GREGORY STANGLE
`
`IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`
`FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF PENNSYLVANIA
`
`DESTINATION MATERNITY CORPORATION,
`
`)
`
`CERTIFIED COPY
`
`Plaintiff,
`
`VS.
`
`Case No.
`
`TARGET CORPORATION, CHEROKEE,
`
`INC.
`
`2:12—CV—05680—AB
`
`
`
`and ELIZABETH LANGE, LLC.,
`
`Defendants.
`
`VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Chicago, Illinois
`
`October 4, 2013
`
`JOB 66288
`
`REPORTED BY: Tina Alfaro, RPR, CRR, RMR, CLR
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
`
`FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF PENNSYLVANIA
`
`DESTINATION MATERNITY CORPORATION,
`
`)
`
`CERTIFIED COPY
`
`Plaintiff,
`
`VS.
`
`Case No.
`
`TARGET CORPORATION, CHEROKEE,
`
`INC.
`
`2:12—CV—05680—AB
`
`
`
`and ELIZABETH LANGE, LLC.,
`
`Defendants.
`
`VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Chicago, Illinois
`
`October 4, 2013
`
`JOB 66288
`
`REPORTED BY: Tina Alfaro, RPR, CRR, RMR, CLR
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`The videotaped deposition of GREGORY STANGLE,
`
`held at the offices of Faegre Baker Daniels,
`
`to agreement before Tina M. Alfaro, a Registered
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`October 4, 2013
`
`9:38 a.m.
`
`300 South Wacker Drive, Chicago, Illinois, pursuant
`
`Professional Reporter of the State of Illinois.
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`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
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`877-702-9580
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`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`A P P E A R A N C E S:
`
`DLA PIPER
`
`BY: MICHAEL BURNS, ESQ.
`
`One Liberty Place
`
`1650 Market Street, Suite 4900
`
`Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103
`
`On behalf of the Plaintiff;
`
`On behalf of the Deponent.
`
`Corporation and Elizabeth Lange, LLC.;
`
`FAEGRE BAKER DANIELS
`
`BY: DANIEL LECHLEITER, ESQ.
`
`300 North Meridian Street, Suite 2700
`
`Indianapolis,
`
`Indiana 46204
`
`On behalf of the Defendants Target
`
`On behalf of the Defendants Target
`
`WEIMELT KNECHTEL
`
`BY: MARK WEIMELT, ESQ.
`
`Ten South LaSalle Street, Suite 3300
`
`Chicago, Illinois 60603
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`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
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`877-702-9580
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`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`I N D E X
`
`EXAMINATION
`
`WITNESS
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`By Mr. Lechleiter
`
`By Mr. Burns
`
`By Mr. Lechleiter
`
`DEPOSITION EXHIBITS
`
`EXHIBITS
`
`Exhibit 1
`
`Subpoena
`
`Exhibit 2
`
`Subpoena
`Exhibit 3
`
`
`
`Physical sample of Maternity Miracle
`
`product
`Exhibit 4
`
`Patent application
`
`Exhibit 5
`
`Office action
`
`Exhibit 6
`
`Consulting agreement
`
`Exhibit
`
`7
`
`Transcript of Gregory Stangle
`Exhibit 8
`
`Declaration in Carney—Mothers Work case
`
`Exhibit
`
`9
`
`Transcript of Elizabeth Stangle
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`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`EXHIBITS
`
`(Cont'd)
`
`DEPOSITION EXHIBITS
`
`Exhibit 10
`
`String of e—mails
`Exhibit 11
`
`Declaration in Ingrid & Isabel case
`
`Exhibit 12
`
`Letter retaining Elizabeth Stangle
`Exhibit 13
`
`Filed patent application
`
`Exhibit 14
`
`Ingrid Carney patent
`Exhibit 15
`
`Defendant Mothers Work, Inc.'s
`
`preliminary invalidity contentions
`Exhibit 16
`
`Packaging art for Maternity Miracle
`
`product
`Exhibit 17
`
`Draft patent application for Maternity
`
`Miracle product
`Exhibit 18
`
`Blown up version of figure 8
`
`
`
`Exhibit 19
`
`Invoice
`
`Exhibit 20
`
`Draft engagement letter between Gregory
`
`Stangle and Destination Maternity
`Exhibit 21
`
`Japanese patent
`
`Exhibit 22
`
`(Not described)
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`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`EXHIBITS
`
`(Cont'd)
`
`DEPOSITION EXHIBITS
`
`Exhibit 23
`
`Page from Target brief
`
`Patent application
`
`Exhibit 24
`
`(Not described)
`
`Exhibit 25
`
`(Not described)
`
`Exhibit 26
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`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We are now on the record.
