner.
` MS. GLADSTEIN: Lana Gladstein of
` Pepper Hamilton, representing Black Hills
` Media.
` MR. SCHULTZ: Andrew Schultz of
` Pepper Hamilton, Black Hills Media.
` MR. YAP: If you can introduce --
` MR. ENGELLENNER: If you don't
` mind, I'd like to introduce our expert,
` Ivan Zackovich. And we have a second-year
` law student that's just sitting in for
` observation, if you don't mind.
` MR. YAP: No problem.
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Thanks.
` MR. YAP: Alex Yap of Morrison &
` Foerster for Petitioner, Yamaha Corporation
` of America.
` MR. FEHRMAN: David Fehrman,
` Morrison & Foerster for the Yamaha
` Corporation of America.
` MR. YAP: So, Counsel, I think
` before the deposition started we reached a
` stipulation that for these four
` proceedings, depositions in these four
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 8
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` proceedings, the witnesses would have the
` right to review and revise the transcript
` under the rules.
` MR. ENGELLENNER: And I believe we
` also stipulated that this deposition will
` be used in both the -- two enter parties
` review proceedings. 2014-593 and 2014 --
` '13, excuse me. 2013-593 and '594.
` MR. YAP: Yes.
` MR. ENGELLENNER: And hopefully we
` can just refer to these two proceedings as
` '593 and '594 throughout the day.
` I think we also stipulated that as
` to common issues, testimony that was given
` today and yesterday can be used
` interchangeably in the two cases.
` Is that your understanding?
` MR. FEHRMAN: I'm not sure we know
` what a common issue is necessarily. There
` is some overlapping references.
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Overlapping
` references and credentials. So that we
` don't need to go through a full --
` MR. FEHRMAN: Certainly with
` credentials.
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 9
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` MR. ENGELLENNER: -- investigation
` of Dr. Bove's credentials.
` MR. YAP: Yeah. My understanding
` was the credentials from yesterday but I
` wasn't quite aware that there was an
` understanding regarding common issues.
` I guess it depends on what that
` common issue is.
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Okay.
` MR. YAP: And we can fight over
` that later.
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Okay.
` VIDEOGRAPHER: Will the Court
` Reporter please swear in the witness.
` * * * * * *
` V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR., hereinbefore
` named, being first duly cautioned and sworn
` or affirmed to tell the truth, the whole
` truth, and nothing but the truth, was
` examined and testified as follows:
` * * * * * *
` DIRECT EXAMINATION
` (BY MR. ENGELLENNER):
` Q. Dr. Bove, I'd like to thank you for
` agreeing to sit through depositions two
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 10
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` days in a row, and I know yesterday was a
` rather grueling day. And hopefully today
` will be shorter.
` A. Thank you.
` Q. And we'll follow the same procedure
` as yesterday. We'll break every hour. If
` you need a break, though, at any time, just
` please let me know. If you could just
` answer the question before you and allow me
` just any follow-up for that particular line
` of questioning, I would appreciate it and
` then we'll break.
` Is that okay with you?
` A. Yes. Thank you very much.
` Q. Great. And is there any reason why
` you cannot testify fully and accurately
` today?
` A. No.
` Q. Thank you. I'm going to show you a
` series of documents, and we're going to
` have them marked as exhibits, and then we
` can begin the deposition.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 1,
` Deposition Notice, was marked for
` identification)
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 11
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` MR. ENGELLENNER: The first Exhibit
` is the deposition notice from the '593
` proceeding.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 2, '593
` Declaration of Dr. Bove, was
` marked for identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: The second
` Exhibit is, I believe it's your declaration
` from the '593 proceeding. I'd like you to
` look at it and just verify that.
` MR. YAP: Counsel, what exhibit
` number is this?
` MR. ENGELLENNER: That's Exhibit 2.
` MR. YAP: Okay.
` (BY MR. ENGELLENNER):
` Q. And on the last page before the
` appendix, that is your signature;
` correct?
` A. Yes.