`
`This marks the beginning of videotape No.
`
`l in the
`
`deposition of Gregory Stangle in the matter of
`
`Destination Maternity Corporation versus Target
`
`Corporation, Inc., et al.,
`
`in the U.S. District
`
`Court, Eastern Division of Pennsylvania, Case
`
`NO. 212—CV—05680.
`
`This deposition is being held at 300 South
`
`Wacker Drive, Chicago, Illinois on October 4, 2013,
`
`(Witness sworn.)
`
`and the time is now 9:38 a.m.
`
`Will attorneys please identify themselves.
`
`MR. LECHLEITER:
`
`I'm Dan Lechleiter here on
`
`behalf of Defendants Target Corporation and
`
`Elizabeth Lange, LLC.
`
`MR. WIEMELT: Mark Wiemelt representing Greg
`
`Stangle.
`
`MR. BURNS: Michael Burns representing
`
`Destination Maternity Corporation.
`
`THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Will the court reporter
`
`please swear in the witness.
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`WHEREUPON:
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`GREGORY STANGLE,
`
`called as a witness herein, having been first duly
`
`sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
`
`BY MR. LECHLEITER:
`
`EXAMINATION
`
`
`
`Q. Mr. Stangle, good morning.
`
`Thank you for
`
`being here today and for your time. We appreciate
`
`it.
`
`I'm Dan Lechleiter.
`
`I represent Target
`
`Corporation.
`
`I think you probably heard the
`
`attorneys sign in.
`
`I just want
`
`to go through a few
`
`preliminary rules or procedures that we'll employ
`
`today.
`
`If at any time during the deposition you
`
`need a break,
`
`just let me know.
`
`It's not a —— it's
`
`not a marathon.
`
`If you need to go to the restroom
`
`or get up and get water,
`
`that's just fine.
`
`Just let
`
`me know.
`
`From time to time your attorneys, either
`
`Mr. Wiemelt or Mr. Burns, will object to my
`
`questions. Give them time to do that. We'll try
`
`not to talk over each other. Whether it's your
`
`answering a question or me asking a question, we
`
`need to be careful so that the court reporter can
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`GREGORY STANGLE
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`get the testimony down the proper way.
`
`Are you today on any medication that would
`
`impair your ability to testify truthfully?
`
`A. No,
`
`I'm not.
`
`Q.
`
`I understand from Mr. Wiemelt that you are
`
`scheduled for some surgery starting next week out at
`
`Stanford.
`
`A. That's correct.
`
`Is that accurate?
`
`. Yes.
`
`Have you been deposed before?
`
`Yes.
`
`Q A
`
`Q A
`
`Q.
`
`Do you recall the prior cases that you were
`
`deposed in?
`
`A. Yeah.
`
`I was deposed in Mothers Work Carney
`
`
`
`Q.
`
`Do you remember when that was?
`
`A.
`
`200— —— I'd have to see a document with a
`
`date.
`
`I believe it was 2007.
`
`Q. Okay. Have you been a deponent in any
`
`other depositions?
`
`A.
`
`NO, I've not.
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`So are you generally familiar with
`
`the procedure of a deposition?
`
`Do you have
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`GREGORY STANGLE
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`recollection from that experience?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`So I'll ask questions, you'll give
`
`answers,
`
`the attorneys will object.
`
`If at any time
`
`you don't understand my question,
`
`let me know.
`
`I'll
`
`either rephrase it or the court reporter will read
`
`it back. Let's try to avoid nods of the head or
`
`yeahs or nahs.
`
`It's important that your answer's
`
`clear for the record.
`
`Tell me a little bit about your education
`
`background, where you went
`
`to college.
`
`A.
`
`I went
`
`to University of Illinois,
`
`Champaign-Urbana,
`
`I had —— I earned my Bachelor's of
`
`Science degree in accounting as an undergraduate,
`
`and then I completed my law degree at DePaul
`
`in
`
`
`
`Chicago.
`
`Q. Have you maintained your law license?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`Q. Okay. Are you currently a practicing
`
`attorney?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`I'm a practicing attorney with my own
`
`firm, and I own a couple of other businesses.
`
`Q. Okay. Let's —— let's talk about your legal
`
`experience. After law school where did you work?
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`GREGORY STANGLE
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`A.
`
`Initially the firm Ungaretti & Harris,
`
`which had been Caulfield Ungaretti & Harris. That's
`
`where I worked as a law student as well.
`
`Q. Okay. And then what did you do after
`
`that?
`
`A. Our practice group moved —— well, a number
`
`of us from our practice group moved to Rudnick &
`
`Wolfe to start their IT law practice.
`
`Q. And what did you do after that?