` Q. Thank you.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 3, '593
` Petition, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: The third exhibit
` is the petition that was filed by Yamaha in
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 12
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` the '593 proceeding.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 4, Initial
` '593 Decision, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: The fourth
` exhibit I'd like to show you is the initial
` decision of the Patent Trial and Appeal
` Board to institute a proceeding that we're
` referring to throughout here as the '593
` proceeding.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 5, '952
` Patent, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Finally, to round
` out this '593 proceeding, I'd like to show
` you a copy of the US Patent 8,045,952;
` which is the Patent at issue in this
` proceeding; is that correct?
` THE WITNESS: That's my
` understanding. Thank you.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 6,
` Deposition Notice, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Okay. Just to
` get everything out of the way, I'd also
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 13
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` like to show you the Deposition Notice from
` the second proceeding that we're going to
` be discussing about today, and that would
` be Exhibit Number 6.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 7, '594
` Declaration, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: And I'd like to
` show you Exhibit Number 7, which is, I
` believe, your declaration from the '594
` proceeding.
` And if you could just verify that
` that is indeed your signature on the last
` page before the appendix of that
` declaration as well, I'd appreciate it.
` THE WITNESS: Yes.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 8, '594
` Petition, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Thank you. I'm
` going to show you Exhibit 8, which is the
` petition that was filed by Yamaha in
` connection with the '594 proceeding.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 9, '594
` Decision, was marked for
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 14
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: And next Exhibit
` 9, which is the decision of the Patent
` Trial and Appeal Board to institute a
` review proceeding that we'll be referring
` to throughout as the '594 proceeding.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 10, '652
` Patent, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: And Exhibit 10 is
` US Patent 8,050,652, which is the Qureshey
` Patent, which is the subject matter of the
` '954 -- excuse me, the '594 proceeding.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 11, '986
` Patent, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Exhibit 11 is US
` Patent 8,010,986, which I believe is a
` patent that names you as an inventor.
` And when you get a chance, if you
` could just review that and confirm that
` that is indeed a patent that you are an
` inventor of?
` THE WITNESS: Yes, it is.
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Thank you.
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 15
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 12, '194
` Patent, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Exhibit 12 is US
` Patent 6,502,194, issued to Berman, et al.
` And hopefully we'll be able to refer to
` this throughout the proceedings as the
` Berman Patent.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 13, '353
` Patent, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Exhibit 13 is US
` Patent 7,472,353 issued to Wolff, et al.
` And we'll refer to this, if you don't mind,
` as the Wolff Patent.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 14,
` Qureshey PCT Application, was
` marked for identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Exhibit 14 is an
` International Patent Application,
` publication number WO-99/38266, filed by
` Qureshey.
` And if you don't mind, we'll refer
` to that throughout as the Qureshey Patent,
` or would you prefer the --
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 16
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` THE WITNESS: That may cause a
` little bit of confusion, because it's not
` the only Qureshey document we're going to
` be discussing today.
` MR. ENGELLENNER: I understand. So
` maybe we can refer to it as the Qureshey --
` THE WITNESS: Application?
` MR. ENGELLENNER: PCT application.
` Okay?
` THE WITNESS: Or Qureshey PCT
` Application.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 15, '947
` Patent, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Exhibit 15 is US
` Patent 7,187,947 issued to White, et al.
` And again, if you don't mind, we'll just
` refer to this as the White Patent.
` (Whereupon, Exhibit No. 16, '127
` Patent, was marked for
` identification)
` MR. ENGELLENNER: Exhibit 16 is US
` Patent 6,587,127, issued to Leeke,
` L-E-E-K-E, et al. And if you don't mind,
` we'll refer to this as the Leeke Patent.
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 17
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` THE WITNESS: Might I just, since
` we're talking about what we're going to be
` calling various documents, in order to
` avoid confusion, I may be referring to the
` documents associated -- let's say the
` declaration, the petition, and the decision
` associated with the '652 Patent as the '652
` declaration, the '652 petition, and the
` '652 decision; rather than referring to the
` '594; and similarly for '952.
` MR. ENGELLENNER: That's fine.
` (BY MR. ENGELLENNER):
` Q. Now, you were -- forgive me for
` asking some leading questions. I'm going
` to try and summarize the discussions and
` questioning from yesterday.
` You were retained by Yamaha or its
` counsel as an expert in both the '593 and
` the '594 proceedings?
` A. Yes.
` Q. And that would be the proceedings
` on the Patents '652 and '952?
` A. Yes.
` Q. Okay. And I believe you testified
` yesterday that you served as an expert in
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 18
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` patent proceedings before; is that
` correct?
` A. Yes.
` Q. And your C.V. lists over a dozen
` expert witness engagements in patent
` litigation going back to 1997; correct?
` A. Going back to the 1990s, yes.
` Q. Okay. And I believe you also
` testified that you've been deposed perhaps
` 20 times in the past in connection with
` your role in patent litigation?
` A. Somewhere around that many times.
` Q. Okay. And normally were you on one
` side or the other of patent disputes? Are
` you typically asked to serve as an expert
` by a Defendant in patent litigation, and
` seeking to have an opinion in validating
` the patent, or is it both ways?
` A. It's probably about 50/50 over the
` years.
` Q. Any examples of defending a patent
` that come to mind?
` A. Let me see if there are any
` examples in the C.V. attached to my
` declaration.
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 19
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` A recent example would have been
` expert witness work I did on behalf of
` Funai at the International Trade
` Commission.
` Q. And so you were retained to assist
` the patent owner?
` A. Yes.
` Q. Okay. Thank you. And I believe
` you testified yesterday that you devoted
` 29.25 hours from August 6th through
` September 30th in preparing your expert
` reports on both of the proceedings we're
` talking about today, as well as the two
` proceedings that we talked about
` yesterday?
` A. Yes.
` Q. And so that's roughly seven and a
` half hours per case; correct?
` A. Well, some of the work that I did
` might have applied to more than one case at
` any given time. And the declarations are
` varying lengths.
` So I may have spent more time
` writing one declaration than another. If
` one wanted to compute an average, I suppose
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 20
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` one could.
` Q. And in each of the proceedings, you
` reviewed the patent, certain prior art, you
` formulated opinions, and you wrote a
` report; correct?
` A. A declaration, yes.
` Q. Declaration. And you wrote these
` expert declarations yourself; correct?
` A. Except for the front matter.
` Q. The front matter?
` A. So in each of these declarations
` it's obviously a cover page that I didn't
` generate. I also have been -- I was
` provided information. I was provided
` language to put into things like the
` definitions and standards section of each.
` But the parts where I actually discuss my
` opinions, I authored.
` Q. I understand. Thank you. And I
` believe you testified yesterday that the
` prior art you considered in formulating
` your opinions as to the state of the art
` were essentially the patents that were
` referenced in your report, and your general
` knowledge; is that correct?
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 21
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` MR. YAP: Objection.
` Mischaracterizes.
` THE WITNESS: I would say if we
` include all of the patents and all of the
` documents that were supplied as appendices
` to Yamaha's petitions among that as well.
` I certainly reviewed prior art that
` might not have made its way into any of
` these documents, but I did not rely on that
` prior art in formulating these opinions.
` (BY MR. ENGELLENNER):
` Q. So do you have any recollection of
` this other contemporaneous or contemporary
` prior art?
` And by that I mean, you know, prior
` art that you looked at that was in the
` public domain before, say, 2000 that did
` not find its way into either the Yamaha
` petitions or your expert declarations?
` A. Well, the process involved the
` Yamaha's counsel doing a search, my doing a
` search. The result of that was a pool of
` references, which was larger than we could
` use.
` I don't have specific references
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 22
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` that I can cite right now that came up in
` the search that are not somewhere cited in
` something, but I don't doubt that there are
` such references.