`
`A.
`
`I was recruited to Freeborn & Peters,
`
`worked at Freeborn & Peters for a couple years, and
`
`then Rudnick —— I was still friends with all the
`
`guys I worked with at Rudnick.
`
`I went back to
`
`Rudnick and it was at Rudnick that I finished big
`
`firm life.
`
`Q.
`
`Is Rudnick the law firm today known as
`
`
`
`A. Yeah, DLA Piper.
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`So that‘s grown over time?
`
`A. Yeah.
`
`I was there through the Piper
`
`Rudnick days.
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`A.
`
`So right before it became DLA.
`
`Q. Okay. And then you said you left to start
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`GREGORY STANGLE
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`a business?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`Q. What was that?
`
`A.
`
`A couple of businesses, actually. Another
`
`attorney and I, my best friend from law school, we
`
`started a source code escrow company, which we
`
`subsequently sold to a public company.
`
`Q. And what was that called?
`
`A.
`
`It was —— well, we sold the —— it was an
`
`asset deal. We sold the division.
`
`Company —— I
`
`like asset deals,
`
`so the company's IG2 Data
`
`Security,
`
`Inc.
`
`COURT REPORTER:
`
`I‘m sorry.
`
`You need to Slow
`
`down a little bit.
`
`It's company's ——
`
`THE WITNESS:
`
`IG2 Data Security,
`
`Inc.
`
`BY MR. LECHLEITER:
`
`Q. When did you sell IG2?
`
`A. Well,
`
`I sold a division of
`
`IG2 four years
`
`
`
`Q. Okay. And what remained —— if you sold
`
`that division, what remained of IG2?
`
`A. My data storage business ——
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`A.
`
`—— and our litigation services business and
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`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`our electronic backup business.
`
`Q. Are you still pursuing those businesses?
`
`A. We sold the data storage business last year
`
`to a company called Iron Mountain.
`
`Q. Okay. What about the remaining businesses?
`
`A.
`
`I still own the litigation services
`
`business, and I still own the electronic backup
`
`business.
`
`Q. And are those your primary pursuits
`
`professionally today?
`
`A. We run those businesses as well as we have
`
`a separate —— my partner and I have a separate law
`
`practice,
`
`IG2 Law Group, LLC.
`
`Q. What's the nature of your law practice?
`
`A. Corporate transactional, advising. We also
`
`provide mergers and acquisitions advisory services
`
`through IG2.
`
`Q.
`
`Do you provide any intellectual property
`
`
`
`young lawyer has always been transactional work and
`
`services?
`
`A.
`
`NO.
`
`Q.
`
`No patent services?
`
`A. No. My practice was and is since I was a
`
`business advice.
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`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Page 14
`
`Q. Other than your law degree, do you have any
`
`other graduate degrees?
`
`A.
`
`NO.
`
`Q.
`
`So we've asked you to come testify today ——
`
`I'm sure you've had the background of this case and
`
`I won't get into your discussions with your
`
`attorneys, but I'm sure you've had the background of
`
`this case. Are you generally familiar that the case
`
`for which we're here today at this deposition
`
`relates to maternity pants?
`
`A. Yes. And to complete my answer before
`
`you ~~ to the last question.
`
`Q.
`
`I'm sorry.
`
`
`
`A.
`
`You asked me when I left to pursue the
`
`business, Maternity Miracle was the other business I
`
`had an interest in.
`
`Q.
`
`So can you give me a little bit of the
`
`background ——
`
`A. My chair just dropped. There we go.
`
`Q.
`
`I do want to talk about
`
`the Maternity
`
`Miracle,
`
`the background of that business venture.
`
`Can you walk me through how that came to be,
`
`just
`
`give me the background of that venture?
`
`A.
`
`Sure.
`
`So my younger sister is —— she at
`
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`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Page 15 .
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`‘
`
`the time —— in 2001 she was pregnant with her first
`
`child, my nephew Alec.
`
`So she‘s very much into
`
`clothes,
`
`fashion, and she was complaining that she
`
`was going to have —— she‘s very thin and she was
`
`starting to show and she didn't want to wear
`
`maternity clothing.
`
`So she was interested in trying
`
`to figure out a way that she could avoid having to
`
`buy maternity clothes because she viewed them as
`
`being unfashionable, kind of frumpy.
`
`So she was —— I'm close to my sister, we
`
`talked all the time.
`
`She would constantly complain
`
`about it.
`
`She was trying to figure out, you know,
`
`if she could —— if there was a way to come up with
`
`an accessory so she could keep using her regular
`
`prepregnancy clothing.
`
`So that‘s how we began
`
`working on the project.
`
`Q.