` Q. And I believe you testified
` yesterday that as part of your services as
` an expert, you reviewed the petitions that
` were drafted by Yamaha's attorneys in these
` four proceedings; is that correct?
` A. Yes.
` Q. And you reviewed the claims charts
` that they drafted; correct?
` A. I reviewed --
` MR. YAP: Objection. Form.
` THE WITNESS: I reviewed the
` petitions, including the claim charts and
` the appendices.
` (BY MR. ENGELLENNER):
` Q. And I believe you testified that
` you didn't recall making any changes to the
` claims charts?
` A. I don't recall suggesting any
` changes to the claims charts.
` Q. Just to be clear, the claim charts
` were drafted by Yamaha's attorneys?
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 23
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` A. Yes.
` Q. And to the extent that your
` opinions or your expert declarations
` reference these claim charts, were you
` essentially adopting the attorneys'
` arguments as to the claim charts?
` A. Well, I had discussions with the
` attorneys prior to and presumably during
` the preparation of those claim charts. So
` we had discussions about various pieces of
` art.
` And it may be more correct to say
` that our opinions converged, and the result
` is what I provide opinions about in my
` declarations.
` Q. And so besides the references to
` the claim charts, your opinion's also
` amplified in some respects in the
` declarations; is that correct?
` A. Well, I provide opinions regarding
` the claim charts, and I provide opinions
` regarding things that are not in the claim
` charts. Which I believe Yamaha then
` references my declaration in their petition
` in support of those arguments.
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 24
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` Q. Now, your C.V. suggests that you've
` been at MIT for virtually your entire adult
` life as a student, and as a teacher, and as
` a researcher.
` Is that a fair characterization?
` A. Yes.
` Q. And you've never worked in industry
` full time?
` A. Well, I had summer jobs in
` industry, but -- I have been involved in
` industry throughout that period, but not --
` not full time.
` Q. And you've consulted on technical
` matters?
` A. Yes.
` Q. And have you ever consulted for a
` music company in the area of network
` media?
` A. Not that I recall.
` Q. And have you ever consulted
` specifically in the field of music file
` sharing?
` A. Not that I recall. Except to the
` degree, as I noted yesterday, that it's
` possible to do a form of music file sharing
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 25
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` on the P.C. laptop; which I was involved
` in.
` Q. And I believe you testified
` yesterday the major -- one of the major
` areas of research, your research at MIT,
` has been the field of interactive TV; is
` that correct?
` A. Yes.
` Q. Could you sort of just explain for
` me what interactive TV is?
` A. Well, it's a somewhat flexible
` definition. But one of the ways to think
` about it is that it's television
` programming that has degrees of freedom in
` it that respond to user inputs.
` And so while watching a television
` program, one might press a button on a
` remote control, or touch a touch-screen, or
` speak a voice command that performs some
` other action, and the result of that will
` be an augmentation or modification of how
` the material is presented or what material
` is presented.
` Q. I'm not an abstract thinker, so I'm
` trying to think about what this actually
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 26
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` means.
` If I was watching, you know, the
` Fox channel, and I watched the Fox News,
` and then I watched Modern Family, and then
` a Bart Simpson rerun, what would
` interactive TV provide me?
` A. Well, I'll use two specific
` examples that we actually worked on. And
` one of them was a television program we did
` with Julia Child; who formerly resided in
` Cambridge, and with WGBH Television.
` Where it was a cooking program that
` was in the form of a dinner party hosted by
` Julia Child. And Julia would bring out
` each one of the dishes and serve them to
` the guests.
` The user, by means of a touch
` screen or another pointing device, could
` select a dish and then the program would
` expand to include Julia describing the
` preparation of the dish.
` Or an interview of the line, or
` some other piece of ancillary information
` so that one could, simply by touching or
` selecting items in the video, which were
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 27
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` hyperlinks, change the presentation to
` include additional material of interest.
` Another example we did was a
` television soap opera where all of the
` clothing, all of the furnishings, all of
` the props were items from the JC Penney
` catalog.