`
`For the record, what is your sister's
`
`name?
`
`
`
`A.
`
`Elizabeth Stangle Rodriguez.
`
`Q. And do you refer to her as Liz?
`
`A. Liz, yeah.
`
`Q. Okay. Once you began to have the idea,
`
`what steps did you take to then pursue the
`
`business?
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`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`A. Well, we took the normal steps you would
`
`take to pursue any business. We experimented with
`
`coming up with a product that would meet
`
`the need
`
`that we were trying to achieve, which was different
`
`configurations for an accessory or, you know, what
`
`ultimately became the Maternity Miracle product, a
`
`band that a woman could wear around her waist so
`
`that if, you know, her jeans or her skirt or
`
`whatever, you know, bottoms were getting too tight
`
`and she couldn't button the top button or, you know,
`
`somehow close the top button with the snap or
`
`whatever it was,
`
`then this accessory would allow her
`
`to continue wearing them and still keep the clothing
`
`intact and not have an —— and not
`
`leave her
`
`
`
`exposed.
`
`Q.
`
`How did she come up with the idea of the
`
`band?
`
`A. Well, she didn't come up with the idea of
`
`the band. We both came up with the idea of the
`
`band.
`
`It was trial and error.
`
`She initially had an
`
`idea for an accessory, a band that had different ~~
`
`that was open at the end, at both ends, and it would
`
`close with either tabs or Velcro or other kinds of
`
`fasteners. And then ultimately we thought it was
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`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Page 17
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`better to have a product that was completely closed,
`
`more like a tube top kind of product.
`
`Q.
`
`So when you say closed or unclosed at both
`
`ends,
`
`if we‘re thinking about a tube,
`
`that would be
`
`if you slice the tube and had hooks or latches or
`
`something to connect
`
`the ends?
`
`A. Right. And that's exactly the kind of
`
`product that we were trying to avoid. We wanted
`
`something that was basically one piece all the way
`
`around.
`
`Q. And did you construct any prototypes of
`
`that product?
`
`A. We did, several prototypes.
`
`Q. And around what
`
`time did you start
`
`constructing prototypes?
`
`A.
`
`2001.
`
`
`
`Q.
`
`How did you go about doing that?
`
`A. We —— my grandmother had been in the
`
`fashion industry for many years.
`
`She was retired.
`
`She had worked as part of a design team and she was
`
`a very good seamstress.
`
`She could sew anything.
`
`So
`
`we had her assist us with creating the prototype
`
`products.
`
`Q. Did you direct her in creating the
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`GREGORY STANGLE
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`prototypes?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`
`
`Q. And so what steps did you take then to
`
`actually go from idea to physical
`
`item?
`
`A.
`
`Q.
`
`Can you elaborate what steps did I take?
`
`Sure.
`
`So if you —— you provided your
`
`grandmother with kind of your idea. What did she,
`
`I
`
`guess, produce as the first prototype?
`
`A.
`
`It's a long -— it's been a long time.
`
`I'd
`
`have to look at my notes from the last case,
`
`the
`
`last deposition to give you a chronology, but I can
`
`tell you there were a number of prototypes.
`
`Some,
`
`like I said, had hook—and—eye closures.
`
`They were
`
`all —— they were all band—type products.
`
`So they
`
`would go around the person's waist,
`
`the female's
`
`waist, and they would attach at the ends with either
`
`the hook and eye that I just mentioned or Velcro or
`
`button or snap, conventional clothing fasteners.
`
`Q. Right.
`
`A.
`
`So my grandmother made different prototypes
`
`for,
`
`I believe, each of those variations.
`
`Q. And this was in the 2001, 2002 time
`
`frame?
`
`A. Exactly.
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`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Q.
`
`Now, at some point did you develop a
`
`prototype that didn't have snaps or fasteners, it
`
`was one piece?
`
`A. Yes, we did.
`
`
`
`Q. And how did that come about?
`
`A. We
`
`-— my grandmother, one of the prototypes
`
`she made toward the end was sewing together both of
`
`the ends.
`
`So it was just one continuous piece, but
`
`there was a seam where the two ends connected and
`
`that was —— the idea of a one—piece garment was
`
`attractive to us, but the seam was not attractive.
`
`So she created the prototype with the seam, and then
`
`later we had a prototype created by a manufacturer
`
`without a seam.
`
`Q.
`
`I see. Was this a special type of
`
`manufacturer or manufacturing process that enabled
`
`you to have a seamless garment?
`
`A. There are certain kinds of machines that
`
`will create a seamless garment. We identified a
`
`machine called a Santoni machine that would create a
`
`seamless garment and that‘s what was used for
`
`ours.
`
`Q. And the Santoni machine, was that something
`
`that you developed or was that known in the
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`GREGORY STANGLE
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`industry?
`
`A.
`
`Q.
`
`It was known in the industry.
`
`So it was —— you went out and found
`
`somebody who could provide you use of that machine
`
`or would use it to make your product?
`
`A.
`
`I found a manufacturer that owned a Santoni
`
`machine that could manufacture the product for me.
`
`Q. And you contracted with them to do that?
`
`A. That's correct.
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`
`
`MR. LECHLEITER: Let's go ahead and mark
`
`Exhibit 1.
`
`(Deposition Exhibit 1 was marked
`
`as requested.)
`
`BY MR. LECHLEITER:
`
`Q. Mr. Stangle, have you seen what the court
`
`reporter has marked as Exhibit
`
`1 before?
`
`A.
`
`I believe I have.
`
`Q. And what is Exhibit 1?
`
`A. This appears to be the subpoena to testify.
`
`Q. And are you testifying here today pursuant
`
`to this subpoena?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`MR. LECHLEITER: This is NO. 2.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Page 21:
`
`(Deposition Exhibit 2 was marked
`
`as requested.)
`
`BY MR. LECHLEITER:
`
`Q. Mr. Stangle, you have in front of you what
`
`the court reporter has marked as Exhibit 2. Have
`
`you seen this document before?
`
`A.
`
`I believe I have.
`
`Q. And what is Exhibit 2?
`
`
`
`A.
`
`Subpoena to produce documents,
`
`information,
`
`or objects or to permit inspection of premises in a
`
`civil action.
`
`Q. And is this the subpoena that Target served
`
`on you in this case?
`
`A.
`
`I believe it is.
`
`Q.
`
`So if you could turn to page A-ll of
`
`Exhibit 2.
`
`You can see on page A—ll there are
`
`various requests for production starting with No. I.
`
`Have you seen these requests for production before?
`
`A.
`
`I'm looking at them.
`
`I believe I have.
`
`Q. Were these requests for production provided
`
`to you by Mr. Wiemelt?
`
`MR. WIEMELT: Wiemelt, by the way.
`
`MR. LECHLEITER:
`
`I'm sorry. Apologize.
`
`MR. WIEMELT:
`
`It's fine.
`
`No problem.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`BY THE WITNESS:
`
`A.
`
`I honestly don't recall if they were
`
`provided directly to me or through Mr. Wiemelt.
`
`Q. But you have seen these before?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`Q. And based on these requests, did you search
`
`your files to find responsive information to the
`
`requests?
`
`A. Well,
`
`I believe what happened is I was
`
`requested to produce this information, and all ——
`
`these are all very old items and they‘re all in
`
`
`
`storage and it would be quite a process for me to go
`
`through and dig through the storage to do it.
`
`So I
`
`contacted Mr. Wiemelt and that's how I believe he
`
`came in contact with you.
`
`Q. And did Mr. Wiemelt provide us with
`
`responsive information to these requests;
`
`is that
`
`your understanding?
`
`A. You'd have to ask Mr. Wiemelt.
`
`Q. Did he represent to you that he would
`
`provide us with responsive information to the
`
`requests?
`
`A.
`
`I believe —— I don't want to get into
`
`privilege here. Did he provide you with
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Page 23
`
`information?
`
`I mean, are you asking did he provide
`
`you with information?
`
`Q. Well,
`
`I'm asking you if —— did you provide
`
`this information in response to these requests; do
`
`you recall that?
`
`A. Mr. Wiemelt had all —— had my information
`
`from the previous matter.
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`
`
`A.
`
`Q.
`
`So that's my response.
`
`Sure. But you did not endeavor to conduct
`
`an additional search at this time with respect to
`
`these requests?
`
`A. Did I endeavor? You mean did I begin to
`
`conduct a search?
`
`Q. Did you go to storage and look in your
`
`files to respond to these requests?
`
`A.
`
`I looked in files initially, but then when
`
`I didn't have the information, it became clear to me
`
`it was scattered and it was in storage and it was
`
`going to be difficult to find.
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`So it may still be in storage
`
`today?
`
`A. Yeah, potentially.
`
`Q.
`
`You mentioned earlier that your sister and
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE‘.
`
`you had come up with the idea of the Maternity
`
`Miracle together. What was the chronology of the
`
`Stangle Products,
`
`Inc. business that you mentioned?
`
`When did it start? When did it end?
`
`A.
`
`The Stangle Products,
`
`Inc. business
`
`commenced —— the corporate entity was formed after
`
`we had begun working on the product itself.
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`A.
`
`So we worked —— we had the idea for the
`
`
`
`product initially —— my sister had the idea for a
`
`product initially.