` And the user while watching the
` program, could select any of the items,
` find out more information about them, and
` do a one-click purchase.
` Q. Okay. When you're showing this
` supplemental content, this recipe or
` something for Julia Child, what's happening
` to the TV program itself?
` A. Well, that particular example was
` not meant to work with a live stream. That
` would work with something that was either
` on demand or on a PVR, like a Tivo.
` So that there was recorded
` material, but different viewers might
` traverse the material differently, and some
` might see more of it, and some might see
` less of it.
` In other cases, it might simply be
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 28
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` graphical overlays. So the JC Penney
` example was all done by putting graphic,
` still or video graphic, overlays on top of
` the action, while the action proceeded.
` Q. While the media proceeded. Okay.
` I'd like to just refer you to what
` we've marked as Exhibit 11, which I believe
` is your patent.
` Now, does this have to do with
` interactive TV also?
` A. Yes.
` Q. Could you sort of just give me a
` thumbnail sketch of what problem this
` patent is solving?
` A. This is one of a family of patents.
` So I want to read this to determine which
` one it is.
` Okay. This patent is associated
` with solving the problem of how to
` distribute interactive television content
` given existing distribution mechanisms for
` television, such as satellite and cable.
` And the problem that we faced --
` and this was work that was done at
` Watchpoint Media, a start-up company that
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 29
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` spun out of my research group, the IP is
` now owned by Ericsson Television.
` The problem we were trying to solve
` is that an interactive television program
` has multiple pieces. So first of all,
` there was the video or the audio akin to a
` non-interactive television program.
` There was also the information that
` makes the program an interactive; which
` might be things like menus, graphics,
` additional videos, additional audio
` content. It might be metadata describing
` all of those elements. It might be
` synchronization information. It might even
` be pieces of computer software that are
` evaluated by the receiver in response to
` user actions.
` In order to allow a user sitting in
` front of a television or other device to
` interact with the television broadcast,
` both the standard content and the
` interactive information need to arrive.
` And ideally they need to arrive in
` relatively close synchronization.
` If the interaction information
`
`800-292-4789
`
`MERRILL DEPOSITION SERVICES
`www.deposition.com/washington-dc.htm
`
`
`
`V. MICHAEL BOVE, JR. - 5/30/2014
`
`Page 30
`
`1
`2
`3
`4
`5
`6
`7
`8
`9
`10
`11
`12
`13
`14
`15
`16
`17
`18
`19
`20
`21
`22
`23
`24
`25
`
` arrives too late, then one clicks the
` button and nothing happens because the
` information associated with that hasn't
` arrived yet.
`
Accessing this document will incur an additional charge of $.
After purchase, you can access this document again without charge.
Accept $ Charge
Still Working On It
This document is taking longer than usual to download. This can happen if we need to contact the court directly to obtain the document and their servers are running slowly.
Give it another minute or two to complete, and then try the refresh button.
A few More Minutes ... Still Working
It can take up to 5 minutes for us to download a document if the court servers are running slowly.
Thank you for your continued patience.
This document could not be displayed.
We could not find this document within its docket. Please go back to the docket page and check the link. If that does not work, go back to the docket and refresh it to pull the newest information.
Your account does not support viewing this document.
You need a Paid Account to view this document. Click here to change your account type.
Your account does not support viewing this document.
Set your membership
status to view this document.
With a Docket Alarm membership, you'll
get a whole lot more, including:
- Up-to-date information for this case.
- Email alerts whenever there is an update.
- Full text search for other cases.
- Get email alerts whenever a new case matches your search.
One Moment Please
The filing “” is large (MB) and is being downloaded.
Please refresh this page in a few minutes to see if the filing has been downloaded. The filing will also be emailed to you when the download completes.
Your document is on its way!
If you do not receive the document in five minutes, contact support at support@docketalarm.com.
Sealed Document
We are unable to display this document, it may be under a court ordered seal.
If you have proper credentials to access the file, you may proceed directly to the court's system using your government issued username and password.
Access Government Site