`
`I began to assist my sister. We
`
`decided we would go into business together to create
`
`and then commercialize a product, which naturally
`
`led to forming an entity.
`
`Q. Okay. And so you pursued your business for
`
`some period of time, but you didn't pursue it
`
`indefinitely.
`
`It ended at some point.
`
`So what was
`
`the —- about when did it end?
`
`A.
`
`It ended,
`
`I want to say, around the end of
`
`2002,
`
`I believe.
`
`Q. Okay. Why did it —— why did it come to an
`
`ends?
`
`A.
`
`The primary reason was because my sister ——
`
`my sister's husband is from Argentina, and they were
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`moving to Buenos Aires, Argentina.
`
`Q.
`
`So did you make a determination that the
`
`business wouldn't be viable with her being out of
`
`the country?
`
`A.
`
`It was going to be difficult to run the
`
`business with her out of the country. And as I
`
`mentioned earlier,
`
`I had other business interests
`
`that took up my time. This was not a full—time
`
`thing for me.
`
`
`
`Q.
`
`So I have here what
`
`I believe Mr. Wiemelt
`
`provided as a copy of —— or a version, rather, of
`
`the Maternity Miracle physical product.
`
`I don't
`
`think we can submit it to the record. We could mark
`
`it as an exhibit,
`
`I think. We'll go ahead and
`
`discuss it on the record as an exhibit number.
`
`(Deposition Exhibit 3 was marked
`
`as requested.)
`
`MR. BURNS:
`
`Should we show it to the camera?
`
`MR. LECHLEITER: We will.
`
`BY MR. LECHLEITER:
`
`Q. Mr. Stangle, I've handed you what has been
`
`marked as Exhibit 3, which is a physical sample of
`
`the Maternity Miracle product.
`
`Is that an accurate
`
`physical sample of the Maternity Miracle product?
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`A. Yes, it appears to be.
`
`Q. Looking at that Maternity Miracle,
`
`is that
`
`intended to sell with your business or was this a
`
`prototype ——
`
`A. Yes. This appears to be —— no. This
`
`appears to be the final version that was produced.
`
`Q. Would you mind holding that up for the
`
`camera so the camera can see it.
`
`So can you describe how this was to be born
`
`by the wearer?
`
`A.
`
`Sure. This was to be worn around the waist
`
`area.
`
`It would be put on either by pulling it ——
`
`the woman would pull it over her head and then down
`
`over the waist
`
`(gesturing) or step into it, you
`
`know, feet first and then pull it up and then it
`
`would be worn about the waist.
`
`Q. And was that —— was that the only size of
`
`the Maternity Miracle you had manufactured?
`
`A. This was the final size that we had
`
`manufactured.
`
`the final version of the product that you would have
`
`
`
`Q. Did you have other sizes manufactured?
`
`A.
`
`I think the —— I recall that the prototypes
`
`we had manufactured varied in size.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Q. And do you recall the variances?
`
`A.
`
`I don‘t recall the measurements.
`
`I do
`
`recall that some were probably larger and some were
`
`smaller.
`
`Q.
`
`So I‘m going to hand you a ruler.
`
`If you
`
`wouldn't mind laying that flat,
`
`just kind of
`
`smoothing it out. Would you mind measuring it to
`
`give us the general dimensions of the tube laying
`
`flat.
`
`A. About 12 inches.
`
`Q.
`
`Is that 12 inches wide?
`
`
`
`A. Yes, 12 inches wide. Actually d— well, it
`
`tapers.
`
`So if you want me to measure it at the top
`
`where it's at its widest —~
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`A.
`
`—— it would be 12 inches.
`
`It tapers down
`
`in the middle.
`
`Q. Okay. And what's the approximate middle
`
`dimension?
`
`A.
`
`11 and one~half inches.
`
`Q. And then the bottom dimension?
`
`A.
`
`12 .
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`So is it approximately the same
`
`dimension at the top and the bottom,
`
`12 inches in
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`both instances?
`
`A. Based on how I just measured it, yes. Keep
`
`in mind this is a stretchy elastic material.
`
`I
`
`don't know how this has been used.
`
`Q.
`
`Sure.
`
`Would you mind measuring the height.
`
`A.
`
`Sure.
`
`Six and one—quarter inches.
`
`Q. And will that height be the same
`
`
`
`throughout?
`
`A.
`
`In the center six and one—quarter. At
`
`the
`
`opposite end six and one—quarter.
`
`Q.
`
`Do you know why you would have selected
`
`those particular dimensions?
`
`A. We would have selected these dimensions
`
`based on our feedback or our impressions with the
`
`different prototype sizes so that we could have ——
`
`our goal was to have a product that was one size.
`
`Q. One size fits all?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`Q.
`
`Now,
`
`in thinking about a one size fits all
`
`product, would that product sit in different places
`
`on different wearers as a result of different wearer
`
`size differences?
`
`A.
`
`It could.
`
`I would imagine it would based
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`on the individual wearer's body proportions.
`
`Q.
`
`So if you had a one—size—fits—all Maternity
`
`Miracle, it would vary by wearer?
`
`A. What would vary by wearer?
`
`Q. Where it sat on the wearer, where it was
`
`located.
`
`A.
`
`I think there would be —— my opinion is
`
`there would be some variance as to how it would sit
`
`or where it would sit on the wearer, but the object
`
`of the product and where it would most definitely
`
`sit would be to cover an unfastened lower clothing
`
`article, so pants, skirt, short.
`
`So it would have
`
`to be around the opening. And then how far it
`
`stretched thereafter would depend on the
`
`individual's body.
`
`Q.
`
`In selecting those dimensions, did you have
`
`an average size wearer in mind as kind of the middle
`
`ground or the median?
`
`A.
`
`I don't specifically recall having an
`
`
`
`average size wearer in mind. We wanted to appeal to
`
`the masses.
`
`So if that —- if that means the same
`
`thing,
`
`then yes, but I don't recall that we had a
`
`specific —— whether we said, you know,
`
`the average
`
`wearer is this dimension.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877—702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Q.
`
`So was this selection of dimensions based
`
`respect to her body?
`
`A. Well, my sister's view, and then we had
`
`input from others as well.
`
`Q. And who were those people?
`
`primarily on your sister's view on what worked with
`
`
`
`A. My cousin's wife wore the product during
`
`her pregnancy. We also solicited information —— or
`
`opinions on the product from other people my sister
`
`was friends with in California. And I believe my
`
`cousin‘s wife also obtained feedback from some of
`
`her friends who were pregnant or had had children.
`
`Q. And what was their feedback, do you recall?
`
`A.
`
`The feedback generally was positive about
`
`the product itself. Women seemed to like it.
`
`Q. Did they provide feedback regarding the
`
`size or fit of the garment?
`
`A. That was one of the things that we asked.
`
`We were interested in feedback regarding all aspects
`
`of the product.
`
`So I don‘t recall specific feedback
`
`as to, again, dimensions, it was a long time ago,
`
`but I know that we arrived at this particular size
`
`based on our impression of what would appeal to the
`
`masses as far as women were concerned.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Q. Okay.
`
`So you designed that to appeal
`
`to
`
`pregnant women generally?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`
`
`Q.
`
`Is it —— is it meant
`
`to be worn at all
`
`stages of pregnancy?
`
`A. Well, it's meant to be worn as long as the
`
`wearer wishes to wear it, but the sweet spot was
`
`really early stages of pregnancy.
`
`So when a woman
`
`gets pregnant and she starts to —— she starts to
`
`expand a little bit,
`
`she starts to show,
`
`then that's
`
`when clothing becomes an issue.
`
`So the idea was
`
`that this would be worn early and then —— you know,
`
`every woman is different.
`
`Some will get larger and
`
`others won‘t.
`
`Some will just have the bump and
`
`others will, you know, get larger in other areas.
`
`So the idea was that this would start ——
`
`the wearing of this product would start early on in
`
`pregnancy and then hopefully continue through a
`
`lengthy path of pregnancy, but with each woman that
`
`would vary.
`
`Q.
`
`In terms of how long they wore it?
`
`A.
`
`How they could —— how long they were able
`
`to wear it, yeah.
`
`Q.
`
`Do you see a tag on the inside of the
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Page 32
`
`Maternity Miracle that's Exhibit 3,
`
`the white tag in
`
`there?
`
`A. Yes,
`
`I do.
`
`Q. Does that tag state a material
`
`
`
`composition?
`
`A . Yes .
`
`Q. What is that?
`
`A.
`
`95 percent microfiber nylon,
`
`5 percent
`
`Spandex.
`
`Q.
`
`So how did you arrive —— do you recall how
`
`you arrived at that material composition?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`It was also through trial and error.
`
`Actually sourcing ~— looking at and touching
`
`different types of fabrics, making some prototypes
`
`with different types of fabrics, and then just going
`
`with the one that we felt was going to do the best
`
`job.
`
`Q. Did you ever —— do you recall did you ever
`
`increase or decrease the percentage Spandex?
`
`A. Well, we -— we weren't making the fabrics.
`
`So we were just buying fabrics, existing fabrics,
`
`and different fabrics with —— we knew the properties
`
`that we wanted for the fabric.
`
`So we were —— we
`
`knew it had to have some elasticity, had to be
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877—702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`resilient, comfortable, soft,
`
`feel luxurious, not
`
`feel cheap.
`
`80 we didn't really —— we didn't
`
`consciously play with the percentages of fabrics,
`
`but we tried different fabrics that had different
`
`compositions of materials.
`
`Q. Does the percentage shown on that tag, does
`
`that represent what you ultimately determined to be
`
`the best composition for your purpose?
`
`A. Yes.
`
`
`
`Q.
`
`So when you had the different materials
`
`that you were sampling, were you aware of their
`
`different percentages for each sample?
`
`A.
`
`I believe we were, yes.
`
`Q. And then based on those samples, were you
`
`able to direct the manufacturer to create a garment
`
`with those percentages on the tag?
`
`A.
`
`I don't recall that it was so much
`
`percentage driven.
`
`I think it was more —— my
`
`recollection is that the fabric selection process
`
`was more -— it was more subjective.
`
`So it wasn't ——
`
`again, it wasn't that we were, you know,
`
`so fixed on
`
`the percentage of Spandex or microfiber, whatever
`
`other products were in there.
`
`Some of the products also,
`
`some of the
`
`TSG Reporting ~ Worldwide
`
`877—702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Page 34
`
`materials,
`
`they use trade names and there would be a
`
`percentage of a trade named fabric, but then that
`
`fabric might be composed of other materials.
`
`So you
`
`couldn't just go by straight percentages.
`
`I
`
`didn't —— we didn't tell him we wanted ultimately
`
`this particular percentage composition and they
`
`loomed the fabric for us. We just told them what
`
`fabric we liked and it happened to have this
`
`percentage.
`
`Q.
`
`I see.
`
`
`
`So you mentioned a minute ago that the
`
`fabric composition selection was subjective.
`
`Can
`
`you elaborate on that a little bit? What do you
`
`mean? Subjective to who?
`
`A. Subjective to my sister and me. We —— we
`
`were interested in a fabric, as I mentioned a moment
`
`ago,
`
`that was elastic,
`
`that was comfortable,
`
`resilient, soft, and felt like it was a quality a-
`
`quality material, quality product.
`
`So that was the
`
`subjective part. That was just our opinion.
`
`Q. And is that —— I think I asked you this
`
`earlier and I apologize.
`
`Is that a true and
`
`accurate sample of the Maternity Miracle product?
`
`A.
`
`It appears to be, yes.
`
`TSG Reporting - Worldwide
`
`877—702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`Q. Any reason to believe otherwise?
`
`A. No.
`
`Q. Are there other samples still in existence,
`
`are you aware?
`
`A. Yes,
`
`there are.
`
`Q. And where would those be?
`
`A. They're probably in my mother's basement or
`
`in storage if she doesn‘t have them anymore.
`
`I
`
`don't know.
`
`I haven‘t seen them in years.
`
`Q. Would it be possible to obtain additional
`
`
`
`samples?
`
`A.
`
`I could try.
`
`Q. We may request that, but we can talk about
`
`that off the record.
`
`A. Okay.
`
`You can make that request to my
`
`attorney.
`
`MR. LECHLEITER: This will be Exhibit 4.
`
`THE WITNESS: Shall I just keep the exhibits in
`
`a pile here, or do you want
`
`them back?
`
`MR. LECHLEITER:
`
`You can just set them off to
`
`the side, and if we need to go back to them, we
`
`will.
`
`(Deposition Exhibit 4 was marked
`
`as requested.)
`
`TSG Reponing - Worldwide
`
`877-702-9580
`
`
`
`GREGORY STANGLE
`
`BY MR. LECHLEITER:
`
`Q.
`
`So, Mr. Stangle, what you have in front of
`
`you is what
`
`the court reporter has marked as
`
`Exhibit 4.
`
`Do you know what Exhibit 4
`
`is?
`
`A. United States patent application, a sleeve
`
`for clothing coverage and support, written by me,
`
`with my sister and me as named inventors.
`
`Q. And did you —— when you say written by you,
`
`did you draft the patent application?
`
`A.
`
`I drafted —~
`
`I did not draft the claims.
`
`Q. But you drafted the specifications?
`
`A.
`
`I drafted the —— yeah.
`
`I drafted the --
`
`yeah.
`
`I think —— I did the —— yeah.
`
`I did the
`
`first draft of everything up to the claims.
`
`I
`
`believe my attorney probably revised the front part
`
`and drafted the claims for me.
`
`Q. And did you —— did you draft the drawings
`
`as well?
`
`
`
`A.
`
`I —— no,
`
`I did not do the dr
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